11.1.2022 City Council - Committee on Public Works & Transportation

thank you

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meeting on public works and transportations will come to order take the clerk take the roll please yeah here pursuant to the open meeting law any person may make an audio or video recording of this public meeting or may transmit the meeting through any medium attendees are therefore advised as such recordings or Transmissions are being made whether perceived or unperceived by those present and are deemed

acknowledged and permissible do we have any City do we have any citizens input

I'm sorry

okay number two order for curb removal 102 Laurel Street referred on 6 14 22.

Council Pelletier there any objections here tonight yeah are there any opponents to the curb cut at 102 Laurel Street are there any proponents

excuse me you can come sit by your table state your name and address for the record please Arab you know my driveway it's right from a bus stop and we are trying to cut on administry and that's the reason why for the curb cut because I don't have enough space to praka in the situation in the situation today which I tried to back up on my driveway the bus came she saw me with

the lights on to back up and she didn't stop she stopped right on my side but she didn't let me park in so it's very hard for me to to even Park on my driveway in front of a bus stop and that's the reason why we want to cut cut the garbage so if you had the curb cut on Laurel Street would you not use the Aetna Street side anymore or would you be abusing both now

my my my backyard is on atmosphere I cannot by any meaning go into my backyard through lower Street and I have I have cars sometimes I I can't even access my backyard through Laurie Street and that's the reason why we want to put a cop car in there not the matter of just be parking over there every day but at least to get access into my my my yard okay Council palliative you wasn't home

I rang the bell and everything but anyway just to let you know once the bus goes by and he's in front of your driveway he can't back up anyway they're not allowed to back up first of all but uh what you got on Aetna Street it's I take a perfect place for it I open the fence I peeked in the yard I got a big driveway there and to me uh there's no houses on that side

to our businesses and when I go about it there's not that many the park in the street anyway so I don't see any reason why we shouldn't give it to her and make it much easier when the buses are running and I guess you could still use uh Laro Street if you have to weakens and everything else uh how many cars can you put in the backyard about six about six yeah yeah

about six I do have I do have a business which uh it's a construction business and most of the time I use I I already have a gate in there the matter that I cannot say no parking in here like if you went over there two days ago for the past two weeks it has been a trail over that that wasn't even registered he was using the back of my van to to put the

plates because he didn't have stickers on his trailer but he was blocking my gate so I couldn't ask him to move because I cannot put a No Parking here because I don't have a car in India and I couldn't go into my yard to take it off the construction stuff for anything like that it's not that I'm gonna be using to go back and forth every day but I I would like to have

well to me it makes sense to have it anyway so I don't know if there's anybody ever opposed to it but uh I think it makes sense so I yield for now can we ask Mrs Ferreira to join us also um so you had a trailer parked on the street in front of your house that that's on the curb cut that I need that's what I put the gate but well I I

guess my point is if I'm not mistaken trailers aren't supposed to be parked on the street overnight that's not a trailer that's a camping trailer so oh that camping yeah a camping trailer I apologize for me okay all right thanks counselor Kadeem I was going to ask a question but I think I got the answer already um so I was going to ask if we do would you still look for a curb

cut uh if we if we remove the or move the bus stop I won't be able to go to my yard anyway s so you regardless if the bus stop gets moved you would still want the carpet okay all right yields this is forever 2016 just um spoke what I was going to say that bus stop should not be there um I think that when this driveway was done the the curb cut here or whatever

that bus stop should go forms into the corner so I'm going to check the ordinance um of this location and see what happened here because our bus stop should not be that close to a driveway because if they're picking up passengers or whatever it blocks the whole driveway so I'll definitely look into that and if it has to be moved we'll move it okay so whether she would get the curb cut or

not this is still something you would pursue definitely with that I will take a look for the 14 feet on Edna Street with a motion by Council Peltier second Council Kadeem all in favor aye any opposed ice habit you're all set number three it was a resolution administrator of community utilities be invited to Committee on Public Works and transportation meeting to discuss solutions to the flooding issues on

Anderson Street tabled 9 14 21.

motion to take it off the table second a motion Council second Council kadim all in favor hi hi pose not opposed is set him for the same um there were two resolutions written by two different people but yes they're essentially the same so can I make a motion to take on 14 7.

so I'll lift motion lifts well I'll take them together for us all in favor okay so that passes second emotional lift made by Council Kadeem seconded by constipated all in favor aye I'll post motion passes now I know the last time that we were here there was a discussion and Mr Ferlin was supposed to walk the brook behind Anderson Street to see I guess how that what kind of effect that has if

there could be any uh help from so that was the last time that I was here uh the council asked me to walk what's known as Southern Brook so I walked suck a brook pretty much from the Stafford Road where it comes in a new Staffing road comes down crosses Lark Street uh continues down behind uh Anderson Street uh Nightingale and Robin for those dead and uh it continues all through there it's a pretty defined

Channel through that whole entire way uh pretty prickery to get through and get to the actual Channel but it is a pretty uh defined Channel through that whole entire area the one spot where it starts to disperse off very well is further down next to the uh 994 Jefferson Street complex so that's where it starts to go into that Wetland if you want I could give you a little overview of the Watershed I

didn't do any power points tonight because I know sometimes you like them sometimes you know but I figured I'd stick with my boards tonight and then we can get further again but uh essentially so this is all Fall River up in this area uh tipping and down in this area over here uh sucker Brook comes so this is Staffing Pond underneath this purple area soccer Brook essentially comes from

Stafford Pond there's a dam on Staffing Pond comes down through this area and then out into south of pond excuse me was Anderson Street in relation to this tree is right over in this area okay right in the thick of it yep exactly so right where everything started to come down into that area so there's actually two uh primary watersheds that feed them in you have the stack and pond Watershed uh and the

discharge that comes off the damaged staff and pond as well as this whole entire uh sucker Brook watershed area so this whole time mapping was just done we defined all these different drainage areas that go into Southwest Upper Pond when we were just doing the southwest of the pond study so this Maps out what those drainage areas are and what the contributed areas are as I slipped to this this was one of the

outcomes actually of that uh Blue Water Project that we did forced out for a couple Pond as you know Southwest of pot has an algae issue we've been looking at that over recent years we were able to get a grant to start to do some preliminary studies and we kind of looked at all the different watersheds that fed down into it and what the areas are how we can benefit

Southwest up a pond but an offshoot of that was also potentially how we could benefit some flooding areas that come down into South with pepper pond this whole entire rendition was uh was done up as a potential uh solution um to get nutrients and phosphates out of the water that run through suckerberg so suckerberg so Stafford Pond is way back here over here is Southward upper Pond this is Atlantic Charter School

right in this area uh and then Stafford Road is actually just off the map over here all right 50 Anderson Street is this property right here so again sucker Brook defined Channel comes down onto Stafford Road uh comes through I believe this is Mark street that comes through here and then continues down I said like I said at the fine Channel through this area over here the yellow Lodge

contributing area that we have too that comes down into this general area is from the south so as far back as uh Hancock Street there's a there's a channel that comes this way and comes into this area to join stuck a brook to head over to into Southwest of the pond through our integrated plan that we did back in 2015 some of the improvements in this area that were noted was to raise

Dickinson Street and increase the covet size underneath Dickerson street that was done with Atlantis Charter School built their school that was done by the school Spencer Street and allowed to the covet under there last year in September 2nd of 2001 we had a heavy rainstorm that actually washed that couple out on Spencer Street and we went in did an emergency repair and lodged that Cullman at that time

so this whole entire what this is showing you here um is a project that we identified uh during the Blue Water Project it takes and it revitalizes all of this Wetland that so that Wetland right now if you've been down by the 994 Jefferson Street complex so off to the right after you make that turn it's a lot of uh invasive species in the plants and stuff a lot of sediment

buildup that that's in that whole entire Wetland area that isn't conducive to help either the flow or the water quality in southwest of the pond I imagine it doesn't help drainage either correct exactly so all that sediment gets built up in that area the sediments there doesn't allow the water to come in use it as a flood plain and then allow it to drain out so what we're looking at is to

you know turn this area into more of a wetland floodplain area to be used for storage as it discharges out the benefits that we get again is phosphorus and nitrogen removal so this was done through the uh Southwest type of project we do currently have an MVP Grant which we're going to be working on permitting and design of this project along with three other projects in relation to South watapa that permitting design

phase be about a year and a half so the MVP program actually provided us the funding the council provided with the Bristol County Alpha funds provided us the match for that for that project and I was just made aware that Bristol economy did approve the use of those funds so so we'll be starting the Design Within this area as to you know Indians Anderson Street Endicott comes down Anderson runs

down this way that property uh 50 Anderson Street is a very very low property it's actually within the FEMA flood maps the almost the entire property so you know that is kind of a low point in that area so what happens is when you get a heavy rainstorm again the water comes down through sucker Brook uses every area that it can as a flood plain and that property uh just so happens to

be one you know I don't miss the ball the resident of that property has made uh you know use the the garage a detached garage that's higher in elevation I believe he just told me that he finished closing off his garage that went into the house to block any water from garage because that was primarily where he had the flow from you know the other issue that we always have and this is

always talks to me about it uh the winters and Cloud trucks go down plow in the snow I make sure that the sewer deposit goes out there now to uh you know as we're doing catch basins and stuff that's one of their spots that they stopped to make sure that the end of the streets cleared well that's kind of a broad overview where we are for funding for this project this was identified as

potentially five to seven million dollar project I'm hoping that potentially uh floodplain management through FEMA or Hazard mitigation Grant programs through FEMA maybe a future option for a permit for construction so again we're looking at this project there is a current uh a current release out for those Grant applications we're not going to be far enough along with this project to make this one but they

are coming out with another round really soon so uh you know this is one project we're going to keep moving forward again and that's uh should you know that's planning to improve the old tight Watershed as it comes down Council tells you um you know I've just been kicking around for a while an innocent Street and they get the complaints that are always flooding and we had mentioned maybe we could buy the

property but I don't know if that was an option or not but you know the administration in you are you trying to get the money for it but where is the administration fit with this you got that Anderson you got the Stafford Square and you've got uh Grinnell Street in Jefferson so I mean they're just sitting there they get flooded all the time I mean how long before we addressed it the guy from

the end of the street must have been here three four times and you're still not getting anywhere to be honest with you yeah I think Mr Barlow's probably been uh very vocal about the flooding issue there since oh yes it has been it has been uh some time but again you know um as you know in our department for funding we're always trying to balance of the affordability uh in being able to fund and and do

these projects um back in 2017 uh you know we finished up with some CSO work uh then we went into a separate authorization in 2017 which which laid out a number of projects that were priority at that time and that's the projects that we're currently moving forward on you know these projects again unforgotten but again it's a balancing of the affordability for the rate payers in the ability to be able to do these

projects and fund these projects so you know again one of the things that I'm uh that I you know um I think grants are a great thing especially in Fall River where uh usually at the top tier um due to our economic status within the city um but it it does take time without a doubt I just think it takes too much time especially the people waiting now when they allow like Jefferson Street

down there to build I mean why did they even let him build that they know they're going to be a problem same thing on on Anderson Street they must have knew it was going to be a problem yeah you know that it becomes our problem your problem is and the money problem when the city's problem I mean you know it's not right it should be uh watch out where they get to

permissible and uh signing off to make sure these places won't get flooded you know yeah even around coupon we had trouble with that too as well and and uh you know we got fixed a little bit a little bit we went there several times to square it away it seems to be fairly squared away now to get a new street but it's one thing after another where's the money come but I think the department

heads that should go down check it out and and if it's not right to bill you don't bill would that are you the city Engineers here I'd like to have him also join us at the table thank you just in your presentation so the the work that's going to be done using the MVP Grant yes are the engineers saying that once that's fixed that's going to minimize the flooding on Anderson Street or it'll better it'll

benefit the Anderson Street area is that going to fix you know every rainstorm that's there probably not but uh the idea is that it'll add additional flood plain capacity Downstream from where Anderson is to allow that area to fill up with water rather than stream Anderson Street my other question is and I know it's somewhat not really aligned with the conversation that we're having but the um

so the areas that you've got highlighted so the mills in that area were they ever dumping any any of that waste water into those systems so I'm just curious to see if there's any contamination in there you know uh the Mills that are down in that area that's an old bleachery um you know back in the 1800s when there was no sewer system in the city I would imagine that there was some types of

discharges that is something that we're going to have to look at for what contaminants are in that area and through the design process that'll be identified and that's why there's kind of a big swing of the construction cost all right and the only the only reason I asked was because obviously with the Brownfield grants available through you know you could leverage that and then maybe potentially do some additional

design work or improve improved okay great uh for anyone who doesn't know me my name is Dan aguiar I'm the city engineer I was asked to come this evening I think just for item number six but they're all kind of in the same general realm so if I could add this I heard Council of Pelletier ask a question about how things get permitted over time and and what happens as we you know progress

through time I've been here since January Paul has been here much longer and has been dealing with these situations I think it's pretty well known worldwide the increase in storm events so when we have drainage systems that are designed for a certain rainfall intensity and by that I mean a certain amount of inches over a certain period of time it's been well documented around the 2010-ish time when we had the real

big rainstorm with the mountain hope the the rainfall intensities that have been incurring we don't get an inch of rain today an inch of rain tomorrow an inch of rain Thursday we're getting four inches of rain in three hours storms like that that drainage systems are not designed for these Antiquated drainage systems as well as the natural drainage systems like like a brook so the drainage situation that everyone is

seeing here it's not specific to the city of Fall River it's to the world because the rainfall patterns and how things get designed are done much differently under current standards for site plan review and different types of building permitting processes the the committee and the council has put together site plan review and those types of things to take a closer look at this stuff when things get constructed

so over time as things get built people create more impervious surfaces and more driveways to Park bigger houses that that leaves less land for water to be absorbed into the ground now this situation where we have a downstream flooding area which is the Wetland that Mr furland was talking about yes as that fills up with sediment it's like if you take a bathtub and you fill the bottom four inches with sand

and you turn your faucet on that that tub will now hold less water than it would when it's empty so as all of this water comes out of the faucet which is let's say sucker Brook is the faucet feeding into this bathtub of of the downgradient Wetland when you're starting with a situation where the bottom of that bathtub is already a quarter of the way full that's less water to hit the tub so once

you wanted to put that same amount of water or more because of the increase in Rain once you hit the top of the tub the water is going to overflow it's going to overflow the banks of Sucker Brook it's going to overflow any Street or catch Basin so moving forward we do need to upgrade upgrade all the storm water management systems that we have you know in our streets but that comes at a great

cost as as Paul well knows I've looked at the numbers and some of the estimates that he's had by different consultants and and these are estimates that were put together quite a few years ago we may find that they're even drastically more increased so I think the problem is is well noted and everyone is well aware of it it's just a matter of like everything else how do we fund it to get

to get these situations resolved this property on Anderson Street is very particular where I think Mr Barlow bought the property around 2010. I think it was only Built maybe 10 years before that I believe this property is in a flood Hazard Zone on a FEMA map it's in an a-zone not just outside of it not you know it's it's in a flood plain associated with sucker Brook on top of that when the original

owner built the home before Mr Barlow if you get down there you'll see that the garage doors in the driveway are below Anderson Street so if the house was built properly back whenever it was built and went through maybe a site plan review of things like we do now the house probably would have been raised three feet to what it is now and we wouldn't be having this issue so it's

horrible to say that we have an existing condition that in order to fix it it takes something as Grand as what Paul is proposing to fix that problem it may seem minor that it's only that it's one house but it's one house and we have to try and do what we can to to resolve that Mr Barlow has taken steps on his own to close all office garage doors to stop that flooding from happening and

build another garage but really to fix that there there is funding that that we need to go seek and and I can tell you just being here in a short period of time and you all know Paul is the best at going out and finding millions of dollars to do improvements in the city streets but those projects get prioritized and and money can only be spent you know at one to finish it you can't sprinkle it

because until the Project's completed you don't get the solution that you need so you can't take 100 million and put 10 10 10 you haven't resolved any problems so it has to go one at a time that's all I respect your explanation and um I mean no disrespect I but I do feel I have to bring up the fact and I know that counselor uh Pelletier was alluding

to this sort of thing uh we do have a neighborhood that was built in an area where they actually drained a pond and then built the houses one of the houses sank seven inches or nine inches um so where site plan review was for that there was not questionable it came in just after that as a result of that as a result of that and as you know for 28

years I worked in the private sector I would never do a job in that subdivision because of the problems that I've known that have taken place we're actually in the process now of making some big changes in trying to create some resolutions to the drainage issues down there but yes that was I'll call it a travesty and that's why site plan review you know came into being that was that was the driving force was

drainage people didn't pay attention to drainage 20 or 30 years ago I did because it's what I did for a living but um most places did not so I I give you know the council credit for coming up with and passing the site plan review ordinance because that has made drastic improvement um is there anything else that we could do to help um uh to avoid other problems in the future

money that's it really just comes down to money it really does they're all if it was a problem if the worst thing for me to come and say it's a problem that we can't fix that that's bad and you know that's fearful that this is not a problem like that water flows downhill so as long as you have somewhere for it to flow to that's where it's going to go

then it will work but it costs money to get it to flow downhill sometimes now from what I understand Paul and I discussed and he told he talked a little bit about it he walked that and took an entire Brook and there were no obstructions so the only place that the backup can occur so it comes down through the screen and then hits this big Wetland which is the bathtub that we were talking about so

really the only thing that we can do is fix the bathtub and then potentially what connects the bathtub to the what's up upon which I think the the project that Paul has initiated will resolve so between the Grant and the funding that you received from the council which I'm so happy my fellow counselors uh approved the funding um how much of an effect do you believe that will have on that area so again

it's a process that we need to go through this was the first step getting a general idea you know 90 000 foot view of what it's going to look like next we're going to get you know more design so we're going to get into surveying we're going to get into boards we're going to get into soil sampling and a little bit more of uh you know H hydraulic study to see you know however

all the pieces will fit together so that's the step that we're on right now once we had done that step we'll have a better idea of what the actual overall project would be what the overall cost is going to be at that time that'll allow us to continue moving forward you know again it's it's it's a process for the design process um you know design process on something like this can can take some time

especially right now a lot of design Engineers are very very busy with all the federal funding that's out there and then my last question would be is this a situation or would be totally absurd um that some type of retaining wall could could help the situation well in an a Zone like like we're dealing with here the only thing that you could do is you know let's look at New Orleans for

instance and you build a dike around an entire property you still have to get into this property right so the water will will seek its way around so if you built a wall along the back of the property it's probably just going to wrap around the front into Anderson and come in in through the front I think Mr Barlow has done as much filling as he can around the house where he has a

swimming pool and he's raised the grade up enough I think to to help the situation the best that he can really the the quickest and cheapest solution and by no means am I saying that this is should be an option would be to raise the house and to raise the land but that's not something that that we can put on the homeowner I understand that completely but if you were to now try

and build this house in an a Zone they would make you raise this house approximately three or four feet so so that this does not happen so I was just gonna ask the question with regards to Whitefield Street which is the development you were talking about so that that predated the site review so what about as builts so there was no no as Bill plans that was submitted because it was no site right

it was all prior to that and because it was technically not a subdivision it wasn't a definitive subdivision Linwood and Whitefield were existing waves so they they came in and constructed it to a standard adequate enough to provide access to the homes and they're considered what is called an anr subdivision to form a subdivision where they just create the box and then go get a building permit the city has taken

great extents to go in and make drainage improvements I know the roads were just finished paved um and there is now the opportunity with another landowner to the north to try and incorporate some dramatic drainage Improvement utilizing his properties to help alleviate the downstream during all the upgradient drainage systems through Linwood and Whitefield as well so so uh in terms of the zoning ordinances

are there any changes or do you feel comfortable with what's currently in our ordinances to or zoning office uh both planning and um zoning is I mean zoning is fairly Antiquated you know it's been around for a long time so that there are some changes to be made I was brought in to look at some of those things and once the reorganization went through I would be in a position to help move that along

which thank you for passing that so we can start to do that work done some of it behind the scenes already site plan review um I think there's some work to be done and that the city needs some more teeth it's it's a fairly vague ordinance that for many years again me working on the other side Paul worked well for the city asking for everything that he could and getting his applicants to give

everything that they could to get something permitted that may not be the ordinance itself is a little bit Broad and may not give us the teeth so we would like to see a site plan review ordinance that increases you know what our teeth are different things like Landscaping standards you know different parking standards all kinds of things that this was the initial ordinance was limped into specifically

for drainage in utilities so it would be great to broaden you know the teeth of that whole bylaw um you know I think I got more conversations for some of the other the other topic areas um I guess I I'm just I appreciate the work here but I just don't want to give Mr Balo any false sense of hope that you know this Project's really going to secure because

I think the fact that he's in a you know the flood zone the female flood zone is not gonna it's not gonna change and I would say no matter what what goes on with this in terms of you know fixing the Wetland area over there though so as I said you know water flows downhill when we get a big storm there is no downhill for Mr Barlow and that's and that's a scary thing

um you know it's not water in your basement that you can pump out you're gonna have to keep pumping it until it's gone until the downstream water is gone so the same bathtub analogy and I've used this for years explaining drainage we have the sand in the bottom of the tub if we get rid of the sand and now I talked about from the Wetland to the watuppa there's another channel

that runs there that would be like opening the drain on top of that so we've got you've got sand that's filling up the tub and then that that blocks the outlet as well so creating the additional storage because it's just x amount of water so many gallons so you can either put it in the bottom six inches or the top six inches you get one more drop of water after six inches of

rain we're not we now have a problem so it's nice to use the bottom six inches which I'm hoping you know Paul's study will allow us to counselor Kadeem brought up a great point we may find out that environmentally it's going to be very difficult to get rid of what's in the bottom of this Pond but we'll have to cross that bridge when we get there so in terms of the infrastructure and I

guess it's kind of you know I'm gonna have the same question for the other locations but infrastructure here for stormwater everything is overly improved and here everything is Overland because there is not an elevation difference enough yeah to get water to flow downhill okay all right all right so right what about further down towards the uh the pond so the structures down there so

yeah there's some areas where they go underneath um under into uh into a culvert uh they go actually underneath one of the Mills over in that area there's two Bridges actually Three Bridges now that they cross under uh the recent bridge that was built that was had stormwater standards so that has the capacity to be able to take so there's no other structures down towards the pond that it would create

any any type of backup or anything like that no and massdot owns one of them yeah and they're replacing that bridge they're going on for a little while but they're in the process of doing that um we can now you know we can look again it's one yeah so there's there's three in the complex like like Paul stated the last one is for that service is Augustine I mean Atlantis there's two

upgrading I always get mixed up which one is which uh which ones to stay on which ones the city on but we can go down and and double check and make sure there are no Downstream impediments yeah um and that's something that we can do within a couple of days and if there is then it should be pretty easy to remove yeah I'm just I'm just curious to see if that what those look like those charges

that's all okay yeah we can um I know I have photographic evidence of the bridge parts of them a lot of it's underground but I don't know what they ever been cameraed or can we see what it's like the underground part of it just to ensure yeah we wouldn't be able to camber that just because of the structure that it is um you know the flow that goes through there uh takes

all the so the top bridge is the dot the wooden bridge um that Services the top half of uh the 99 floor at Jefferson Street that's a very large open Covet after that it goes into a closed cover underneath the Mills hasn't been seen anything that there's any type of obstructions due to just the flow that's able to go through there so and you capture all these on your ms4 permitting right is there any issues

with those down there nope so there's so there's those have been uh check for illicit discharges and stuff like that we haven't picked anything up are you um I know Mr Barlow is here do you have anything you'd like to add to this conversation stay in email address even though we're all well aware Richard Ball 50 Anderson Street um my just question is you know when the sucker Brook when it comes down if that

could just be opened up more to the bleachery pond like you know a channel dug in because it gets very now it's only going through pipes about that big you know so if it was opened up more to that bleachery pond and not the pond before that where it's like all wetlands because I walked back there you know doing a lot of flooding like last year when my when I flooded and there's a lot

of space where that water could go you know um would probably be a lot less money if that could just be channeled over that way I mean I don't know yeah so as it comes down through your properties over here as it comes down through here it's pretty well channelized uh area until it gets to this series that's right kind of scatter out all over the place that's what I mean if it stood in

that they continued that one channel and opened that channel up to right to bleachery Pond well short so bleachery Pond is right over there right is elevated from from this area your area actually flows through uh there's an alcohol from the military part of that comes down into here if you come up here you can see this blue line so this comes down and when it runs behind your house as well as the secretary

sucker Brook does this so bleachery actually drains into this well the idea is the lower yeah exactly saying you know you know every time I did call Paul you know you responded pretty quickly like I said last time and um I did close off my garage and putting a window well around the garage that one doorway so you know hopefully that will help out with uh some of the water issues that we have like

like I said it is when it is like on the side of your house like in relation to I'm just security yourself about how high it gets you mean the last the last flood we had highest ever the highest ever was back in 2010 it was probably about two feet standing water around the house yeah no back then it went down very quick it's not like I stood there for long it went

down very quickly it does damage quickly it does damage quickly and then last time was uh last year in September 2nd poll came right down and uh you had about four inches of water yeah because the inside of the garage which a lot of the stuff got damaged in there because it just filled up with water but because I plywooded the whole inside and I cleaned it all Flex Seal the stuff does work um

it didn't it did keep the water from going into the house and you know with the door closed and towels and everything else and wet vacs we're able to keep it really from damaging the house so it did help a lot um but the water did rise up pretty high um so uh as I know the city's really strapped with money and it's it's not easy to fix all these problems and so that's why I

did a lot what I did to try to fix a lot of the problems like with the street I mean the my driveway because when I did the street that was way before your time they pitched it right into my driveway so every time it rained and stuff like that all had to bring it to my driveway so I raised the driveway pitched it out um yeah which probably needs to be we dug

again today so it's there's a couple of rocks and some grass clippings it's it's pretty yeah I mean I cut all that grass will win the dirt street right there you know that paper Street I cut all that all the time try to keep up with it but uh it just needs a good catch Basin or something for that water to go into like Paul said with the plowing issues you know that's that's a

big problem because it just causes a damn like you said the board has no place to go it just then it just backs up from there and that's the big problem with these some of these flowers correct so it's actually coming like this and join join forces and gaining up on me so you bought your house again this is just an engineering curiosity thing did your insurance did your mortgage

company require you to get insurance the house isn't completely in the flood zone yeah but I guess it was removed from a flood zone you know prior to that and from Engineers so it only comes up so far so I do have flood insurance on the house only because the house was flooded and they said if you don't have flood insurance you know we won't cover you again so I said well I'll pay for the

flood insurance so I do have flood insurance um it's uh it's not cheap but it doesn't cover anything flame insurance covers nothing I mean as anybody knows who has flood insurance and it's not cheap it's very expensive and to try to sell a property like that now no one that has you know flooding issues and how much would I get for a property like that no and to find a property like that I mean

it is a good piece of property it's a good spot a nice piece of property and uh I like to try to do everything I can to work with this to be like I said to try to resolve the problem that's why when I built the second garage when I closed off the garage I raised it up higher so that last storm we had I didn't get a drop of water in there because I did

raise it up enough like you said and you're raising up higher but from what I understand from the neighbors that live there prior when they first built that house that house has two foundations so it's a foundation there's a foundation on top of it because of the wetlands right because because they're around the world of back then so like you said is you know they let it pass nowadays I know the guy

um a lot better question I was talking Paul he wants to build a house over there so that was really low that's the left-hand side right there's a Dunbar yeah yeah so that first house on your left yeah but anyway it's like well if they built here they're gonna raise that all up now where's that water gonna go down so I mean like I don't you know I have no problems people building they want to

build that's fine you know um I know you did my friends uh my neighbor's house and you did the other guys they're great neighbors you know so to fight people because you don't want a neighbor you never know what you're gonna have for Neighbors I mean they're both great people do we have anything else in addressing this flooding do we have a motion I mean I would I would like to at least offer that but

during whatever the next rain storm is I mean I'll go out and take a look at it again and if there's anything that we can recommend or to me even put a Band-Aid on and make any Improvement you know I can offer that up and I'll like I'll speak Mr Bowen and fall about that just to see if it's if there's anything it might not resolve the whole problem but maybe it's something incremental

that in this in the meantime we can get some improvement on so it is if it's a three-inch rainstorm that would normally flood you maybe we can maybe we can accommodate that we may not a seven inch rainstorm everywhere is going to meet devastating right we get more of those than than what we used to get Council filter make a motion yes we table item three and four uh until we can get enough money from Grants

and that the city can maybe fund some money towards the problem that we have on Anderson Street but that would be a combination thing as well right yeah so I think the next time we should probably meet us once we come up with once the engineers spend some time looking at it and you know what they come up with out of the design that's the next time we should probably just talk with everybody

by then we'll we'll hopefully have a funding plan set or something insight to move forward with second

thank you thank you item number five resolution City administrator director of financial services and administrative Community utilities be invited to the Committee on Public Works and transportation to discuss solutions to the flooding issues connected to the Stafford square area referred 9 14 21.

very easy to do if we put the big pipe staffords go ahead hook it right at the quicker gym River them buildings but that's illegal right yeah that's the only way you can straighten that thing out no but that is the general concept yeah there's just a lot of talking 42 million dollars that's crazy it's a big drainage area that affects neighborhood on top of the neighborhood I mean you don't understand

everybody says water flows downhill it all falls to one spot so so Stafford square if it wasn't easy fix I'm sure the city probably they probably would have done it by now there's photos we have from the 50s and 60s of cows going through the you know two feet of water through that intersection I'll flip my page area there so Stafford square is right down here this is Eastern Avenue Superior Court Street Locust Street

local Cemetery so you're talking over 600 acre drainage area that comes down to this one point there are multiple different um Drainage Systems so on this map all the green is the sewer system they're all separated drainage systems that run through this area but they're not big enough to handle the amount of water that's coming down through this area again you're talking to school as far

back as Bullock Street all this water all this water coming down to this to this one point and then as you said trying to make its way up to the quickest hand uh so very difficult there's multiple different options that we looked at for this project you know we looked at is it cheaper so did we take and we put a control structure on Southwest so we can drop the foot to shed to get the water

out we take and dredge out the whole entire quicker Shan to make additional storage capacity you know there was a lot of different options that we looked at for this can we do one option that's going to be lower cost that will you know improve the the area and it just wasn't nothing was working hydraulically coming out of the back here there are some restrictions there will have to be

some dredging of the of the channel That goes out through the back and then also the quickest hand um there is uh increased piping that's going to have to be done uh coming down County Street coming down Pleasant Street and then through this old tight area through Healy Street all the way up to Bedford Street so you know Stafford Square we get the flooding deep on Stafford square area uh that decorative that

relates directly to the flooding that happened that Calissa Drive in Tiffany Drive and then also as far back as Bedford Street so that's the tail water from the flooding that happens over here so the flooding that occurs are the heavy rain storms next to Columbus Park that little area there is all related to Stafford Square so a couple of different big things that we deal with there used to

be a large Quarry up in this area to deal with the drain that comes out of that quarry that comes down you'll uh foreign that comes down through here and out through Stafford square and then there's also another very older drain that comes down Pleasant and then also grows out overall the study that we ended up doing so part of the integrated uh the uh authorization that that we had

allowed us to take and stop a study of this area so we we had one of our consulted Engineers go into this whole entire area we've surveyed all the manholes coming down through this area all the catch bases uh We've we've done flow monitoring on them both to sanitary and the storm water systems because the other problem is you get up into all these areas that don't have the separated drains that's the

catch bases going into the combined silver so by the time you get to Stafford Square you have combined sewer issue plus that also overburdening drainage system so it's two issues that you deal with at one point um so they did a lot of modeling through that whole entire area what we're working on right now we're putting together a application for the hazard mitigation we played to submitted

for hazard mitigation and the brick program so this whole entire project was was three phases uh and then an additional green infrastructure phase that could have been added on first three phases were a total of 45 million dollars the green infrastructure phase uh was it was an additional six million so what we ended up doing before the hazard mitigation application that we're going to be submitting uh is is we kind

of took phase one and phase two so phase one and phase two really looks like it's going to solve the majority of the flooding through that intersection that's going to include going back installing logical that's running down through this area larger culverts running down County Street and some of the covets coming down Pleasant Street separate out a lot of the uh a lot of the combined catch basins that go into

the Sewell pull those out of the so we'll put them into separated drain lines dredge out and clean the channel That heads out towards the quickest hand insert clean up of certain areas of quickest River as well to increase that flow so that brought that project down to about 32 million dollars through the hazard mitigation plan and other contact uh we're applying to MIMA Nema then applies to FEMA and they're they're

excited about this project they like this project this is a safe funding that we got when we did the Middle Street project so we got over five and a half billion dollars back when we did the Middle Street project from the same program to be able to do flooding repairs one of the biggest things with this program is making the cost benefit analysis through FEMA's structured cost benefit analysis program making that

work so that it's a bubble one so your benefit is higher than you cost uh we went into a lot of buildings in that surrounding area we were able to get a base level elevations with those base level elevations we were able to uh show potential inundation uh if there was an issue which brought a lot of our uh a lot of uh BCA calculations up as well when this intersection is inundated that

the healthcare facility uh over uh Quarry Street which is impacted as well as service vehicles in a regular uh you know mobile access through that area so the biggest hurdle through that whole entire process that I feel was of course benefit analysis evaluation which we've been able to uh which we've been able to prove we've submitted that already to MIMA for the initial evaluation to go

through make sure that they agree with all of us the full application date is uh December 5th which we're on track to submit the application for funding now this particular agenda item is directly connected to a resolution that Council pamel Liberty had submitted um specifically 10 Tiffany Drive and carlissa drive yep so everything that you just discussed will affect them how will it help

mitigate their problems and what is the timeline on it if it will yeah so again all all the all this planning all this work that would be done would would mitigate their problem so the problem with that if you look at the Topo elevations staff and square you're at 139 138 or so in the low point of staff and square you go to Calissa and Tiffany Drive here at 139. so even though they're far apart

and you go up a little bit and down a little bit the actual elevations are almost very very close so that's why when you get the backup and staff and square you'll also get it on colors to drive because it's a water seeks the same level um you know and it's not able to move down through that system and out to the quickest hand so again this project would uh repair the issues over at the Calissa

and Tiffany Drive phase one and phase two as we've planned it out um the uh the timeline for the project again we submit uh coming up uh when we did Middle Street the review process through FEMA uh was pretty lengthy uh when they reviewed it by the time they awarded I believe we were a year or two on the review process till we were able to access the funding at that point we

were able to move forward with the project uh construction time frame on this project I would expect between full design and construction to be uh probably a two to three year time frame um you know this is a busy intersection a lot of utilities that we have to relocate uh reconstruct the project also includes reconstructing the whole entire intersection all the signalization sidewalks Paving through that whole tire

and stuff like that yeah I mean I definitely can feel for these people I was somebody that was severely impacted when Mount Hope Avenue erupted I was end of the line got it all um I mean you're talking thousands of dollars in damage so I I can fully sympathize is there anything that we can do now um to help them to any extent I mean you know I mean it's great to hear and

mitigate it it's great to hear hopefully we're going to do it but when you're having that kind of damage and you're getting flooded two to three years is a long time no without a doubt it definitely is you know again through this whole entire area we looked at every potential easier cheaper quicker option that was available to us you know our crews have been out there uh over the years

cleaning all those drain lines making sure that everything's uh open and available in the parking lot of uh of the Flint Village uh shopping plaza there there's a sedimentation Basin in there that we clean out regularly um you know it is a tough circumstance but uh as uh you know Mr agya said the uh the intensity of these rainstorms are drastically changing you know uh when you're talking you know September 2nd

last year that impacted Mr Paulo impacted You Know cover Serendipity you're talking six and a half inches of rain in six hours overnight it was pretty substantial amount of rain yeah my yard was flooded again yeah most peoples were yeah um do we have the resident of 10 Tiffany Drive here yep would you like to speak ask any questions ask questions in terms of the funding how much funding

have you had besides the Hazardous mitigation for this project for a study

um so again slated within the 123 million authorization I believe it was a total of uh initially we did a for the dis for the initial study which was a three hundred thousand dollar contract with the engineers um that's what was approved within that authorization we've taken and been able to put some additional funds uh from some other flooding authorizations so we've put in roughly about five hundred

thousand dollars I would say at this point okay and then phase one phase two you said is how much so phase one and phase two is uh estimated right now 32 million 32 and then 45 if we do the three phases yes okay so you're looking to do phase one and two with the application to for the hazard mitigation yes okay and then what is phase three and I guess where where are we anticipating that

money coming from uh so phase three goes up into the into this area further so it goes as far back as Lafayette Park uh and then up into uh Eddie Street uh areas um I think at this point right now phase one and phase two is a uh is a very good start so then we can evaluate and see uh how much of phase three potentially would have to be built out to help those

those up extreme areas but you know again with the drainage area like this you get a stop from the bottom yeah real big and work your way up and out yeah I guess my only concern is that as you mentioned this goes back to the 60s right so just having these conversations and it's taking us this long to even get to the planning stages right just to get modeling and figure out what we need to

do and then you know because we always knew it was quick as Shannon and talking about dredging that and doing that that whole infrastructure project so I just don't want to lose momentum while we have it right so if if we've got a study that's calling for three uh three phases then for me personally I think we need to figure out how we get to the third phase and and because it's not

it's not fair that we're handling some here and then we're still going to have some some issues you know uphill a little bit more um you know especially with the study so from my standpoint that's that's where I want to go and I want to just know where where we need to go how we need to get there and and how I need to Advocate to get the funding to where we need to be

because I don't see us having this conversation ever again in terms of Stafford Square once we get phase one and two that's that's just me personally I know how things start to work so yeah so again with the phase one and phase two we pulled in everything that so through the hatchet mitigation plan they're not going to partially fund something that's going to fix just a portion of the problem

um phase three again goes up for the uh into the drainage area gets this stuff into pipes quicker rather than having it sheep flow down to areas to be able to get into the pipe uh so you know phase three we kind of looked at as almost um I wouldn't say Nancy Larry but an additional step that that could be taken if needed in the future with the course benefit analysis that

that was done again we're trying to balance the funding options the cost benefit analysis and being able to actually do the project so that's why we came up with the phase one phase two options and what was the green infrastructure of course so green infrastructure was doing uh some bio retention areas uh up in like the Lafayette Park area doing some down the Pleasant Street uh doing some green

infrastructure tree box filters via retention bump outs and different things throughout that we still do have a uh certain amount of green infrastructure built into the project because it's beneficial to our ms4 permit to be able to have it's required by RMS full permit to have that within there but um you know some of the ancillary prettier things yeah what kind of cup I think a good way to look at it is for an

understanding phase one and two and correct me if I'm wrongful phase one and two resolves the flooding issue phases one two and three mimic what you would do if you were starting from scratch and designing a drainage system for this area that that's the difference so okay yeah so the dredging of the quickest hand is in phase one and two it's it's within the for certain areas yeah so

does that how's that going to impact and I know we're I'm jumping ahead a little bit but does that impact the Jefferson Street because I would I would assume that all ties into the Jefferson Street flooding as well so Jefferson Street is a Chase pond on the other side of 195.

so the quickest hand doesn't it it so Chase Pawn ties into quicker shade underneath 195 um but the area of uh Jefferson has other issues within that the overall dredging um the overall dredging that is required potentially could be permitted at the same time it would be something that we'd be looking at doing if we're going to be going through that type of Permitting because that's a pretty heavy

lift for permitting to be able to dredge out those areas so it's something that we're keeping in mind uh to do full dredging of potentially both of those areas so now what what about the uh the infrastructure going out to the quickest end to the to the Mount Hope Bay is uh all in good condition and I apologize my allergies tonight are just a little crazy but uh so those are all in good

condition uh back in 2014 or so we reconstructed the inlet at Plymouth Avenue as well as the gate at Fourth Street right across the street here from City Hall uh when they did the Route 79 spaghetti ramps Downstream from here uh the uh we had some restrictions on the quickest hand outfall that goes down underneath the bridge comes out of Battleship Cove Mass D.O.T repaired that and then also we had the uh we had the

uh Firestone uh Culvert that goes over to crab Pond area over by the Firestone complex and then discharges out into the bay they cleaned that whole entire color underneath the Mills running through that area so uh the quickest in from that down is uh is in good condition and you said two to three years from design to completion that's that's our expectation of how our plan is now roughly how long we anticipate for I

guess a response on the uh has the medication funding so again on the Middle Street project that was late there I want to say it was almost two years to till we had a response uh of approval to be able to move forward with the project I think since then that was a number of years ago female have worked better together to be able to get those responses out a lot quicker okay without our yield

so we're looking at a minimum 32 million to 45 million for a total project is that what you said uh so I'm expecting to put in the Grant application for 32 million 32 million um do you have any anticipated amount of what you think you'll be approved for based on past history you know again I I can't say I can tell you that the match depending on the program the match is either 10 or 25

um the one that's 25 which is the brick potentially can be dropped down to 10 um so that's uh you know something that we're hoping that we'll be able to do by my hope is that if the project is funded it would be fully funded at 32 million well you know I get education here tonight I didn't know he went as far as it goes but like you guys say it flows

down and flows down but I didn't know it went all the way up to Eastern Avenue and every place else but it's all dreams not man so and what size pipe you put in a bit bigger pipes or yeah so down through the uh down through that area there's there's going to be some Lodge culverts uh running through there I believe they were uh five by eight box culpits are running through the intersection uh

there's there's two pairs of them that will be running through through that area uh plus leaving the existing ones in place as well well you know I found the progress on Middle Street and uh of course they blame Saint Anne for that but it had to be done anyway and I think you got a good handle on this uh you know it's been a long time coming uh you seem to

have uh all the abilities to get the monies and I guess the people that go out there to tell you hey we got to do this this and this and uh I I think you're doing a very good job and uh like a confidence in you that this will be squid away and at the cheapest that we can get it with the funds that you can get and uh I know you you're pretty good at getting

funds and all that stuff so I got to commend you on the job that you're doing and the work that you do in the city you know I've been to a few places where you had the main broke the one I was on Bedford Street and I went down there you were there and you were down there late at night and uh even Middle Street you got to break that you Hood down there so I mean

you're all over the place uh I I think uh the first coil comes in probably goes to you and you get all the men out to go out there to work and and they do one hell of a job for you so I just say it you just keep it up you know there's uh rumors out there maybe leaving or not leaving but uh you go by vote the state believe me so I hope everything works

out for you in the city of Fall River with that idea if you would both uh state your name and address just for the record 10 Tiffany Drive you know intensity drives so we're just basically just wondering if there's anything that you recommend that either we can do or that can be done in this year wait there's there's really not because again this isn't water that's coming off of your property or an upgraded property

that's causing flooding your flooding is occurring from this Stafford square area through the pipe system right and basically fills that system so your water has nowhere to go right so I mean you can make some small improvements whether they be like I don't know if you have like if your downspouts are connected like the infiltration Chambers like roof drains under the ground but again just

your house alone isn't really going to fix that you you would need 200 homes to do that and through site plan review we do require that now from everybody to get their roof run off into a ground and infiltrate into groundwater not into the pipes in the city streets that wasn't done back when back when that subdivision was built you're right at the corner yeah and the house was

built in 2017. okay yeah so I had I went out there maybe a month or two ago to look at that um okay and you just happen to be you know the catch Basin that's at the entrance of that subdivision road is the low spot you stand there and look around it's uphill to everywhere so even when that water gets filled it's just going to keep Rising until the bottom end of it can alleviate that

from happening so so don't fix that area would be a bigger pipe bigger pipe from your street all the way down to the quickashan river all those pipes would be enlarged and increased that's this whole program and that's what yeah because we just saw like a vinyl fencing and we just had like one whole side like the last September that we had to like replace sure like a short time after installing

it so it's just like wonderful isn't that September yeah it happens before that but not in that volume of course that volume was understandable of how much rainfall we got nobody could have predicted that but the damage from the fence like it's still like kind of like Boeing but any impact of water now with the pressure just causes damage and we're trying to prevent to have to keep replacing it on a yearly basis

throughout five years or so I know it's I wish it was this I wish it was a simple solution I wish there was I wish there was a hole on the ground 50 feet from your house that I could say just run we're going to run a pipe from there to there but that hole doesn't exist that that that's the problem it's stressful you know especially because we weren't disclose this information we specifically asked if

that area was prone to flooding and everybody said no no you're fine no flood insurance involved nobody ever told us that we ever needed it yeah flood insurance is different you know yeah you're not in a flood zone right you know in this situations I understand completely I'm sorry we don't have better information for you but in the scheme of things as much as two or three years is a long time it actually

goes Lisa gives us a timeline that we can focus on right right at least we wanted an answer right and at least you know there please no it's not ignored I mean this study how long is this study did you have this done so this has been sitting for a while he's just now getting to some funding opportunities that have the ability which we appreciate that yeah and what I'm glad

about Mr Barlow has been on dealing with this for 12 years and he has no answer it is what it is his house is too low and he's just going to suffer this as long as he owns his home at least in your case it's going to be mitigated it will be fixed and some and not so far down the road you won't have these problems anymore so at least that's some

Solace right I wish we could give you more but I'm glad that at least yes exactly of all these Grant funds uh local delegation is always supportive I will probably be working for other letters from other people within the area to finally submitted that application so it would be nice if they got an answer back to you quickly and if there were any additional funding necessary that we

could walk some more Apple funding to help you out so I wasn't going to go there but I guess I'm going to go there uh so the Oppa money so we can't use apple money if we're getting additional Federal Monies at least that's my understanding so I guess from from a funding standpoint we're not taking into account the use of Apple money I mean I guess for the study it's okay but the project itself so so

at this point we haven't been looking at oppa funding because I've been I've been working probably four months now on this hmgp and brick funding application okay um you know it's it's pretty substantial we've had to have surveys go out like I said and stuff like that so we've been working towards that again with the project of this magnitude um you know I think I told this Council up it was first out many times they

could have taken all the Opera funding and yeah spent it very quickly with the amount of work that needs to be done city-wide um so you know uh again upper funding at this time you know if we move forward with this if you know a grant is approved for 3.2 million dollars I would hope that within uh overall CIP and spending plan that we'd be able to uh afford an authorization of either the 10

or matching and that's fine I just want to make sure we weren't banking on any Apple money because if it's especially if it's Bristol County it's going to go through two reviews uh for an auditing firm and they're gonna they're gonna kick it out if they find out we're getting any type of federal assistance to this project so okay I yields do we have a motion uh motion and table till we get

uh funding from whatever resources that Mr Phil and feels like you can get it and come back and report to us when you can start the job you start tomorrow I wish I wish I could start all these tomorrow so I mean we're doing our best it's been there for a long time I think we move we move and I think we're going to see some solution very shortly second all in favor all right opposed motion

carries thank you thank you thank you thank you guys very much thank you have a good day thank you item number six a resolution Committee of Public Works and transportation meet with the residents of Grinnell and Jefferson Street areas the administration of community utility administrator of community utilities city engineer to discuss flooding issues referred October 11th 22.

almost there so I guess just an update yeah I feel like I can do it a brief presentation so I was in front of the local neighborhood negotiation representative here as well um so uh just for reference quicker chance he comes down this is Justice in the street uh heading up to Great nap here Rodman Street Camp Warren Street running this way so this is Walmart This is the End Sam's Club

we have here is about a 60 acre drainage area that comes down uh again you know to low points it's kind of been the kind of repetitive uh issue that we've been talking about tonight is a large area coming down to a low area of the city that doesn't have proper capacity for drainage so this plant is from the uh 2015 integrated plan that was that was done for the city uh identified a

shovel storm water Wastewater work that needed to be done CSO Works 40 to 50 years areas of flooding so this this drainage system goes into Jake Pond right here which we talked about so this is 195 it crosses underneath 125 195 it's a large covet to the quickest hand eventually upload through the Crooked chance River there is a separated drainage area that comes up through this area so it stops

right here on Warren Street next to the cable company building just behind there just off to the left hand side there's an outfall of the pipe the pipe crosses the street travels through the backyard of all the houses that are on Main Street in a Utah Street continues up passes uh in between Consignment Supply building and the uh in the houses below to the east assignment Supply continues

across Grinnell Street uh it is between houses until it gets to open Street headed towards the west and then continues down you know right now is separated very catch bases on breakdown as well as Aberdeen Street uh low points within this so there's areas there's a separate drainage system as well in the quick machine Jefferson Street Warren that has a separate alcohol that goes to Jake Paul and comes out this way um

you know again we deal with a undersized braided system to be able to take the intensity of the brainstorms that we've been that we can deal with as well as you know the construction that has happened within this area uh The L4 over here does open up to a fight this channel through here has had some settlement build up over time that's one thing that we're looking at right now uh

to be able to get in there to clear out to make sure that that has a flow path to be able to get right out to chase Pond without any obstructions that is something that we're currently working on uh looking to bring a contractor to do that work uh because there's some specialized equipment that's that's required so that may provide uh some moderate uh alleviation to the issue just not sure how much

because one of the problems is you still have the quickest in shape Pond that have a tail water that comes back up this pipe almost to Riddell street so there's so this pipe even when it's not ready to go has water in it because it was built lower than what you shouldn't Chase upon is which causes an issue um you have again this the area here you have flooding that occurs

on Warren Street flooding that occurs on Grinnell Street uh flooding that occurs on break in half all due to this issue back up to the Serta bus stop last week after I met with these the residents on Monday night Tuesday morning we had a water main break I briefed the Council on that issue that occurred right here when I showed up about 5 30 in the morning um water that was flowing down Olden Street

Reed Street uh Grinnell Street was had some inundation on it so you know all that water was traveling down that way you know I've changed how to Chase you know as the Council of those there was some contamination issues we had to put booms out there and stuff like that but after that our crews did go out in uh jet all the lines with the LSP that was on site to clean all the catch bases

again to make sure that everything was cleaned from that from that this is one of the areas that would run through pretty regularly factoring out the catch basis making sure that everything gets clean one of the other issues through this low area here is groundwater issues so soil conditions I remember when we were when we were replacing Maine on Utah Street some of that soil we actually had to uh we

actually had to store on a cellular property disposal through the mass contingency plan because of uh because of the you know Urban type of urban soil it was so some of the fill that's within this area is it is it great and then also the groundwater is able to fully you know before we flow through and uh and no effects of that area so it's kind of an overview one of the plans so

through the integrated plan again kind of took it 90 000 foot view to look at potential issues or potential Solutions you know solutions that would have that would have to be done that they looked at so this whole entire area comes way back up almost to uh almost to Plymouth Avenue this drainage area is coming down this way on Warren Street so it's again it's a pretty uh massive area we would have to

go up through these neighborhoods separate drainage system running down to a separate outfall coming through here take and Lodge this drainage system these drainage pipes through here extend these up to get the water into the into the drainage system earlier one of the issues that we're dealing with when you get over here this pipe will be here only has about a foot of cover on the pipe so from the top of the pipe

the ground surface is only about a foot so that pipe is as high as it can come without coming out of the ground so those are some of the issues that would deal that would be dealing with the constructability that doesn't allow for much drainage on the surface either in correct exactly so when you when you have a pipe that already has a tail water in it and you deal with the pipe

so close to the ground there's not much spot besides the road surface that it has to be able to pump you know again after a rainstorm after it starts to subside you know these areas do the drainage does subside and move out but it does impact the residents in that area so how are you going to fix that issue well again that's you know in the 2015 plan the uh it was identified roughly

about 11 million dollars that was 2015 uh dollars so it's drastically changed since then but that would be doing during the larger drainage system up in this area uh increase in the drainage the size of the pipe running down through this area uh getting more drainage in in out in these further areas to be able to convey it through the pipe system now and then dredging of this whole area is another portion of

that so you would still have the water draining out to chase ponds yeah there's no real other way to do it you can't read is that is that Wetland right there with the is it just great or is that so um I don't know the directions so east of east of the uh where yeah Walmart is and stuff right there right there yeah so that's another part but um again so that's part of the quickest

year that flows this way so the elevation over here potentially could be higher and to make this great to get from these low points because this you're almost covered uphill and then Jefferson breaks back down so what did you do with Rod Ministry so Rod Ministry was always flooded similar to um and maybe it was a different issue but you know when you get to Rod Rodman and uh is it uh Manchester Street

no no down further um like next to stop and shop that was always flooding yeah yeah so now further down so I think it's Manchester Street yeah yeah so part of the CSO project that's where the uh end of the tunnel was with the final drop shaft at the end of Lewis in the street so that separated combined sewer that comes down Rodman Street now diverts into the 20-foot diameter tunnel rather than

heading towards Hotwell Street so that alleviated the flooding in that area as long as the tunnel is open I guess I'm just so we we feel that within I'm sorry um so you feel by adding the additional drainage you'll be able to rectify the problem with the piping itself being obviously lower the chase ponds so because I I just I just yeah I'm struggling in my mind says we have a lot of rainstorm that it's

just gonna back back fill anyways if you've ever been through this Rodman intersection on a pretty heavy rainstorm you get one of those blown right yeah to be able to get all of this into a separate pipe with a separate outfall that at this point could be higher you know so it gets all of that out of this range system opens up some capacity there this being able to bring these up

for the uh and then opening up this pipe uh you know making the logic capacity so that it could push out uh nice bio retention facility at the old watapa Heights facility um there are some sure immediate improvements that all I think that we can make in here to make somewhat of a difference first of all just cleaning out that existing Swale up to out to chase Pond we'll do something dramatic

the next thing we've talked about is grabbing some of that upgradient water not allowing that piping system to come down to where you see low point right you're catching it and redirecting it though those are actually quick and small or smaller projects construction projects that that can be handled almost in-house or something like that so we've we've started having that discussion and

initiating some of those improvements right so again the first thing would be getting out into this area to make sure that that is open coming out under the sediment within the drainage Swale there uh that something would work into bringing a contractor to do because it's pretty swampy up there we don't want to lose so is Chase upon the one that wraps around next to Lewiston Street yep that

goes right behind the incinerator what do you see right off the highway two swans out yeah yeah yeah yeah so this is when we look at all all three sites this is the easiest one of the fit because we do have elevation at our advantage everything upgrading in a Rodman actually actually everything upgradient to the West elevation works right um now it's just a matter of making everything that's on the low area big

enough to take that off so but in terms of the backflow for a lodge you know let's just say call it a 10-year storm that seems like it's happening every other month um so if you do all that drainage system with there's still no cons I guess do we still have concern that that pipe is going to create flooding in that area so what will happen is right now every so

when you see the word low point and you hit the pipe and the ditch that go out to chase Pond yep just about all of it goes through that what we want to do is take everything West and put it in a separate pipe so basically splitting up the two areas and putting it through two pipes rather than putting it all through a one so just the fact of eliminating half the

water that gets to this price you know I I guess I get that that part I'm talking about the pond itself right because you've got water coming from the pond so when the ponds is getting feel free yeah yeah it's going back right is that yeah there's tail water and a lot of drainage systems you deal with it you deal with tail water uh you know most of our CSO but

we're not concerned once you get the drainage we're not concerned about that additional backflow of the tail water going into to create it's just a it's just something that you design around so if you have a let's just say a 12 inch pipe and there's always six inches of water in the bottom of it yeah in your calculation you can only use half the pipe in your calculation or you might

need two 12-inch pipes yep each one of them might be six inches submerged but now you have two six inches so that's the that's the game that you have to play because we can't you know we can only do lower just like in all the other instance is lowering Chase pond if we can do it without doing that the other sites we don't really have an option and that's a pretty drastic option to

have to go and do that so we think that this can be done a little bit easier yeah Mustang has got a lot of uh pressure on his shoulders he used to he used to live in that neighborhood along with myself just we call it the highlands yeah yeah I was I was right I was right on uh Rodman and uh Buffington so yeah hi yields thank you

so how soon can we get on this one what type of funding is required what type of assistance would you need to move this along so again I think our first step is to be able to get out the uh with the contractor that's something we're looking to do uh be able to do with our current funding uh so I'll be able to clean up that uh that swell as you go

um you know at least as far as we can get in a reasonable manner uh and see see what what effect that that has what that does um you know and I think that's our first step from there we'd be looking to you know have to look to get from the 90 000 foot view which is this what we have now to get a little bit better so that requires being able to go

out and do some modeling and do some studying of the drainage area in the separate systems within that drainage area again you know funding for the for that right now I don't have anything uh identified I think once we get through this first step you know there are different options out there potentially uh for funding you know so it's something that we'll be looking for or potentially operating or some other type

of fund could be used for that Pete I'll put in the resolution um so I imagine once you once you swell that's going to determine how large or small of a project The Next Step will be and how much uh the net how it will pertain to the drainage because you'll know at that point what your level of flooding is this may need a level of cleaning and removal of debris

we may find out that that resolves eighty percent of of any rainstorm you don't know until you do it correct it's very difficult you can't go in and quantify the amount of backup that's happening right until it's all irregular until it's gone and then you visually can see okay there's nothing in the way what what what can pass and then now you have a starting point of okay what do we

need to fix from here to here now so we would anticipate well before or probably by Spring what the next step will be getting this cleaned up taking a look at it through the wet season it's difficult during the winter months you know ground gets frozen runs differently so by Spring we can analyze step two how much of an improvement was made by cleaning this out now is there a timeline on getting the soil cleaned out

uh yeah so we were I was talking with the contractor we were supposed to be out there last week but we had the issue and breaking of uh that we kind of shifted and uh dealing with so I'll be back in touch with him um you know we're working with an LSP we'll make sure that they're clear and allow us to go into that area so but I would hope within the next couple of

weeks Autumn is nice very nice sir would you like to state your name and address please uh yes my name is Frank asmero I live at 823 Grinnell Street in Fall River uh sort of I agree with Leo councilor Leo pelicia here about the building situation in our neighborhood I've been there since 1972.

Grinnell Street was only a paper street from like Reeves Street to this end almost to Jefferson it was paper street that whole neighborhood that's developed in uh houses there was Wetland that they've built on and built up you go up to the old Sylvia Davis where they just developed all that and there and the water table and that's on a hill compared to Jefferson and they had to make them slab houses

because of the high water table but that's not that's putting more water you've seen the pitches in there they're developing an odd escaping all the land around there and then they built Walmart and I know they're saying that that's a different uh Watershed but that's bringing all of that water around Jefferson Street into that same Chase Pond back in there that's elevated higher than Grinnell

Street so that's making no sense and the I talked to the uh I guess I don't know if you're the city engineer yeah I talked to uh yeah I talked to Paul at the neighborhood association meeting and he told me these Maps were like the piping system was 50 years since they they put them in and the map is like 15 years so at the same time we have this type of

information going back this far we know it's Antiquated doesn't work and the city still builds a dike on Jefferson street now the Mills used to have drive-throughs thrown where water could Escape now they're pushing it in the same place where Grinnell Street and 90 other acres are trying to drain into and this is a city problem more so than anything else that I can see in that whole neighborhood

do you like to address that yeah well again it's it's development over time again we're dealing with Drainage Systems this one's probably a little bit newer than maybe than some of the others but like when we say new we're still talking 50 60 years ago so you know when something was done and yes all of these areas get get built upon and prior to 2015 there was no ordinance in place that

forced people to take a hard look at drainage design that that has all changed so when someone comes in now to build a house on Grinnell Street they go through a single family house a pretty stringent review process to make sure that their storm water is being handled correctly Paul's office is the most difficult to get through and it has been for a long time but it's because he's

doing his job by what the ordinance has given him the ability to do prior to do prior to that ordinance he didn't have the ability to really put the clamps on the Builder to say you need to do this and it's not just single family homes it's it's Walmart now again Walmart's that does drain towards you know the east and their drainage system is fairly elaborate to do that but when you when

you look at everything as a whole yes the world is becoming impervious so when I said you know the new teeth that we could get through site plan review would give us the ability to require a certain amount of landscaping certain amount of trees to be planted on sites not just come in and we literally have some people that we chase that come in build a house and they concrete the entire law yes

it's against zoning so we so not now the chase is on you're not in compliance with zoning you're not in compliance with site plan review so it's it's a constant struggle to chase these people um but that that's what some people do so as much as you try to regulate it there are going to be the few that fall through and just turn their Blind Eye to it and then now now the chase is on and

we have to go through the legal process to to have them remove things it's not always not always simple that's for sure so site plan review if the ordinance became a little bit beefier we would have you know the ability to do a little bit more talking of the bathtub that I heard about tonight about how the water drains and how in the world if this map was in existence for 50 50 years do you not

realize the sediment from Walmart that's about six eight four high on Jefferson Street is adequate to put that water in that location that's beyond not to I don't want you I don't I don't want you to think I'm being facetious because I'm not but I think the same way they didn't think that when you drain upon and build on it the house is going to sink true that's the only way I can answer

that but the water is the development was designed to go East though and not to suggest that there's not some coming off there you have you have Cambridge at Walmart the drainage system does go yes yeah to the east but you have there are some small areas that shed down to the Jefferson Street okay you have Cambridge Street running into that you have Warren Street you have Jefferson Street and if you go

through there sometime when it's nice and raining out you'll see exactly what I'm talking about with the water is as over the sidewalk yeah it never was like that when the Mills were there absolutely not like that and if I can't Sean so to go back to the rainfall intensity how many times in anyone's lives here have you seen Route 195 close how many times yeah never twice this year yeah twice this year yeah right

before that so right so we we have an entirely different starting point I sit home and I watch the news and I see I have a daughter that goes to school in Providence and I'm like I can't believe this kid's gonna drive through a foot of water or sit in traffic because 195 is closed and you see it everywhere you see Highway ramps you see Route 140 you see Route 24 miles of Street

backed up and when I say this isn't just a city of Fall River situation this is everywhere so and I understand this this flooding is an inconvenience we are working to resolve it but it's in all honesty it you can't just blame it all on the past negligence of what the city has allowed to go on you can't you have you have to look at the science and what's happening rainfall wise because

it's happening on interstate highway low that go through the most intense drainage design and and try to handle everything they can so when a highway floods you're gonna you have to expect that that quicker chance street is going to flood as well when you have five acres with weepy willow trees on them Cattails uh I don't know Eel Grass you would call it and you take that and you rip it all out

and you build it three feet higher is really intelligent because we'd be willow trees do not grow unless there's deep water under them so your house was probably I and my house is a hundred years old

could build anywhere so many of these homes in these neighborhoods were built prior to 1974 when there was no Wetlands protection act or no drainage designed incorrect and right up there everybody's sitting there and we've had FEMA come down in our neighborhoods and give money to people this is how much property that has been lost theme has been in that neighborhood a couple of times and the last I'd say 15 years

okay well this is the first time that we've been able to address the problem these gentlemen are telling us that there is something that can be done there's an immediate something immediate that can be done they're saying it's going to have an impact it's going to improve your situation I would like to be able to give them the opportunity to move forward with this and let us see to what extent this

initial uh help will bring and what we have to do next to alleviate your problems so you don't have to deal with this anymore that's appreciated I'm sure everybody also appreciate it too but it's something through the years or every a lot of my neighbors including myself have been in front of the city council at the citizens import and is going nowhere we've talked to different people who are running for office who

come through the neighborhood and say they will address things has gone now excuse me sir so were the three of us on this committee then I'm not sure who was uh I didn't follow committee no I wasn't I don't I didn't follow committees so I didn't know who to address how to go about it this is and that's why I went to the neighborhood association we got the people together and try to go and to I

guess Paul's Credit he told us to move on this okay so I want to Let's I want to put I'm just gonna say this I suppose so that was the past I'm sorry for anybody who failed you in the past we're here now we're determined to rectify things to get done what can be done to help people I know Council Peltier Council today myself we advocate for the residents and

taxpayers all the time and I won't let this go thank you much okay and thank you for coming no so I will say that I'm not agreeing with all the arguments but I think what we can all agree on um as we had mentioned is that the infrastructure and the improvements have been a long time coming and we've just put it to the Wayside right so I think we've all been trying to advocate for

these improvements and you can see that tonight with all these conversations I think it comes down to to the funding options um and obviously taking the votes to make sure that there's funding appropriated for this so I think moving forward we need to be cognizant of that I know we've been pushing the administration to to come up with planning uh but I guess before he this gentleman leaves

um I apologize I forgot your your name Frank Frank before Frank leaves we had talked about the 90-foot scope how much do you think you need for this this project to get down to the next level sort of start a feasibility study and get down to the next level I would say that would probably be three hundred thousand okay estimate so can I just make a motion that the committee uh on Public Works sends a

letter requesting an appropriation order from the administration of three hundred thousand dollars for a feasibility study for this for this area all in favor aye any opposed the eyes have it

yeah I just like to say yeah it was on a slow track and I think what these two guys and I was it he's gonna see that on a fast track the best we could do with the money he can get and I think we're moving along fairly better than we've done in the past so it's a lot better than I've seen thank you okay thank you thank you thank

you for coming uh do we have a motion on this above and beyond the funding sorry I do just want to make I guess a a comment in general um so I think the last I don't know one two three four four items that we've been talking about have been sewer related items right so I just want to give this you know Shameless plug about the support of the water and sewer department and obviously

the only way to fund this if it's coming through the Enterprise funds is the rates associated with that right so I think you know my colleagues just need to be cognizant of the fact that this is you know going to have an impact on you know storm water rates water rates but it's much needed as we can see because this has been ignored for quite some time I think we got to get to the to the

point where we have the planning uh utilizing you know additional monies through Grant monies and I think you do a phenomenal job of whether it's advocating farappa thank you for your attention you're welcome whether it's whether it's Apple money or or grant money to leverage so that we're not just you know going always to the taxpayer and the in the repairs

thank you have a good night so I I just wanna I wanna just you know make sure everybody understands that and just urge my colleagues to remember that when we go forward with budgets yeah the future yeah thank you very much yeah just you know I am I try to see go every single Grant opportunity possible so we don't have to uh affect the rate payers but everything does come down to the rates

when it comes back to it so there is no other funding for water or so I just like to say you probably know I always supported the water rates to go up to make sure that we take care of everything in my famous quote would be without water the city is nothing and you got Flint Michigan you've got the Hurricanes they've got no water they don't have anything and we started uh 23 24 years ago

with the project the the water lines and everything else not too many have done that but I think we're in good shape and we just got to support for the money that they need to do the work and that's the way it goes are you thank you my contribution was trying to offset the increase in water rates I tried very hard to do that you know but uh so do we have a motion motion to table

second all in favor aye opposed motion passes thank you thank you guys I'm here for the next one too okay next one thank you Mr Ferlin uh number seven resolution Committee on Public Works and transportation convened to discuss ways to keep residents informed of daily closures want me to read the resolution whereas there's currently a good deal of road construction causing many streets to be

temporarily closed whereas these closures cause traffic delays for residents commuting to school and work now therefore be it resolved it's Committee of Public Transportation can mean to discuss ways to keep residents informed daily screen street closures Council kadine uh so I would think that this is pretty easy to do right so dispatch gets notified of all the street closures shares it with police fire we

can just get it online so if you see the date on this is April um so since Charlie and I's involvement in this which is about aprilish we've worked closely with thank you the different departments the different contractors doing work in the city that's the majority of it is a little bit of utilities we've had monthly sometimes bi-weekly meetings with them they send us every day or two an update

of their street list what streets will be closing same thing for our city projects Lal construction Century anything that's going on construction wise in the city all now gets funneled through the mayor's office through Anne's office gets sent through I.T and gets posted on the city's website Facebook Instagram and Report gets sent to wsar you can hear it every morning when you're

driving into work they rattle through all of this I don't listen to wsa I don't need them anymore as long as it's not an election season um so I know I know the amount of work that's gone into this from everybody in the Thousand Direction and it gets funneled through one place so that it can be disseminated in a bunch of other places to let the people know I know for the first month

or two that I started calls that came in every day and mostly have to do with Liberty Utilities because when spring hit they were wild they were wild every day I can't get down my street I can't do this we've had meetings police chief involved fire chief uh deputy chief uh Castro we all sit in with Liberty Utilities and it is it is a session about you guys need to do better with your Road detour signs

with your police details fighting with with the police department and the unions are making sure details are being filled and all there have been there has been so much involved in the street construction stuff mostly triggered because of Liberty you know if Liberty was done with gas work you would probably see 10 of the construction going on but they they have to fix what they have to fix

and we're trying to do the best we can with that so as far as the notification stuff goes I think there's been drastic improvement from what it was prior to uh to April not to say that there can't be more places that we can send it to um but but I think they've done a pretty good job and I can say that the complaints have decreased by about 90 percent well

that's a good deal yeah the biggest point we get now is when Liberty leaves either materials pipe equipment or trucks on a street over the weekend and so over the winter I would like to discuss potentially maybe some other ordinances about how we can rein in some of the construction activities and what is left what was left behind um it's convenient for them but not convenient for the homeowners so

instruction season is wrapping up within the next few weeks and then we'll we'll want to revisit potentially how we handle next year with with their Onslaught on work so I think the mayor's office has done well and Anna's Ann is really she takes the reins of of this and she wants to know what are we doing every street and if it's if something goes overlaps a day and it's not on the

list and she drives by she's calling and she wants to know why wasn't it on the list again well we had two hours of work to finish well please you have to let us know so that we can update the list worst thing that someone can do is say my Street's closed it's not on any list so we try to make sure that that is not you know the normal situation not to

mention sometimes it interferes with trash pickup as well oh my God that's like trash pickup could now that I drive through the city more often I can't I can't believe how often I'm stuck behind a trash truck driving down a street that's got cars parked on each side and they have to pick up trash from the travel Lane with cars behind them there is no room for them to pull over

but I'm not involved in trash collection but so if you want to talk to Charlie about that he can stay and um I know the city administrator is still here my I have a question on the new website which we can advertise street closures on as well we'll hopefully we'll be online when I met with it today and we have uh street closures on the website so you can have the ability now right yeah we

have it now uh this morning I met with them and on the if you when you open up the website right on the front page it's on there it's as of today and if you go to the uh streets and highways on the uh DCM streets and highways and road work it's now linked to that also so once you hit the city website now uh recent uh Hot Topics right in there you had a shirt

right there yeah yeah now you had to search for it originally but now they've linked it right up so as soon as you go on uh street closures right there and we know how easy that website was to navigate and search for things well this one's easy oh the new web the new City website is it going live when's it going live um I would say early next year okay

well as long as we've made it easier and people only have to turn on the computer go to City of Fall River and it's right there that that that's another big help so it has been on there for a while but they changed the location to make it even easier something important and and Seth not gonna probably let you know but in the process of working towards the new website and he explained this to me is

we're actually making improvements to the site as it exists now so when everything moves over it moves over once so you're you're going to see drastic improvement probably in in some of the existing website as well just like something like this as we're we're charged with reviewing all of our Pages how can we make it work better so as time goes on we will be these are some of those changes you know you'll see

changes as it goes on there was so much uh Antiquated information and links that went nowhere so Seth's office has had us start cleaning all of those up putting together a list and so it is going through and trying to clean up the existing before so you don't want to migrate junk so hopefully what you have is a solid core that can migrate over so the city council might be listed under

government instead of a department before the new website comes on well so structurally it probably there won't be those changes so the structural changes are a little more challenging just because it has to do with the architecture of the site in terms of the currency the information that should improve yeah so small victories okay Council Bellator yeah you you know we get the notification in our packages I

do because I don't do email but this one's dated the October 28th and uh forever construction they got 12 street closures on this and uh you know you can call this but I guess it's easier when I cheat on them but uh we get the information so we just got to we're not worried about you getting the information it's the rest of the city yeah I know at least they're doing something anyway we

have it we have it and it comes in whenever what they've done is so on on the link that comes from Ferreira and Liberty yeah if you look at the the the list of who it goes to I think everybody I think everybody in the city probably gets it directly but that there's really only one name that matters and that's the mayor's office so that Ann can take that information and

put it on the different the different sites that we have it on I get them I get four of them from four different departments I get the one from planning I get the one from engineering I get them from everywhere so I I delete three emails and open one so share it share it no I don't need to share oh should Grant leave to a truck what was it Grant Leaf to which rock second

all in favor aye aye opposed eyes have it uh thank you gentlemen thank you all very much thank you for spending so much time with us tonight motion approve the minutes second hi listen to June second on favor aye Committee on Public Works of Transportation that's convened

thank you