The Fall River City Council meeting on February 15, 2022, commenced with public hearings on several curb removal requests and auto repair/body shop licenses. Most curb removal requests were approved, with one for People Incorporated at 1040 Eastern Avenue denied, and another for Lies Sajeda Begum at 248 Hancock Street approved with a stipulation for a double permit fee due to work being done without prior approval. Auto repair shop licenses for Elio Yoon's dba Coastal Fuel and Corey Enterprises dba Duchesne's Body Repair were also approved. A significant portion of the early meeting was dedicated to presenting citations to the Fall River Fire Department, Emergency Management Agency, Emergency Medical Services, and Police Department, as well as firefighter Brandon Orbit, for their heroic efforts during a multi-family house fire on Irving Street.
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city council public hearings will now come to order madam clerk counselors kadeem camara here dion here kilby here lee here bellatier pereira here proposal yeah and president pursuant to the open meeting law any person may make an audio or video recording of this public meeting or may transmit the meeting through any medium attendees are therefore advised that such recordings or transmissions are
0:43being made whether perceived or unperceived by those present and are deemed acknowledged and permissible item one is a curb removal mohamed mur 84 progress street for the removal of curbing as follows 60 feet of existing driveway on 84 progress street eight feet of a proposed driveway access for a total access of 24 feet motion open ocean open the public hearing has been made second by councillor kilby seconded by
1:15counselor dion are there any proponents calling any proponents if you'd like to come down to the microphone state your name and address for the record please hi good evening uh mohammed bier 84 progress street if you could just turn push my car thank you um 84 progress street uh i'm mohammed mir the owner of the house uh i bought the house in 2020 august and right before the closing they sent
1:41me an email that is they were cutting the driveway because of like a water drainage system or something like so i found out after it wasn't that you need permission to have a 24 feet driveway and he didn't he made it 24 should be 18.
1:58so i came here and that's what they explained me so i just was requesting permission to because they cut on both sides he had to cut it before the closing because it got inspected and uh he wasn't allowed to bake at 24 so it's just cut on each side four feet it's just all mud and uh just requesting so i can fill it up again and you know because i bought use both the
2:20garage you know for the cars and it's just all muddy and so just a request i was uh trying to have permission to if i can you know fill it up and make it a full driver so it looks good too you know at the house thank you that was all that was it you know that was the request thank you thank you any opponents calling any opponents is it saying none motion closing hearing emotional closing
2:46second has been made by councillor pereira seconded by council dion all in favor aye opposed so voted item two is scott mello for 586 slade street for the removal of curbing is there a motion open hearing motion open motion open the hearing made by council raposo seconded by councillor pereira all in favor all right opposed calling any proponents any proponents did you want to speak sir no
3:16calling any opponents any opponents saying no the petitioner has an example i'm sorry motion closed motion closed made by council lee seconded by council kilby all in favor all right opposed so voted item three main property investments llc 362nd street motion open emotional meeting made my counselor poses second by counselor dion all in favor aye opposed any proponents are there any proponents
3:51i'm sorry any proponents sitting down any opponents seeing none motion to close motion of clothes made by counselor dion seconded by council raposo in favor aye opposed so voted item four paula mayer 466 warren street for the removal of curbing on warren street motion open motion to open the meeting made by council lilly seconded by councillor raposo all in favor aye opposed any proponents wishing to speak
4:22any opponents wishing to speak seeing none promotional
4:36that is it for our public hearings these will be voted on for anyone that's here these will be voted on later in the agenda and you'll get um if you don't feel like staying you'll hear from the clerk tomorrow thank you madam president i think we still have two as items
5:11public hearing for auto repair shops elio yoon's 54 blackstone street dva coastal fuel for a license to operate an auto repair shop at 1082 north main street motion to open motion open made by council dion seconded by councillor kilby any proponents wishing to speak any opponents seeing none emotional close seconds made by councillor dion seconded by councillor lee all in favor aye opposed you guys have it
5:42the second auto body shop ravi corey 10 westminster street fall river and sameen michael corey 29 garden street cumberland rhode island corey enterprises dba duchesne's body repair for a license to operate an auto body shop at 751 eastern avenue on lot j 1956.
6:01emotional open motion open made by kelsey dion seconded by kelsey pereira all in favor all right any opposed are there any proponents wishing to speak any proponents seeing i came in person this evening i might as well address council good evening madam president members of the council i represent quarry enterprise they were duchene's auto body has been in business since at least 1959 at this location
6:34during this covet crisis the both corey boys were stuck in the republic of lebanon could not get back in time to fill out the renewal application we came back we filled out the application except it couldn't get processed through on a timely basis therefore we were forced to file an initial application to restart um the business so that's really why we're here procedurally to make sure
6:58that we're in compliance with the city uh requirements thank you thank you thank you thank you any opponents any opponents seeing none motion to close the hearing made by councillor dion seconded by council prayer all in favor all right post the eyes have it thank you thank you yes motion
7:48we have some citations to present and uh mayor cooking if you want to join us oh i'm sorry motion to close the public hearing monster clothes made by councillor kelly seconded by council raposo all in favor all right opposed do we need to make a motion to take the citations out of order that's what i was just asking madam clerk she said we don't okay thank you council kilby do you want to join us as
8:16well it's okay it's on behalf of the entire council so madam president is appropriate
8:32we have members from the fall river fire department we have the fire chief the police department form of emergency medical services and the fall river emergency management agency
8:59and firefighter brandon orbit who is off duty do you want to go ahead there we're going to do this together go ahead okay so uh we're going to i'm going to say this once we have to say it over and over again um in my role as mayor i do try to get around a lot i don't get up here enough i appreciate you let me come and speak
9:27to you tonight uh it means a lot to me but at the same time uh the night of the fire on irving street i was uh i was going to see what was going on and i remember i ran into two florida policemen and they told me do not go up that street but i went up anyway and i saw a group of men fighting wind snow double parked cars
9:53fire flying everywhere and it was a very very dangerous sight i didn't go near it of course i stayed away from it on the other side of the street but these guys fought for as long as i was there and i left when all but one more of the building had come down and they uh protected an entire neighborhood and as far as i'm concerned they went over and above their
10:13traditional duties and that's why i was talking to the council president and and other members i think we should go out of our way to acknowledge the effort they put in that night on irving street between the cars double park the win the inability to get to the site they did a great job and they saved a number of houses because uh like that could have been the notre dame
10:34fire where they just spun right down the street driven by wind so i want to acknowledge this great group of guys and all the men that worked with them that night on this fire and i think we should single them out i just don't know what the order is you want to give the citations out in okay cool thank you and i want to thank councillor kilby for putting these citations in on on behalf
10:53of the council i know um council vice president and myself were talking throughout the day and and throughout this fire and there was i'm sure all of you saw videos on on social media that the house to the right was one single driveway length away and the fact that they were able to save the fire stop the fire from from heading in that direction and not causing any more damage or loss is
11:17amazing i know there's actually one fire fighter here who was off duty um but lives in the house next door and ran into that house and alerted um the people that were living there that there was a fire and got them all out safely and we thank him very much for that and everybody that was uh on scene that day we your work was very appreciated it was really over and above
11:42so why don't we start with that individual first because you know he's right in front of us he uh looks like one of my students from dirk yeah because i don't know how old this guy is i'll read this once in recognition of the heroic efforts of all the people there and service to the citizens of fall river and fighting the fire located at 140 early street and his spectacular individual efforts highlights that
12:07the effort put forth by all the people there and this says in recognition of the heroic efforts and dedicated service to the citizens of fall river and firing the fire located at 140 irving street presented to firefighter brandon orbit okay
12:48so again i'm not going to read the exact same citation wording which is on here but um obviously the fire department was front and center of this fire um i was joking with the chief today i was going to write him up because i saw him dangerously jumping over a fence to lug a hose to the back to try to save the house but that's the kind of effort these guys
13:08did they went over and above the traditional duties to make sure that neighborhood was safe and i appreciated the horror fire thank you very much
13:46huh next up is the four river emergency uh medical services or management services they put medical online so long long but i know what they did that night and those guys grounded out keeping the men protected safe and warm and making sure they were able to fight the fire they did a great job
14:41all right so also on the scene all night another heroic group of guys making sure that people were being carted away from the fire including injured firemen that were hurt at the scene that night they're there at every event i've been to whatever the catastrophe is they're right out in front and center also our ems guys uh time
15:21as the mayor said we did have two firefighters that were injured that night one of them happens to be the husband of a friend of mine and and she called at nine o'clock at night and said um he's in the hospital and i i can't get out of my driveway she lives in somerset and i called the mayor and uh and i called the union president and
15:40said how do we how do we get her to the hospital and the mayor called the chief of staff they within two minutes they had two paramedics on the way over to somerset not only did they pick her up and drive her to the hospital but while she was there because they couldn't even get down her street they made some calls of their own and they had her street plowed over in somerset so that when
16:01they delivered him back home later on in the evening they were able to get to his driveway and get him home safely it was a very busy night finally and of course last but not least they managed the whole scene from the public safety perspective they tried to tell me not to go up that street they gave me a fair warning but i didn't listen they did a great great job that night
16:26for the for the residents of this city four of a police department and senator duart was on was on scene that night
17:00pictures
17:09okay
17:19thank you
17:45oh my goodness don't wait you're not saying are you negative
18:25he was on the phone
18:47it's coming in
19:05sorry
19:20he's out there finance city council committee on finance will now come called come to order madam clerk counselors kadeem here camara dion here kilby here lee here pelletier herrera here proposal yep and president liberty labeau here person went to the open meeting law any person may make an audio or video recording of this public meeting or may transmit the meeting through any medium attendees are
19:57therefore advised that such recordings or transmissions are being made whether perceived or unperceived by those present and are deemed acknowledged and permissible first item is citizens input is there anyone speaking on citizens input anyone sign up madam clerk no one signed in anything sent in we do have one written communication
20:32madam president members of the city council i want to thank you for the opportunity to express some concerns for the city of fall river first i want to call your attention to the letter to the city council regarding the five-year financial projections the mayor clearly states that he will be providing a balanced fy 23 budget yet he claims that he will using be using opera funds to balance this budget
20:55opera funds are one-time money and by including arpa money in the process of balancing a budget leaves the city open to more deficits in the future use of the opera funds should be used in the capital improvement planning if possible why while i am aware that the city is having financial difficulties nothing the mayor or the city council is doing is working to alleviate those shortfalls
21:18the mayor further states that expense reductions will result from increased efficiencies what expense reductions is the mayor speaking about where are these financial cuts going to be made the mayor then states that the city is expanding ems services and consolidating fire and ems which is supposed to increase revenues to support these departments in actuality because ems is an enterprise
21:41account it can only support the ems services department it cannot by construction support via services it also does not contribute to the city of fuller's budgetary needs the mayor also claims that there is expected health care increased increases costs yet the consultants have not projected any health care cost increases and as a matter of fact the city is expecting a two million dollar savings
22:07by converting retirees to a premium based plan while i am not saying that the mayor's projections are lies there is absolute there's obviously some misrepresentations in some lack of necessary information while section 6-9 is clear on presentations it is unclear on what if any the city council can do to refute or reject these projections and capital improvement plans secondly the diamond regional project is
22:35coming before the city council for proposed approval for the building of a 293 million dollar school building while i appreciate the educational programs that is offered by diamond i believe that this is the wrong time to be requesting that the city of fall river incur the 77 percent burden 225 million six hundred and ten thousand dollars at a time when the fall river property owner is being required to pay
23:02for the new durfee high school full river taxes and fees are becoming more and more burdensome on the city property owner and it is becoming a better option for the property owner to sell their property and move away from the city many of the property owners have been lifelong residents and many are feeling pushed out of their homes and the city they grew up in lived in and raised families in
23:24this is a combination of the relative inaction of the city council to control and rein in spending and unnecessary hiring and administration which currently and has historically chosen to hire people for positions that they were not qualified for or worse were no-show jobs and are high-paying and the city council approves those contractual hires fall river is not an employment agency and remember that every contract
23:48approved by the city council will have long-term financial burdens on the floor of a taxpayer fall river contracts are presented to the city council with little to no financial impact reports and i am pleased to see that the city council may be asking for those impact reports on future contracts do not limit those reports to collective bargaining agreements require them for every contract and be sure that each
24:12contract has a disciplinary clause that resolves the city of any liability to pay off those contracts if a person is fired with cause we have seen too many people get terminated and we see and we the taxpayer have to pay off their contracts the lack of a disciplinary clause is so that friends of elected officials are taken care of in the case of an unlikely termination if the private sector
24:38in the private sector if someone is terminated for cause no golden parachute exists so that there is a huge payout upon employment termination in dealing with the section of contracts as well as reported by an independent review the city of fall river must end the practice of unlimited comp time accrual this results in positions going vacant for long periods of time and great expense to the people of fall river and
25:02unnecessary reductions in necessary services like public safety i thank you for your time and listening in some of to some observations respectfully cj ferry item two is the five-year capital improvement plan it's on our agenda for discussion if the members of the administration would come down
25:40so the public is aware pursuant to article six of the city's charter i am submitting for your review and approval the five-year capital improvement plan for the city of fall river we have worked with the city departments to assemble this document based on their current and future needs we are prepared to make a presentation in support of the capital improvement plan pursuant to the charter the city council
26:00is required to conduct a public hearing and adopt the plan no later than march 1st 2022 we welcome your input and are happy to discuss the plan with you gentlemen
26:33floor is yours if you'd like to give a summary of the plan and then we'll open it up from the council wait for you to say okay no okay um i'm here tonight uh with the city administrator uh we submitted the uh capital law improvement plan for your review i mean the first thing i need to point out is is that you know the capital plan is really a a living document
27:03and at this stage of the game i mean due to the chatter when you when you have to receive it it's a little bit of my opinion ahead of time because the this is a this needs document that you have in front of you is it shows the five-year needs developed by each and every one of your departments and again the key word is in capital needs plan doesn't mean that it's necessarily going to get
27:27funded in the in the year that you know that the their set their priorities and that's who set these priorities is each individual department for example if you go to the parks they've got various uh they're showing they need a kubota for snow removal equipment well during the budget process which is starting as we speak i mean now that we've collected uh most of the budgets i think we're
27:52still waiting for maybe one budget and that's the police budget because they've had a lot of uh changes and and things going on in the police department so that budget should be in any minute now and once we receive all those budgets we will start to set up meetings with the city administrator and bring the mayor in as as needed to go over the budgets and at that point in time we'll really get into the
28:15nitty-gritty of whether or not uh some of this equipment which is one time or is it repetitive replacement equipment can it be paid for out of federal funds are there grants available et cetera and i know that most of you councils have heard this before i'm sure over over the past several years you know and uh one thing the city is in a great position right now due to the change in the use of arbor funds
28:40and of course the mayor is is looking at those funds and hopefully using the majority of that money as you probably already know for capital projects in the city i mean there's one that he's committed to which is i think it's a water project that's like i think it's around 8.2 million dollars so i mean that's that that's gonna that's going to have a major impact you know those type because in my
29:02opinion there's never going to be enough money in a city or town to really fund all the capital needs that are needed and the uh and especially water and sewer especially when communities like a community like fall river has an excellent water system but it's it's aging you know and that's the same issue that that occurs in a lot of the older so-called gateway uh cities so i don't know what you exactly what you
29:28want to do you want me to run through this with you because like i said we're going to be re this plan was was prepared sometime say probably the last maybe the week the last week of a couple of weeks of december and then i made a couple of additions to what i wanted i added the uh veterans department based on conversations that the new veterans agent had with the with the former uh chief finance officer
29:54and i thought that was a good idea so that the council would be aware of exactly what the veterans department needs in the way of buses because in the past forward has been very fortunate you've had vehicles donated you've gotten them on low 20 grants and uh that's a good thing i mean we're in the process right now of uh we've applied for a couple of free buses
30:17believe it or not i mean when i hear the word free i get a little i get a little concerned but i guess another community through the department of transportation has given up their transportation due to cobit a lot of the issues they had they've decided to take a different direction and outsource so they've made these buses available there's an example of what i mean by it's on the capitol plan
30:39but with with uh we've made the application and we'll see what happens with that you know through the veterans uh agent thank you i don't know what you had in mind you want me to just run through this or you want to you want a little overview or some of the counselors have questions so we'll start there council vice president dion good evening thank you for being here um on the school side i'm looking at the
31:03capital improvements and i know we're not talking about the um financial forecasts at the moment but what with the opera funding and everything one can offset the other so my i guess what i'm getting at is if we utilize opera funding correctly we can benefit on both fronts um you know we've had discussions about putting more money into water and sewer infrastructure which obviously down the road will would
31:35help ease the burden for the taxpayers uh help to improve our projects would help us with bonding that we might be able to bond for something else that we may not have before so they both kind of go hand in hand i guess what i'm getting at also is the fact that we're going to have additional funding on the school side we're going to have to come up with additional monies for net school spending
31:58so are there any projects in the capital plan that the school side can take up as opposed to it being on the city side in this on in these capital plans i mean the short answer to that if you don't mind stuff is uh that that that's true i mean they have available funds they have different pockets of funds they've got i forget the total total amount that they've got allocated to them for a
32:25two-year period but it's uh they have their own resources and at this point i haven't yet met and i don't i don't know exactly when they're going to be making their uh budget presentation to the uh uh the school committee i don't think they've had their uh nothing i'm aware of anyway but i haven't really met with them but that that's exactly right you're going to get an opportunity but a lot of the items
32:49that you see on this on their capital list we can look at you know will be looked at and and again with the eye that it would be great it'd be a great perfect world if you could take the items that are really uh one time things that you're going to create in a long period of time you know just picking this thing out when i'm looking at you know uh asbestos removal at the uh
33:12at the uh talbot middle school i mean i would certainly hope that would be a one-time deal i mean we don't wanna we wouldn't think that something like that so a lot of money can be loosened up and have an impact on the uh on the bargaining unit that's why this is just an observation on my part i was a little concerned when i saw the charter changes as to the timing of when the capital improvement
33:35committee plan was being submitted and even on the projection i mean things have that five year just a digress from that that five year financial projections were done you're talking early december maybe even a little earlier things have changed pretty drastically i mean you know that major snowstorm that we had uh a week ago put a major dent you know in the uh in the projections
33:59for example for snow removal now that's something we got to deal with um the good news is that we still have a little over 1.6 million in surplus revenue and we're already seven and a half months into the you know into the fiscal year so i mean that's a that's a good thing and i think fall river's done a great job in the last several years of building up their uh stab fund
34:23i mean there's like at this point and of course every year you'd like to make a contribution to the stab fund instead of always taking money out you know because you still have that money that you can use for certain uh capital projects and uh did a great job i mean i think the stab fund right now has got about seven and a half maybe seven point four million dollars you know in the stab
34:44fund and that's that's great now because i know that in addition to um another 10 million being put into water and sewer um projects or infrastructure um there's also i've discussed and asked because the administration has asked for various ideas thoughts et cetera um that in terms of public safety that we take some of this opera funding to replace apparatus that's desperately needed so again that would
35:10be something that would take part of it off the table right and you know make it easier to start the cycle and moving forward be able to get all the apparatus that we need um with that i'll yield for now thank you thank you counselor at c5 council lee thank you for coming um so just what we normally try to do during these meetings is we all most of us know that
35:38this isn't definite this isn't concrete um it's a moving document right and it's estimated so we walk into this knowing that and we're not going to come here five years later and say where was this you know i hope so i mean i hope you know that walking into this i know um but we do see figures on these documents that sometimes we do have to have questions answered for because people now that
36:02this is a public document people are going to look at this as well and want answers so um one of the water and sewer infrastructure has been a big topic that i've been bringing up since opera came up i i've multiple times told my opinions on how i feel the administration has kind of squandered the opportunity with the arpa funding um to really address our sewer and and water infrastructure needs however um
36:26the biggest issue and i'm i'm sure maybe people have different opinions but the biggest issue that has continually always reared its head over the past several years is our sanitation trash disposal costs things like that so on our last line on page 11 um on the dcm line and i've noticed it with dcm lines and some of the other line items but in this one specifically in fiscal year 2027 we have 20 million dollars
36:55um put in that figure in that line and um you see it correct yeah okay and i assume that's uh we've had conversations in the past about this i assume that's based on based on the need for a transfer station correct so my understanding is i i mean straightforward i mean i'm really not looking at 2027 at this point other than on on what you see well that's why i started my questioning with that premise
37:24because i'm not gonna you know i don't think this is a figure we can hold everyone to right now we don't know what's gonna happen in the next four years or so however um what are the plans what what has been talked about as options for this because when miss when council vice president spoke about how water and so infrastructure needs can help bring costs down for taxpayers in my opinion this is the biggest thing um
37:50that can help bring costs down um we've had we're gonna have these tug of war battles on on bags and everything else uh very soon i'm sure and something like this even though it's a big investment um i'm i'm even though i've multiple times been a no vote to a lot of raises and fees and things like that i am not a nova when it comes to investment that can mean long-term uh costs you know
38:17being decreased for for everyday taxpayers so um something like this is something i would be interested in in knowing i think the public would would be interested in knowing what the progress is what the plan is and what what is is this something that's actually tangible in the future for us because once we have that investment made we can now then plan to see how we can start a capital savings plan and not
38:39just a spending plan because these are this is a spending plan and you know government spend money i guess i guess that happens but very rarely do we have an opportunity to bring a savings to to the taxpayer and i think this is this is actually a potential opportunity for that in the long term when you look at how expensive um disposal costs can be from recycling and from solid waste uh if we're able to
39:04have something like this invested in the city we and i'm not saying the transfer station but any something like this something that would help us bring these costs down we're looking at potential savings long term um and and with diamond around the corner with durfee around the corner we're going to be putting a lot of burden on the taxpayer right now and you know so i i keep my
39:24eyes open on these kind of things so has there been any discussion about that has there been any tangible plans as far as that goes for this so i should put this a little far away there has been however my my response is probably not going to be satisfying uh because i will say that as much as there's been a lot of discussion uh this is uh uh unbelievably kind of vexing issue uh
39:50it's as we know taken down uh previous administrations or at least made it very much more difficult for them to function and so i think everyone understands that the solutions here are not easy i will say that the first when i was a young lieutenant army engineers uh one of the things they always talk about is critical path that you need to in any project understand the steps that need to happen uh in
40:15order for those next steps to to you know be feasible right and so i think that in this particular problem there is a critical path that you need to follow and it probably needs to start with dealing with commercial uh waste management before you deal with the residential question uh so that's probably the biggest thing that's being talked about right now how do we deal with the the businesses that are in this city
40:40and how they pay for trash how trash is removed how we have them paying a fair share of their trash removal costs that in and of itself even before you get to that the problem that multiplies it many more times when you talk talk about just residential uh residences um that's fairly complicated and so we're looking at a lot of different options right now uh my hope my belief is that the mayor will
41:08probably be prepared to start talking details uh in the next several months um because we're we're looking very seriously at a couple different options at which point we're gonna be looking for uh council input uh on what the best thing for the residents of the city of fall river would be what the best thing for the businesses in the city of hollywood because we want to be a good place to to do and start businesses
41:31but at the same time businesses need to pay their fair share it's only fair and that's probably the first thing we're looking at before we go to the next step which is residential removal my understanding is that 20 million dollars at this point really represents a placeholder that could in fact be a transfer station uh but at this point i'm not really prepared to say for certain what what
41:53that looks like um because i don't think anyone settled on that being the solution right and and i and i agree with that i don't necessarily believe it's the 100 solution right now in fiscal year 2020 too but i do think that we a conversation needs to start at least now and i believe there's a task force i think there's a task force maybe i'm not sure but i think there was
42:17a task force at one point in time that was supposed to be talking about these things i'm not sure where that is right now but i do think that this is going to come i guarantee that this is going to come again as another topic of we need to have this fee we need to have this thing we need to have council c1 will definitely be telling us that we need that i guarantee that and
42:39and this is this is the kind of investment that we're going to need to stave off that every day slamming down in the taxpayers pocket all over again so without a yield thank you thank you counselor seat one concert team thank you madam president um is my mic on can you hear me no you don't sound loud can you hear me okay as long as you can hear me and i can get
43:06my seth do you have a microphone in front of you i do okay it's a little soft as long as i can get my questions answered i'm good so uh just and i appreciate it i think the documents that we have here before us tonight um unfortunately the timing issue as mr capone talk about um all these documents are dead on arrival from from my standpoint and i think it's unfortunate
43:30you know when we start talking about the city charter that the you know and i understand there was a lot of work that was put into the city charter but it's unfortunate that you know folks um who are on the stage really truly don't have a a good understanding of municipal government because i think the two documents before us um truly need to be before us uh with the budget uh because i think that's
43:51when we have all the documents that we as a legislative body need to to make educated decisions on that being said one of the if we're talking about the documents and improving the documents and i know we've got a lot of new leadership or key members on on the leadership team in the administration team but one of the things that i talked about especially with the capital improvement plan or the capital needs
44:15capital improvement needs as you have it titled is that in order for us to really kind of evaluate this we we really need to have an inventory list so i i think one of the things here and i mentioned it to the prior cfo is is that we need to know what the inventory and facility lists look like because without knowing what our building infrastructure looks like in terms of
44:40condition you know the useful life is it at the end of the useful life i'm not sure how we're able to vote based on priorities that are presented to us by the administration and i know that's a tall task because we've got a number of buildings we've got another a number of other um inventory items that i that i think um would be very difficult to obviously get into one document and it would take some
45:03time but i think over the next couple of years i would like to see this improvement plan really kind of improve a little bit in terms of just making sure that we have that list so that even though we don't have an item that appears on this five-year forecast we can turn to you know the fire department and say where are we with our roofs right in terms of building infrastructure um is there a
45:25roof that needs to be replaced in you know 2025 and is that more important than um a kubota for snow removal right those are the types of things that i think we need to have because the documents that we have here are obviously based right now simply on the prior priorities of department heads and and the department head is always going to you know advocate for their department specifically and it's almost like
45:47they're looking at it from a silo standpoint you know the administration has to look at the entire city and so then the priorities change right and from our standpoint as we're looking for the um you know the priorities for the entire city we need to be asking those types of questions and i think right now it's difficult to do that and quite frankly we don't have a recommendation from you folks i know we've got
46:08roughly 16 million dollars in fy23 but we don't know if that's what the administration wants to spend for capital improvement like you had mentioned we don't know where we stand with the budget we don't know if you've incorporated some of these capital items within the operating budget or if you're going to take it from opera money or are we going to ask the schools to pick it up on their side
46:28uh with regards to their budgeting so i think those types of conversations need to take place and and from my standpoint i hope that these reports just we we kind of improve them as as we move forward so in terms of that just talking about the process and just the timeline so we have to have the budget before us uh by we'll stop having discussions by by june right is the administration anticipating on
46:54bringing us recommendations for capital improvement items as well in terms of uh items that are going to be outside of the the general fund so bonding so we can have a list of at least priorities from the administration to say this is what we really want to include in the capital items theoretically but i can't speak to what those are at this point no no i'm not looking for what they are but can we can
47:13we expect to see those capital items so that you know of the 16 million dollars you know you paid it down to maybe five or 10 million dollars so that we know for the given year that we can expect at least 10 million dollars of bond authorization to cover if if that's where we're going for for debt um to cover these capital items i expect that'll be the case okay perfect and then the
47:36i guess the last question i really have is just looking at this i know we have school items that are included so the estimated cost there is 34 million dollars how does how are we incorporating those requests are those requests coming directly from the school department and has that been i guess my concern is 34 million dollars here over a five-year period um is that coming from the administration
48:00or is that approval from the school committee i don't know if it's approval from the school committee but it's what's been discussed with it with their needs on you know whether it's actually been put in front of the school committee i don't really know that at this point so i guess i would only uh ask or request that you know moving forward that we just have the discussion with the school administration to see
48:23that they actually make sure that these capital requests are truly what they're looking for and that there hasn't been any change in priorities from their standpoint and that they have been once they're submitted submitted they've been reviewed and approved by the school committee so that we know at least from an administration standpoint that it's already been vetted on that side so we're not approving any
48:44capital items that the school committee is not really in favor of that make sense okay without a yield thank you anything further from the council conservancy date counselor proposal hello um i'm just curious the last meeting i had asked on the status of the idle capital projects that we have i haven't gotten that update yet no you won't because i'm i'm reviewing it because it's and i mean i don't want to go all over
49:10the place but just recently for example uh we uh we i found an opportunity where the city could refund it's it's sort of a strange thing some 2012 bonds in the tune of like 39 million so what we did is when we went and did the borrowing and the last uh seems like it went on forever but i've been trying to bring bring the city auditor and the treasurer in the loop
49:34with me so that they did basically all of the leg work so that hopefully the next time you're going to borrow some money they could even do it they could do it to the city treasury and the city audit they could do it themselves you know with without a lot of support but in saying that we refunded like i think it was like 39 million dollars worth of bonds and they
49:54were issued in 2012 so they're at that 10-year mark okay and uh we ended up saving like uh i think was 100 000. now we got to go back and allocate figure out what we save for water sewer and general fun during that time frame so we're going to see about 100 000 savings over the next 10 years that's a million bucks that's a lot of money i mean it's you know a lot of people
50:18don't may not think so but it's a lot of money but now we need to slot it back in and a lot what i'm telling you this this takes a little bit of time to you know to get it slotted in and along with that i'm looking at the projects because they need we need to sign off on the inactive accounts to make sure that they're done and closed some communities now are using what they
50:40call closeout reports and they actually produce a document so that the right people sign off when i want to projects if you if you borrow 200 000 and you build something they actually they do what they call a close-out reports we i did it for years with the community preservation uh act accounts i always wanted to know when those things were done you know and they were completed and
51:04everybody was happy you know like stuff so that's just a possibility and that's why you end up with that but that that won't take much longer but it will take a little longer so when my partner said you won't and what he meant is you won't see it as quickly as you like because we're in a process and we're working on it yeah fair enough there we go and in the process you're talking
51:24about in that savings are we going to be able to see exactly how that breakdown looks like oh yeah yeah i know i know i'll know exactly where the doll is at when when do you expect that well i have it it's just a matter of digging my hands into it and pulling it out because there was a lot of different bonds that were issued during 2012 they will you know they were long-term bonds so
51:44there's a combination of the like i said water sewer general fund so i really just need to look at it and we can produce a little document that shows that so next month two weeks april am i going to be here uh yeah i know that uh yeah no i i'm not not fooling around i mean it'll be relatively soon because i do have the uh the information that i need i just need it called out
52:08just as a just for the council's edification one of the reasons why some of the things that uh ed is doing might be taking a little bit longer than we ordinarily would like is that he's also bringing our treasure collector as well as our auditor uh into the process so um you know one of the things that you know emergency services military anybody knows is really important it's redundancy and the ability for one
52:36person to step in and do something if the person is doing it goes down or at least and so uh so part of ed's process that i've seen that has been really remarkable but has certainly made it a little more of a teaching process uh as much as an operational one is that he's bringing folks into the process and teaching them as we go so i do believe that's going to yield
52:58dividends but i apologize that it's it's not been as productive as quickly as we'd like it to be and i work by time i want to make sure that's very clear so i want to echo what counseling once said about the descriptions of some of these things when i look at this and again being the new guy in the room you know i look at the mis budget proposed needs it's very very detailed
53:28of why they why they're going for that when i look down the rest of it some of it's very vague some of it has no description at all so i'm just curious you know like council c1 said it as we move forward to expand on this but i guess my question is when you go to the department heads and ask them what are your needs what is the process that happens outside
53:49of that simple question like is there justification behind why they ask for these things other than well we need it yeah there are actually because just recently with the for example with your veterans agent year of the vehicle how many miles are on it simple things like that council kadeem makes a good point this this needs to have another informational carbon in there which describes this information i'm seeing
54:17some of it in their budget requests like for example uh i just saw the technology budget oh my god it's it's got a lot of information in it i mean even to the point where some departments would send an invoice on what they paid for the vehicle but they got the general idea so i but i didn't i didn't uh put out the information on the i mean i wasn't part of the process and
54:41collecting the cip but but these are the things that as we move forward in the future i think that seth will uh he can he can see that that's the direction and get more information on the document so that everybody shares it and gets it gets a view of the same thing yeah i mean i i think i'd like to see like for example going the first one of the the kubota and the snow removal
55:02directly from from the horse's mouth per se to say why exactly do we need this is it something we're replacing right from there yeah not nothing but if you'll notice when you run across the top see it says kubota snow removal equipment and you're looking it says replacement it says no and i'm going okay so they want to they want to add another piece of equipment but you're right it needs
55:26it needs to be a little bit more because because you assume they they need it so i think we should add another column to this if no why what's the need is there lack of equipment is something else broken whatever then he just needs more description on it well it's there but they didn't fill it out so so the question of what's the process um i can say that i don't necessarily know
55:52what the process was um and there may not have been a process just because maybe all the folks weren't in place to to enforce or request a process i will say that so this is about exactly four weeks or at least 30 days for me on this this job and um since starting one of the the first things i tried to do not you know it wasn't even really intentional just like i want to get to
56:15know who everyone is and you see a need when you do it is meet with every department head and in doing that one of the biggest questions is okay what do you need what do you need to succeed and why and a lot of times you know the response uh and you know i've been really impressed with with certainly the quality of the people and the quality of
56:33the work but a lot of times just out of habit the response can be well this is what we've always done so we want to continue to do it this way and so the request i've been making around you know the resources that people are looking for is bring me some metrics bring me actually some numbers as to why this is a necessary thing and why this solution you're proposing
56:53works so it's not just the need but rather you know i expect that if somebody comes and identifies a need they're going to also identify a solution and a good example is um i was meeting with laura from the traffic department the other day and she was proposing some new safety measures for crosswalks and other things and had some ideas as to what those measures should be and the
57:16question i had for her was well do these work how do you know these work and she was able to her credit to come up with actually state level statistics as to the difference between crosswalks that had you know one thing versus the other it's like okay great that makes sense and it turns out we're actually able to pay for them with a grant so even better um so you know there are departments
57:38that are already thinking that way and that's fantastic there are others that need to get closer to it um you know you know i just i went on a tour of all the fire stations recently just to understand what we have to understand uh what apparatus are there to understand whether or not the facilities are appropriate for the firefighters who have to live there for uh you know nine 24-hour shifts a month and
58:03whether or not the apparatus that are there are sufficient for the communities they serve so that was a starting point we talked about roofs we talked about garage doors we talked about all the different aspects of what life in a place like that and maintenance of it in the foreseeable future would look like and now it's kind of that's my start of of the inventory that i think will give context to this
58:28uh it's going to take a little while but it's something that i think is is incredibly necessary because just like i need to have the requests that department heads are making justified when they're asking and talking to me about it the city council is certainly you know well within any measure of its of its rights to to very appropriately demand some justification it's and metrics for the things that are
58:51being put in this list so we're going to try to do that thank you gentlemen i yield thank you before i recognize councilman see one again does anyone else want to speak concerned seat seven because of pereira i think you're right uh mr aya capone about the timing of this i think everybody was on board with looking at changing the charter and i think in my opinion it was an abysmal
59:11failure everything that's gone to court is a challenge has lost and we paid an attorney to oversee that so with that being said i'm not satisfied with with what came out of that but i i think when you're looking at asking people what their needs are for certain departments what they need to have replaced when did they first get it and how long has it been because i think that you need to look at the facilities
59:38maintenance department and make sure that things are maintained if they're maintained properly it's going to last you longer i know that you know in a certain uh authority here uh somebody goes in and their carpenter so they put in a new door but if you don't get a painter to go over and paint that door for 18 months now the door is walked and they need to buy another door before
1:00:06they can paint it so and that doesn't happen here that i'm giving an example of the housing authority and i think that's crazy and the same thing here when we talk about you know what we're going to do with trash i think that facility itself needs a cleanup it needs a facelift it's horrible it's old and dirty and ancient and that's something that we need to take care of but then again
1:00:30we're still paying 450 000 a year on trucks that we don't have anymore right mr iacopone what's what are we still paying on those trucks that we sold yeah you're right yeah yeah so there's almost uh a half a million dollars of trash money that's going to pay for something we don't have granted it wasn't this administration and it wasn't some of the counselors that are on here but you know when you look long range
1:00:57that was a mess up and it was a mess up to get rid of bags and everything else because every community around us has bags or has some kind of a fee and they can't dump it they're bringing it here so not only um you know are we not making money on having bags or some kind of a fee but we're also getting increased tonnage from all over the place and then you
1:01:19know to go to commercial or to go to six families you tell me what person lives in a six or six apartment third floor apartment that doesn't want to rather be living in a single family home or a two-family home so again we're going to go to the to the you know not the lowest of the lowest but we're going to go to the people who really can't afford
1:01:39a whole lot better and and i think that that's crazy i think it's got to be across the board one of my colleagues uh council lee talked about the um trash task force and dion and i are on that and we received an email with a couple of dates of a meeting i put i was available every one of those meetings i believe counselor dion did as well and we haven't heard back so maybe
1:02:04administration needs to push whoever is leading that committee to get that committee back on track because that is definitely something that we need to do and we talk about a lot of the opera money going to the water department water is premier in this city and we have a lot of it and i wish that there was a way that we could sell some of it i know that they've tried but it's not
1:02:28only doing piping underground and you know in infrastructure uh with pipes but also looking at the filtration plant there are four bins there they need to be cleaned they need to be maintained they repaired one by taking parts from another that's the same thing you did with the incinerator for how many years you bought from peter to pay paul put it in when the state came down that one was okay
1:02:53you borrowed back and forth the city is known for doing that rather than doing things the right way and sometimes the right way costs a little bit more but in the long run you're going to save you know you don't worry about the dollars you're spending worry about the pennies because they turn into dollars and sometimes we don't have that um i don't know we don't have that thought process that we're worth it everyone
1:03:15wants premier but wants to pay bronze doesn't happen doesn't happen um and i'd like to see some money be used to that and i'd like to see more spent on streets can upper money be used for streets because our streets are a mess with the snow and everything we've had and i still say we need to go after you know any companies that are digging up the streets that they repair them properly
1:03:41now we have a new city engineer on and i think that's something that they're going to look to because if not we're going to be spending money on doing that and i think it's crazy granted we are going to always have problems with streets we live in new england and we don't have you know the kind of equipment when we talk about the kabuto the reason that they want that is because all they have is plows
1:04:02and snow blowers and a plow just pushes it a cabood is like a mini front end loader it can pick up snow and move it from one place to another so when you get a lot of snow there's no way to plow you know six feet no way so you need a kabuto to move things we use the kabuto a lot when we were doing the picnic area because it was the best thing to do but
1:04:24i'd like to know along with why they need it when they last purchased something that i'm replacing because that then again is facilities maybe we need to look at revamping facilities maybe getting somebody to oversee different departments and make sure that stuff gets done but i agree with you a hundred percent mr capone this really isn't a good mark for anything because we're not even
1:04:52near doing what we need to do for the budget the same thing with the monthly the quarterly reports that we get doesn't that really doesn't make sense to me but without a yield thank you for letting me vent thank you council councilman c one council kadeem thank you madam president uh so i was just going to piggyback on councilman seadate's line of questioning just with regards to the um
1:05:17the inactive projects so if we can just because i think some some of the confusion also falls in um we've got authorized debt um we didn't go out and bond so either uh we could have paid down the uh the debt so it means that we can't we obviously i know you know this but we did we do that we can't we can't use some of it but it
1:05:35would look like as if we have maybe two million dollars of capacity or money uh that's used uh or we just didn't go out for the full amount so i think it's important for those inactive accounts to really truly identify how much we've actually gone out for bonding and what really truly is available for funding because it becomes a little bit misleading from when you're just looking at an authorization standpoint um
1:05:55and then i guess the the other piece was just really um and i think the city administrator really kind of spoke to um you know your role in terms of why things are a little bit slow just really trying to make sure that the department heads are being um educated and and trained on uh different aspects from financial standpoint and i think a lot of this is is lost on on some of
1:06:17us because obviously we're not part of the hiring process but i think the public sector does a terrible job uh in terms of training uh their employees right i think often what we do is we hire department heads as subject matter experts we don't get department heads who are who understand supervising employees understand hr and a good majority of them and being part of this truly do not understand the
1:06:42financial aspects of their department so just giving them a capital improvement plan and say here you go fill it out and this is typically what we do in the public sector is give them a document and a template and we think they're going to understand it um i think part of of this and i'm starting to see the trend that we're trying to move towards making sure that we're providing
1:07:02professional development for uh those in in leadership positions and i think part of it is while we're looking for a new cfo making sure that cfo understands and really truly wants to do the same thing because when we send out budget documents when we send out capital improvement documents i think they're the cfo needs to sit down with each individual department head do a quick
1:07:23training and say do you truly understand what we're looking for and why because i think again a lot of these department heads don't truly understand what it is they think they put a kubota in there everybody's gonna understand why we need a kubota right so um some people just don't think in that logic in i've i'm in that position so i i do try to try to explain and train and you
1:07:42still have some of those department heads who will leave some of this stuff blank but i think it really is incumbent upon you know the cfo to make sure that they're holding and i know that position is vacant and is currently being filled part-time through ed but when we get somebody to make sure that they're really holding these department heads accountable and giving them the training
1:07:59and the resources that they need to truly put these documents together so without a yield thank you counselor c5 councilman lee just uh i hear my counselor stated that um every every place around us has some kind of fear bag program and i just needed to use that information to reiterate the importance of investing in infrastructure because i do feel like that that new bedford provides a good example of um a city
1:08:28that's comparable to us in some ways that utilized a private company and uh its own infrastructure of its landfill area to not have fees or a bag program in their area they've been able to work with whatever they had in that area to provide that i think and that's what i'm asking for we don't have that infrastructure in place right now and we if we did if we're not utilizing the infrastructure that we have to bring
1:08:58the costs down for other people so um so we could look at new bedford and say hey they they have something in place and as a matter of fact if i'm correct me if i'm wrong fall river just recently um contracted with abc for the disposal of uh recycling i believe was it easy no i believe it was abc was it abc yeah oh and abc have been sold oh to a larger
1:09:23company i see the name just went right out of my head but we were able to do something with that company to bring down our uh disposal costs and i'm just that's though that's all i'm looking at i mean when i see something like that because if we compare ourselves to a suburb in this area that probably doesn't have the infrastructure then yeah they would have a bag program or
1:09:43something like that but we have a lot more and to work with and with fall river in comparison to smaller towns around us new bedford would be a comparable situation obviously not exact it would be our own way but i do believe that we have a path at least to look at to say hey if we invest in infrastructure if we work with businesses in this area we can then no longer have to put that
1:10:06burden on the taxpayer and then that's all i'm looking for that's that was the purpose of my point in the first place so i yield thank you thank you counselor and seat councilor pleasant i just wanted to add one more thing and i appreciate the city administrator's vision of how to do this it's it's much forward thinking just one thing i want you to throw at you and think about when we have changes in leadership
1:10:28in this case new fire chief new police chief how do we address what could be a change in their capital needs because again every leader has different priorities so do you apply that same approach to having a conversation with those new individuals to see like you said it's a living document how do we maybe change it if we need to change it so just kind of food for thought i yield thank you thank you
1:10:51thank you sir counselor and seat three council vice president oh i'm sorry i have did you want to respond i have a question i just need to clarify new bedford is not really a good example because they're partners with the town of dartmouth owning their own one of the only line landfills in the damn state so they they received the benefit of probably the lowest tipping fee i mean that's the reason why we're waiting
1:11:14situations we're increasing the outsourcing of the i know i was involved the outsourcing of the garbage is a different thing it is sort of like if you outsource all of your snow plowing it can get they can get pretty expensive but it's the efficiency that you get when when a city like new bedford one of the reasons why they years back they contracted and went out with a private service was because you
1:11:38can't believe how when you when you follow one of those i forget i think was abc you follow one of those trucks oh my god i couldn't believe how uh what's the word uh quick they work i mean they just you so you get a you get a enjoyed the benefit of seeing a a real efficiency well we we are in the situation we're in because we lost them
1:11:59i mean we know that i just wanted to point that out it's just they do they do they do own their own field but we're going to need to that's what we're going to need to have an infrastructure in place we don't have that we lost it so therefore now we have all these costs but i'm just saying if we don't recreate that if we don't bring that back in some kind of way yeah then
1:12:17we're going to keep on sticking to taxpayer which with these whatever we're going to try to do with fees bags and all this other stuff thank you councilman c 3 council vice president dion i wish you well um if i'm not mistaken new bedford also has its own transfer station doesn't it they still have a transfer station and they you know they charge accordingly right the real savings for them is that there is no debt
1:12:41on the disposal you know right at this point and my my understanding is i don't know if they release the numbers yet but they're going to be releasing shortly how much longer the estimated life is and they've been acquiring the land because it was created as a separate agency you know years ago in a partnership the host is in dartmouth and they have their own board and all of that you know so it's quite quite
1:13:06interesting the way it's worked um so i have another question in terms of the inactive accounts when you get to the bottom of that and know the exact dollars etc will it be in two categories and the reason i ask that question is money that can be repurposed and money that will have to be for like projects as opposed to just a number yeah i think that's exactly what we'll do but
1:13:30see first of all during this refunding bond i was explaining uh mystic counselor kadeem the pit right on it i did have the city pay off some smaller bonds so that they'd be gone they'll be right up they'll be wiped off the debt schedule and then what happens is that you you can authorize the say you authorize 100 million dollars to build a high school and you only end up spending 90. well you may want to
1:13:55rescind the balance of that authorization you're not going to use it any further it's done whereas an inactive account sometimes you might have a small balance in the account when the funds were all borrowed maybe you saved money that's not always the case but you might have saved some money and that's what you can either repurpose and you can clean up that inactive accounts unfortunately
1:14:17i've seen projects drag out for years because you can't there's parts of them that don't get finished right you know what again i well you had one in front of you uh that i i mean just the side track i saw one come in front of the council last week on a community preservation project that the council voted on and i think it was 2016 and here i was seeing a supplemental appropriation coming to the council
1:14:43almost five and a half years later i don't even know if any money's been spent at all i'm just trying to give you an example of what happens and there's a lot of reasons for it costs go up you know you run into whatever thought we run into covert government has slowed a lot of things down including getting estimates for capital plans that's been going on in communities all you know right around us
1:15:09you know that the vendors are reluctant you know to give a a bid so that when you go in and you see some of these numbers there they could be estimated instead of being what i call solid numbers and i do have one question before i forget uh council president you mentioned uh a date there's a count that you have to vote on the capital improvement yeah the clerks were just
1:15:32looking into that as we were having this discussion well what was the date on that 21st and march first i'm a little confused in other words you have to vote on a capital improvement by my trust yeah i believe it's um
1:16:02the city council is required to conduct a public hearing and adopt the plan no later than march 1st 2022.
1:16:11that's according to article 6 of the city's charter welcome to our world with that i yield counselor c2 council camara i think i think we're going far too much but i just want to point out one thing i mean it's it's nice when the department uh head tells you what he needs but also we need to realize is there's a lot of things they want that can make their life a lot easier
1:16:36and that's the discussion that we really need to have is what are your needs and what do you want so that we can determine what the difference is and then there's the question of what can we afford to give you so those three factors that make a big difference in how departments operate how effective they are and there has to be everyone working together if i went to a department that says hey what do
1:16:53you need they're going to give us a plethora of this is what i need this is what i want but when the administration approaches them they understand that they're not going to get everything they want not going to get everything they need so they try to go and focus on what they need the most for the most part and then you know whether they need to let everybody know and describe in detail why it is
1:17:13they could do it but for the most part departments they pretty much know what they want and what they need and they know the difference and then they understand what the reality is of what we can afford to give them and that's what you know the the real tough decisions come in which department's needs are more important than the other departments needs and as you said things change overnight you get
1:17:31a couple of uh machinery that goes down there goes the need for and wants of a lot of other department heads because this is more crucial more important and it just changes everything so i think what we try to do best is just work together with them and make sure that we give them as much as what they need and what they want to get the job done so they can provide the
1:17:50services they need for our taxpayers that's where the real crux of everything comes to play with that are you thank you thank you counselor anything further on the capital improvement plan thank you item three is the five year financial forecast the administration wants to give a brief review
1:18:26again uh you know the five-year plan uh was developed i mean one of the things that i'm that i made sure i needed to first of all make sure that the revised 22 budget was accurate that's been done and the other thing is to start monitoring the 22 receivables and that's mainly in the non-real estate area you know not taxes but things like building permits and areas like that because these things can come back they
1:18:56come back to haunt you for example just recently we found some timing issues and some of the estimated receipts that the city is receiving and luckily corporate council is working on it on one on a large piece that he's gonna he's gonna fix that because i see it as a problem i see a timing problem and when the city actually gets its revenue you know from our newly established uh marijuana industry
1:19:21and uh that's critical everybody looks and goes oh yeah well how the hell would you predict that well i mean we we have numbers that we projected that were projected in the five-year plan i need to make sure that those numbers are accurate so as you move forward that's why i question and i'm gonna get off that subject that's why i think that the five-year plan as it stands now it was fine when it was developed
1:19:44and not nothing wrong with it it was it was done at a time but it's a little bit premature in my opinion i've been around a long time this this is like putting the cart before the horse you need another couple of months to make sure that you know you get you through you can do a quick analysis for 23 and you are you're going to see that you get a structural deficit
1:20:04all right you get some big ticket items and that's why things like taking health insurance on your retiree program to premium based but what you're going to see is you're going to see a savings for a split year well now the trick is is to advertise that for a full year so that the next year and the next year's projection you start to see numbers that make sense and uh any kind of new programs that you
1:20:28implement during your fiscal year you need to make sure that you know you don't overestimate the revenue and i look at like trash for example to get it going and i think uh seth pointed us out very well you got to start somewhere but you got to make sure that you're picking your timing right because if you count on that as a partial revenue stream to save money you've got to make sure that
1:20:51you don't understand where where you're at it's like i noticed another thing and you you would have to i think that i sent you i believe the medicare and it was just the timing i couldn't believe that we hadn't received one nickel in medicare receipts you know for almost uh i don't know six months the son of a gun the next day the receipts came in but they're lagging and they shouldn't be lagging because
1:21:14they lag enough like veterans benefits when you're projecting veterans benefits receipts we're always running a good year behind this has been addressed to the state legislature more times than i can count and i'm i hopes in the future the gentleman like seth will take up the cause and keep after him again you know what anybody else and sean too you know in your case and because they just run
1:21:42too far behind i mean we've spent the money and what we're doing is we're we're looking for that revenue coming back in um this year's budget fiscal 22's budget you'll notice if you look at page one you'll see that originally there was going to be a use of some revenue lost money that wasn't allowed under the federal government but it was allowed under this re higher provision so 2.9 million was was was
1:22:11used of that special provision in fiscal 22 budget and then of course the money was taken uh from free cash because it was a very strange uh year that the way the budget you know uh folded uh folded out um as we move into 23 i'm in the process right now and this has been some of my mini filing cabinet and my book here uh we're in the process now getting all of the city's assessments
1:22:38the last piece that i'm waiting on is i've seen the chapter 70 money from come in from the schools and uh like in this projection no i never would have given a thought that you would that the governor would put in his budget that size increase in chapter 70. i was really surprised i mean i'm surprised nicely the only thing is as your contribution your chapter 70 money goes up our
1:23:05so does your so does your obligation for uh you know for increased uh minimum contribution and then of course the way the formula works you probably heard this before you take the school budget and then what we do is we analyze the along with the business manager of the school department we analyze with where the indirect costs are we do the same thing with the water sewer and ems
1:23:27enterprise funds you know you you make sure that the city the general fund is getting money that performs all of the accounting payroll functions bills payable uh each their portion of insurance you know all those various factors that are taken into the uh revenue stream but uh and then again uh the the big the big things are above the line you'll see that the projection for 23 and that's where
1:23:53we're at right now that's why it ties with the budget because some of these assessments you don't know them exactly and the schools are a good example you know now we don't know what's going to happen i mean i remember years of revising budgets because we didn't get the state to approve their budget after the house and senate got through with it until july june and then you really so it's very difficult to
1:24:20keep these uh projections uh you know alive and that's what we're doing right now we're gonna test every one of these for example today i gotta i got an estimate of new growth for the city well let's see it's february what what is the date day 16th 15th so i mean see pretty easy to calculate the two and a half percent increase you know over your property over your tax levy
1:24:48and then you try to estimate new growth if you recall the city council went to the 18-month switchover and you went to the the assessment date as of july 1.
1:24:59so that means instead of all your your new growth being known as of january 1 you let it go another six months which i i did the same thing when i uh you know years ago in dartmouth i did the same thing because i knew there was going to be a big chunk of new growth that was going to be picked up the city enjoyed almost 3 million dollars last year for this budget for this
1:25:23fiscal 22 budget that included that new growth well now you get two problems i'm not really going to know the new growth until much later you know to see how we can test it so again it's going to have to be estimated and then revised but when you go down into the expenditures you can use the actuarial tables for retirement perak does a great job of giving us the bad news for a till the year 2036
1:25:51when everything's supposed to be all right with the world and the retirement funds around the massachusetts will be fully funded you know these are all important things i know it's it's not easy but it you just got to remind people that we have some obligations that we have to deal with whether we like it or not i mean when you get numbers like health insurance in the 40 million dollar range
1:26:12you know but hopefully you can you can save by introducing different plans and options and you know and things like that retirement you're pretty much done assessments for example i saw an increase and i'm assuming that some city council voted for it in fall river and that was the major addition and construction project for the bristol aggie school that cost this city an additional 250 50 000 a year and the reason it
1:26:43wasn't more is because every city in town in bristol county all 20 of them picks up a piece okay and of course fall river you bedford attleboro taunton they pick up the lion chair and then it goes to the you know then it goes to the towns these are the things you're up against but i think that i think the projection coming to the council at the date yeah and you know i look i
1:27:10got no ex no hoss in this race is a little premature i think the chatter dates are a little out of whack in my opinion on producing this information seth can have his own opinion i'm giving you what my opinion is you know but i but i think we will be revising this probably as soon as seth starts setting up the budget review process we'll start doing that and we're going
1:27:33to be ready to do that within the next my guess is right now probably within next week we'll be setting up a schedule of meetings and at the same time the point that was made about the new police chief and the fire chief they'll have the opportunity because they'll have seen the new budget and they'll have an opportunity to then look at the ci and look at the cip plan and really
1:27:57you know but when you when you promote from within and and they're high level people they've somehow they they all pretty seem to have a pretty good idea of what what the overall needs are thank you counselor c3 council vice president dion yeah i could be uh incorrect but i believe when it comes to bristol aggie i don't believe the council had any vote or any input on that that was a number
1:28:18that was just told it was just okay this is what happened with bristol aggie and this is fall river's share and this is the number right um why it works that way i don't know but it is what it is i suppose um i'm looking at this and i think to be fair in terms of healthcare yep i think that there has been uh over the years a great deal of savings i don't think
1:28:44health care is the driving force in terms of our debt and putting us in a bad situation i think trash solid waste should be in this paragraph uh that's definitely you know what six million dollars a year six million dollar number and it's a moving target you've probably got i don't even know last count i mean the last time i was involved in uh i've been the creator of a couple of uh solid
1:29:15waste enterprise funds uh i mean you know there has it's got to be over 200 communities now that have solid waste enterprise funds in place right now in massachusetts now there have been savings in health care there have been uh plans that have been revamped and revisited um so i just feel like that's a little bit of an unfair representation and that we should have other things in there that
1:29:41yeah obviously do contribute to our issues uh i think the point i'm trying to make yet is they're big numbers and when you when you make a change or if you can save a couple of dollars here like to make it taking the health the retirees health and program you can have a real impact on it you know what i'm saying that's that's what that's all i'm pointing out yeah yeah
1:30:02which i believe they did with the retirement account they did there was a significant uh savings there right um now insurance and other what is other one we're talking insurance and other on page two under expenditures it's a 40 the 44 million dollar number but what is other it's everything it's uh workers comp it's uh it's uh oh god there's a whole list i hate it when they use hello and i'd like to see
1:30:34it expanded a little bit you know on the uh projection so that you get an idea yeah cause sometimes yeah specificity share of medicare uh contribution for your employees and uh it's a lot of categories that we really don't have any real control over right so sometimes specificity gives us a better picture of actually what's what's happening yes um i think my only other comment is again in terms of the
1:31:00opera funding i don't have an issue with utilizing opera funding if it's something that's going to benefit or when we come out on the other side we can support that number on our own but if it's something that increases our structural deficit or if it's something that we can't support beyond opera funding then that's a different uh situation and i don't think we should utilize it in in that case
1:31:26with that i yield thank you thank you anything further from the council council and seat seven council board i just want to make a comment about the workman's comp um we've had people on workmen comp for years and years and years and years and you know either settle or move forward or you get an investigator because how do we know people that are on workmancomp living in arizona how are we checking on them or the one
1:31:54in florida how are we checking on them new bedford just got a false workman comp claim and i think that we need to be more proactive on that and it would be worth it for the city to hire an investigator to make sure that people who are on workmen comp are deserving of being on workmancom they do have an issue but for those that don't i don't think they should be milking the system
1:32:20so i mean that's something i've mentioned before but since you're here mr atkins attorney hey kids i figured i'd mention it again with that i yield thank you thank you counseling city customer so just when i i read this letter really quickly it's basically what i get out of this is that the expected ex yeah try that again the reductions is the healthcare costs right the increased revenue is ems transport services are
1:32:48there any other priorities that we're looking at to reduce and increase yeah there's a there's a whole list unfortunately they need discussion with the city administrator and the mayor so there's really a in the budget process is really where you you really have these some of these yeah i'm just curious because we we identified those two particular things right anything else that that really sticks out and says
1:33:15yeah there is there's definitely things but i mean yeah there are some things for example they're not i mean it is what it is we we have to deal with the durfee uh high school and the way that uh the debt you know for the durfee debt you know i mean uh uh there's a strategy that you know about you know about paying for it as you go on you know that it's a dead
1:33:36exclusion that the voters approved but it's a way of how you're going to get there you know things like that you know but those those are really uh things that the mayor and and the city administrator need to have make some discretion on you know have some further discussion about how based on the total you need to see the total picture though yeah i'm just looking for priorities yeah i know i i understand
1:34:00and that's right up to the top of the list of you thank you anything further from the council thank you gentlemen do you have an emotional journey most of the journey second motion findings made by counselor kilby seconded by council pereira all in favor all right so voted on finances take a two minute break
1:35:21do
1:35:48so do
1:37:41so
1:37:53so
1:39:03fall river city council will now come to order councils kadeem here here dion here kilby
1:39:18here pursuant to the open meeting law any person may make an audio or video recording of this public meeting or may transmit the meeting through any medium attendees are therefore advised that such recordings or transmissions are being made whether perceived or unperceived by those present and are deemed acknowledged and permissible council pelletier is a little under the weather today so he is not joining us
1:39:38this evening everybody in the chamber please stand for a moment of silent prayer and remain standing for a salute to the flag of the united states of america and to the republic for which it stands one nation under god indivisible with liberty and justice for all
1:40:12first item before you is a communication from the mayor in a financial order requesting a supplemental funding of 35 000 for the kennedy park overlooked project and these are with cpa reserves made by council camaro seconded by councillor pereira any discussion all those in favor opposed still voted i have the mayor's request for the confirmation of the appointment of caitlyn young as the city planner
1:40:45motion to adopt second promotional job made by council kilby seconded by council vice president dion any discussion thank you councilman c7 um i just want to say that i think this is a very good person for this position i've had the opportunity to meet with miss young and work with her on a couple of issues and i found her to be extremely knowledgeable not afraid to work put on boots get out there i mean it
1:41:14i'm very very impressed with her and she is here tonight in the audience so um if this passes congratulations with that ideas thank you counselor anything further we had a motion to adopt all in favor aye aye opposed the eyes have it congratulations congratulations
1:41:46you
1:42:01congratulations
1:42:16adam clark item 2b is the miz request for the confirmation of timothy mccoy to the licensing board motion to confirm emotion not made by councillor kadeem seconded by councillor kilby any discussion all those in favor all right opposed you guys have it we have the request for the confirmation of sean kadeem to the tax increment finance promotion to adopt but i would request a resume second
1:42:49motion to adopt made by council kilby seconded by council raposo any discussion all those in favor all right exposed so voted congratulations thank you very much thank you councilman wonderful i'll wear them item 3a is the mayor's request for the confirmation of the re-appointment of natasha pereira to the council on aging motion to confirm second motion confirmed made by councillor seconded by councillor kilby any
1:43:18discussion all those in favor aye any opposed the eyes have it the request for the reappointment of dan dupier to the uh board of appeals motion to confirm russian confirm made by council pereira seconded by council vice president dion any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed you guys have it we have the request for reappointment of counsel linda pereira to the tax increment financing board motion to
1:43:44confirm second motion to confirm made by council vice president dion seconded by councilor poser any discussion all those in favor all right any opposed seven abstain let the eyes have it seat seven abstains and 3d is the request for the reappointment of melissa panchley to the library trustees motion to confirm second emotional doubt made by councillor camara seconded by councillor
1:44:09lee any discussion all those in favor any opposed the eyes have it and item number four is the um traffic commission making amendments to the traffic agencies requests for a number of amendments motion referred to ordinance second motion report of the committee on ordinance made by council keems seconded by councillor kilby any discussion kelson city councilor puzzle just just one thing i noticed on one of the
1:44:36requests and just because the school's on everett street there is no 479 average street it's it according to record should be seven nine at retreat seven adam
1:44:59the committee on public works and transportation at a meeting held on february 1st voted unanimously to recommend that the accompanying order be adopted this is the order for curb removal for brenet's corporation at 188 tremont street second motion dot made by councillor kilby seconded by councillor pereira all those in favor aye opposed the eyes have it the committee on public works and
1:45:27transportation at a meeting held on february 1st voted university to recommend that the accompanying order be adopted as amended this is a curb removal for lies sajeda begum at 248 hancock street there was a stipulation that was placed on this on this order that a double permit fee was to be paid within 30 days for the matters to be referred to corporation council for action as the curbing was
1:45:58removed prior to city council approval motion to adopt made by councillor kadeem seconded by council vice president dion any discussion all those in favor aye opposed you guys have it
1:46:25people incorporated at 10 40 eastern avenue this order this oh this is that permission be in the same is here by denied for this quotient to adopt second motion to adopt made by councilor kadeem seconded by councillor any discussion all those in favor opposed do you guys have it
1:46:59ten together made by councillor pereira seconded by councillor kadeem all those in favor die opposed motion to adopt as
1:47:13seconded by council vice president dion any discussion all those in favor all right opposed you guys have it committee on ordinances and legislation at a meeting held on february 8th voted unanimously to recommend the accompanying proposed resolution be granted leave to withdraw this is a resolution regarding telecommunications during times of emergency report second motion to adopt the report made
1:47:42by council kilby seconded by council kadeem any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed the eyes have it committee on ordinances and legislation at a meeting held on february 8th voted unanimously to recommend that the accompanying proposed ordinance be granted leave to withdraw this was a proposed ordinance regarding the um commissioner of cemeteries and trees report second motion adopt made by council
1:48:10camaro seconded by councillor kilby any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed hi councilwood seat one is opposed i'm also opposed by the clerk madam president is that one on the director of cemeteries and trees yes and that was for the increase in the ordinance correct yes and it was denied or it was given leave to withdraw by committee yes i oppose that as well i think if we're
1:48:37going to do all of the ordinances not to exceed so much it should be for everybody we're picking and choosing a couple of weeks back when i was on the ordinance committee we did one uh for the city engineer we did the advance and we even passed it with an emergency preamble so i find there's a little discrepancy there so i am opposed to this counseling the committee on ordinances and legislation at a meeting held on
1:49:08february 8th voted unanimously to recommend the accompanying proposed ordinance be passed through first reading this is miscellaneous traffic motion to adopt first reading ocean adoption collective reading made by councillor kadeem seconded by kelsey vice president dion any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed committee on ordinances and legislation at a meeting held on february 8th voted
1:49:30unanimously to recommend the accompanying proposed order he passed through first reading this is the director of human resources motion to pass through first reading second motion pass through first reading made by council vice president dion seconded by councillor raposo any discussion all those in favor aye opposed you guys have it committee on ordinances and legislation at a meeting
1:49:56held on february 8th voted unanimously to recommend the accompanying proposed ordinance he passed through first reading this is the ordinance that relates to deputy police second motion i doubt made by counselor kirby seconded by council kadeem any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed yes committee on ordinances and legislation at a meeting held on february 8th voted unanimously to recommend the
1:50:22accompanying proposed ordinance accompanied by an emergency preamble be passed through first reading second reading passed to be enrolled and passed to be ordained motion for a margin of emergency preamble motion for emergency pre-employment by council kadeem seconded by council vice president dion any discussion all those in favor all right welcome clerk roll call on the emergency
1:50:44premium counselors kadeem yes camara yes dion yes kilby yes lee yes bellatier pereira yes proposal yes and president yes second emotional adopt made by councillor kamara seconded by council lee any discussion all those in favor all right any opposed yes where is the welcome to fall river sign that is located at the end of route 24 is in disrepair and whereas diamond regional vocational technical high
1:51:18school is interested in refurbishing or replacing the sign and whereas there are numerous approvals required to refurbish or replace the sign now therefore be resolved at the committee on economic development and tourism convene with the city engineer director of traffic corporation council a representative from diamond regional vocational technical high school and a representative from massdot district 5
1:51:41to discuss this matter a motion to refer to canadian economic development tourism emotional referral committee on economic development and tourism made by council raposo seconded by council kadeem any discussion would you like to speak council bureau on the resolution um it's just that i got a call that they wanted to redo that sign and there's a lot of um discussion that needs to be had prior to that traffic etc so
1:52:10we put it to economic development tourism maybe we can figure it all out and get a new sign there without a yield all those in favor bye any opposed you guys have it where's vehicles parked on irving street in violation of the parking ban that was in place due to the severe snow storm cause a serious delay in emergency vehicles responding to a massive multi-family house fire and where is the fine for a
1:52:36violation of emergency parking prohibitions due to weather conditions chapter 70 section 314 of code of fall river is 40 dollars and whereas many traffic fines have not been increased in several years now therefore be resolved that the committee on ordinances and legislation convened to discuss and review fines for violations of chapter 70 of the code of fall river which chapter relates to traffic motion to
1:53:00refer to communion ordinances legislation measured adopted by council raposo seconded by councillor kadeem any discussion the council of state seven countries i just think it's ridiculous that people complain about the way the streets are plowed but then you have some people that don't adhere to the parking ban and to be honest with you for 40 bucks what the heck i'm going to park there i don't care i'll pay the 40
1:53:22bucks jack it up jack it up to 250 they'll learn to move their car pocket in the right place but when you don't park where you're supposed to park and there's a devastating fire like this that one of our pieces of apparatus is damaged and a vehicle is damaged because they can't get there of course they're gonna damage the apparatus or the vehicle because their goal is to get to
1:53:45that fire and make sure that people are safe and i say your parking ban goes on at six o'clock seven o'clock whatever time start towing people because if people see that we are going to follow through they're going to pay attention we've got so many ordinances on the books people are supposed to shovel their sidewalks look at how many people shovel their sidewalks and kids are walking in the
1:54:08street for what someone to get hurt i really think you have ordinances on the books if you're not going to have the manpower to implement them then get rid of them but if they're on the books they need to be adhered to they need to be followed and they need to be stifling so people know that there is a consequence to not following the rules i mean i i was just really devastated by that
1:54:32fire and having you know cars in the way of allowing our fire department one of our you know somebody could have been injured seriously injured there and there's just no need for that with that i yield thank you thank you counselor anything further all those in favor are the opposed motion take items 19 to 23 together second motion take items 19 through 23 together made by council kadeem seconded
1:54:58by council canelo all those in favor opposed motion to adopt second motion to adopt items 19 through 23 made by council kadeem second and back council vice president dion any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed subvoted item 24 is the motion to take items 24 to 27 together second i should take items 24 through 27 together made by council kadeem second by councillor camaro all those in favor any opposed i
1:55:34i just have um a question because there was one of the um curb removals that was before us um on one of these streets where they did the work prior to getting consent but just now i believe it was on a hancock street there was a stipulation made by the subcommittee that because the work was done prior to getting the permission that person has to pay double the fine as i understood
1:56:07the gentleman at citizens input it was prior to him purchasing the property he was i can't it was prior to him purchasing the property that's how i understood that it was at the closing excuse me did he say that it was it was for him it wasn't him it sounded like it was the person that well then who's the person that did that because the person that did it it's not his fault point but
1:56:27the first in that information yes because i think this will settle the ordinance requires a double fee for any work that's done prior to a permit being pulled so that individual should be fine double so out of subcommittee we just wanted to make sure that the the vote was very clear that that's what it was so right but i'm saying tonight there was one the gentleman came he purchased a house
1:56:51but when they were doing the work there they went four feet on either side of the driveway and they didn't get permission and they did that before the closing so maybe it's not his fault but whoever the developer was or who whoever cut those curbs they should be fined for doing so well we could certainly i don't know who that is but we could send that one to committee
1:57:14no but i guess what i was saying the point of information is it should be automatically happening at the department level we just articulated to make sure that it was coming back that we want to ensure that that that was taking place but it it's an ordinance that should already be taking place if you pull out a building permit and do the work before you pull the bill in permit it's going to be done it's going
1:57:34to automatically get a double fee so so that leads me to ask the question how this man came because he realized that there was a permit that needed to be taken out but whoever did it before who in the building department caught that nobody i don't have that answer for you counselor okay i guess when somebody goes out to review the application for a curb cut they would see that the work was already done
1:58:03so i would assume similar to the situation that we had with the prior curve cut that they were charged the problem with with the one that we just approved was that the individual refused to come back before us for the curb cut so that was why we implemented that to make sure it was being paid and all this other stuff and if not referred to corporation council however that should
1:58:26have been picked up i guess based on initial inspection well the city administrator is here maybe he should pick up on that tomorrow and see what happened uh with that curb cut maybe call mr hathaway and say i just feel if we're doing it you're going to do it for one person you got to do it for everybody that's all and i don't think it was this gentleman's fault when he purchased the property they had
1:58:49already done it he kind of got stuck in the middle but whoever did it counselor kadeem is saying is it's an ordinance that they will be it will be a double fee okay it's an automatic without a yield thank you your check okay where are we at i'm just running number 27 number 28 which is did we take the final vote on 24th through 27th madam clerk no yeah we did just on the adoption vote
1:59:23together we took them together so motion to adopt items twenty four through twenty
1:59:35all those in favor any opposed yeah so item 28 is ilio eunice for the license to operate an auto repair shop motion second promotional dot made by council kadeem second seconded by councillor pereira any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed you guys have it and 29 is robbie corey sam and corey and of corey enterprises llc to operate in auto body shop at 751 eastern avenue motion to adopt
2:00:09a dot made by council prayer seconded by council raposo any discussion all those in favor all right any opposed the eyes have it could be please choose report motion to adopt emotional got made by council kadeem so i could second it by council vice president dion any discussion all those in favor all right any opposed you guys have it we have applications for the renewal of order repair shop licenses motion to adopt
2:00:35motion dot made by council kadeem second second by council kilby any discussion all those in favor aye aye any opposed you guys have it applications for the renewal of auto body shop licenses motion to adopt second emotional job made by consular raposo seconded by council of kadeem any discussion all those in favor all right any opposed you guys have it the application for the transfer of an
2:00:59auto repair shop license at 196 oak grove avenue second motion dot made by councillor kamara seconded by councillor raposo any discussion all those in favor aye opposed you guys have it have an application for new taxi cab vehicles on behalf of muhammad shabir just a quick question um to the clerk is there a public hearing that we typically take place what's the process for a new application
2:01:27is it um the request is made to the city council um for just to put two new vehicles on the road and if you approve um if you approve this process then he gets the the vehicles and it goes through the police department for inspections um for inspection and then you'll get the um the medallion that yield thank you councilman seat seven um madam clerk did we have a limitation
2:01:56on the number of medallions a couple of years back there was a big thing about medallions and that was the that was lifted so that was what that's been lifted so there's no longer oh they lifted that we did and we did did we had one yes okay yeah i know there was some talk about that with that i yield thank you counselor proposal did you have your hand up as well same question same question yeah
2:02:19so we're looking for a motion to adopt motion to adopt yes second ocean dominate might come back to the second council any discussion all those in favor all right any opposed do you guys have it corporation council made by councillor canara second by council kadeem any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed eyes have it we have the superintendent of diamonds requests to present to the council
2:02:47at next week's meeting for the finance committee so i can i should refer to the committee on finance made by council kadeem seconded by council vice president dion any discussion all those in favor aye any opposed you guys have it we have planning boards minutes set some place on file second motion accepted place on file made by council kadeem seconded by council raposo any discussion all those
2:03:08in favor aye aye all right you opposed you guys have it motion to take 38 39 together second motion to take items 38 and 39 together made by councillor camara second by council vice president damn motion to accept place on file all those in favor aye any post emotional approved second maybe council could bring a second by council proposal any discussion just is is this are these the minutes
2:03:34that we got the open meeting we'll complain against you know yes is it so what's happening is the clerk has always listed the agenda as the backup item and what the complainant is saying is that that's no longer in their opinion that's not acceptable they want every document listed but the document is the agenda i'm sorry so they went to details no no so and the only reason i was asking the question because i know
2:04:04specifically like in in subcommittee anytime that we've got a presentation the clerk always gets a copy of the document so i know she has a copy and she's aware that yes and it's attached it and it is yeah okay but what they want is he wants it specifically written out which documents but the document attachment a is okay understood can is that something we can accommodate moving forward or is that i don't know
2:04:29that the um he had done that for the first meeting that might have even been the inauguration madam clerk and i'm not sure that the um the agenda the agenda packet is available it's available on the website i just don't know how i guess with some of it i mean some some of it might be straightforward like if we've got a capital improvement needs you can title that in capital improvement needs
2:04:54but i think sometimes there are photos the agenda packet in every single every single agenda is it's it's it's too much to include with every single agenda every time we publish every single agenda so it's listed on there as agenda packet but it is available on the website so it is included in the minutes when we file our minutes away oh i see the actual
2:05:29all those in favor all right any opposed you guys have it explosion to adjourn ocean adjourned joint made by councillor poser seconded by council kadeem all those in favor
2:06:08you