3.13.2023 Community Preservation Committee

uh welcome to the uh Community preservation committee meeting held at uh Council hearing room one government center Fall River uh meeting could be seen through channel 18 Fall River through Fall River GT TV uh Facebook live or live streaming or in case of conflict channel nine uh it's Monday March 13 2023 a little after six um pursuant to the open meeting laws any person may make an audio or video

recording of the public meeting or make transmit the meeting through any medium and things are therefore advised that such recordings of Transmissions are being made whether perceived or unperceived by those present or deemed acknowledged and permissible we'll start off with roll call and what I'm going to do is unzoom I'll uh call your name and you just say you're here Chris Oliver

I'm here attending remotely by Zoom Carolyn Hoffman you're attending remotely by Zoom we're here and then uh we have Sandy on Zoom then we'll start here uh Joanne uh Joanne Bentley Alexander Silva present John Brandt president Rick Mancini president and then we are missing uh Victor Ferris and we're missing a member from planning board and we also have tonight uh like I said Sandy Dennis from Administration

Assistant and from FRG TV is Craig um we didn't have anyone sign up for citizen input uh can I have approval for the minutes of February 27th I'll make a motion to accept the minutes of the meeting okay can I have a second I'll second already then we'll start uh Chris yes Richard yes Caroline yes Joanne yes Alex Silva yes John bright Yes Rick Mancini yes okay now we're on the

deliberation of uh the FY 24 projects to discuss and uh no John I think you want the artist so to present first and then go into your deliberation input we did we don't have any systems all righty yes we're gonna have uh we had to change uh last year's project uh triggered some things at the uh former Arts Association that they want to change their application this year for they can

complete last year's project so they're going to come up and explain to us why um they have to make the changes uh we have to do a little ADA compliance which was triggered by the porch and other things so I'll let those folks come up now

I know you changed your uh funding request is 253 now and uh you can tell us I know we have to put in the lift for Ada if you want to tell us about that day so uh thank you for having us here tonight just an introduction Mike Keane civitax architects of attacks architects Ron Gagnon uh house committee chair forever grateful robot Association so just an update um we have been moving forward with working on the

um last year's application the work associated with it which is the restoration of the uh the Belmont Street facade which is the East elevation of the Art Association uh last fall started and have made some good progress we've met with one of the contractors that is interested in the project and talked through the scope with them so um part of our work or Services was to retain a code

consultant and it was something that we had talked about with the Art Association at the very beginning in terms of looking at what potentially could be required beyond the Aesthetics or the porch and the Reconstruction of the porch as well as the fire escape so things like egress inside of the building and also what might also be triggered by code so we did have a chance to meet with our code consultant

by the time we got his schedule and our schedule aligned it was just a couple of weeks ago so one of the the issues that have come up is that this project the restoration of the porch and facade is going to trigger the requirements for accessibility within the building so it's been kind of a busy last couple of weeks in terms of trying to just determine what the impact would be for

the Art Association uh now this goes back to a sort of permanent work okay so even though we've done quite a bit of work this would be for actual construction work or work under permit so which has not yet started yet so um the work that would be required for accessibility would be to provide an accessible route into the building on the first floor and also once you're inside the building that you have an

accessible bathroom a toilet room singular and also the back stairs uh would also have to be redone as part of the code requirement um and so what we have is a proposal currently with you um that we've gone through through funding and now through eligibility it's part of the discussion uh for the restoration of 30 windows at the Art Association so what we're proposing is to sort of dial that scope back the

window restoration scope back and reduce the number of Windows from 30 to 12.

and instead focus on the accessibility improvements that would be required or mandated with this first project once it goes forward and so that would be to provide the accessible route to the building and it would be to provide an accessible toilet room on the first floor and they can make accommodations for an accessible classroom on the first floor so there wouldn't be any funds that we'd

be looking for or requesting of the CPC for that classroom space it would just be for what we're proposing is a lift a vertical lift to get up to the first floor and the bathroom and reworking the back egress stairs so those three three points as well as the 12 windows and those 12 windows are the most in need of restoration those are the third floor Dormer windows that we've been looking at

um so we've there's flashing that's come off of that so we're concerned about that um so I've never made a request that this sort of late in the application process so usually we have a game plan um but this is a first for us to be doing this but again it's going to be required once that first project goes forward under permit so now I see you have a lift going in

so that's going to be around putting lift in and everything we're looking at 82 82 000 then the bathrooms are around 35 and then the rest would be for the windows right so uh we had a couple of days to scramble to get a proposal two days literally uh so we did get a proposal from garaventa which is a a well-known manufacturer of vertical lifts um they did give us a number for that

and the other numbers are numbers that we've obtained from similar projects that are currently under contract with other clients so we feel you know good about those those numbers I think they're they're accurate numbers for the plumbing and so forth I'll open it up to the board for questioning uh Chris we'll start with you any questions um just um as far as the lift changing the historic look of the outside of the

building how how much is it going to actually affect that so and I saw I saw a basic picture but it wasn't it wasn't a drawing of what it would look like it was just an example of of one that they had used so I'm just wondering how much that's going to change it because everything still needs to be done to Secretary of interior standards right so we're still trying to finalize the location Kristen

um but one of the proposed locations we talked about the back we've talked about the front uh but one of the locations right now if it is in the front of the building would be uh say to the left side of it which would be the south side right next to the entry door and so we just we pulled together a couple of photos um of lifts all right so right there I

don't know if you can see if you're connected on your end screen no but I mean we saw a picture we we received pictures of what there were two of them yeah and so I know what it looks like it would it would be immediately to the left of that main door is one potential location so we would have to look at reworking that you know that railing um and doing something as far as some

sort of enclosure uh around that lift and certainly you know we would come back to your board uh the historical Commission and and review what we're proposing before we even move forward with it so you'd have a chance to at least look at it and if you look at the back of the building that so that could be one potential location yeah and and we're going to have to yep so that go ahead

and put the list back there it is pretty well out of sight if you're going to rebuild the porch to be the correct uh the grand standards and things but then build around for the new lift yes in this adequate room there particularly if you're back upstairs yeah right right so that might warrant a look what that would do is it would eliminate the issue of right the front of the building the rail and you would

not if you put the lift here you're going to have to build up or put a ramp in right to get into the front door if you use the back you can light up too yeah the entrance level which would eliminate around right maybe and you might save some money that way yeah I think honestly you know what we're going to have to look at we're never going with one you know

option we look at multiple options multiple ways to sort of skin the cat um so certainly the back is is an option that we should be looking at too so we haven't ruled that out or settled on one just yet what we did do is we went back and looked at this front a little bit and what we're thinking about doing is if it were there right uh is that what

we could do is build up a platform so it's at the same level as the threshold so the rise of that lift would then meet that platform so it's almost like having you know uh an extension of the porch would be one step but it's maybe you know five or six feet out so so it's got it has to be designed it's going to be thought through the back is going to be

looked at you know because that's part of the egress component too so so maybe there's an opportunity there to one of the nice things about the front is that they have the wider door there and it's kind of a straight shot in where we may have to maneuver a little bit more the openings in the back so we haven't rolled back yeah right so right right handicapped right so

yeah I just want to stay we were on Zoom with Kristen so she still has I don't want to like take her time away so you know I don't know that's okay I mean discussion about it it's fine because you're not here so is there anything else yeah no I mean it would that was answering some of my questions my um so my my concern was just putting it in the

front and how much it would change it and then I had seen that it in order to do it that way it would have to level off porch to meet the threshold of the front door and you know and it would change the look of that step as well so I think that that was my concern with that and then would it have been possible to put it in the back and then how much of a

difference it would be and I mean especially like as far as I know you have estimates for prices but is that something that could drastically change depending on on where it was where you decided to put the the lift well the thing is at this point of time we need to have some design time to look through the options so I mean we're getting a best guess right now as to to

what costs and such would be um for those but we do need to evaluate yeah and we want to present it to the historical commission too because this is not the same application so um there's a couple of examples we just pulled up of a similar you know couple of uh garaventa lifts type lifts and historic structures so you know there are ways to create it sort of Blends in

you know we just have to come up with a design for it so but it's achievable I think the one great good thing about all of this is that one you know we're catching this in time before the permanent work actually started which is which is great um but also um that this is a benefit to the public I mean the public you know comes into the building and and you know visits the

shows and so forth so um this is a way for you know everybody you know inclusive uh to everybody to access the building I don't want to talk to uh the building department inspector I think even on a historic building when we uh they started redoing it if they can make it handicap accessible they should be doing that if they can and in this instance we can do it but I

think we want to stay away from the front porch as much because that is you know it's the main focus and the side entrance there I think would be the ideal spot for it right right back but we don't want to put it where it's right we're making it obsolete for Ada I mean right you know but uh okay so anything else Chris uh no that's a I yield thank you okay

thank you Mr chair um hey guys how you guys doing um so just a just a couple of questions so so with this change what prompted the change that's I guess that's my first question from the original scope that was submitted what prompted the change what prompted the change in the application Richard yeah from its original scope will work yeah the the co the code consultant that we have on contract for the project

visited the site it's part of what we had in there is our services to review the scope of work the porch project and so what he came back with he said the cost of the renovation work relative to the assessed value of the building is going to trigger the requirements for accessibility gotcha and then the um another follow-up question so the remaining 18 windows are are you guys planning to submit that

let's say next year next funding year or yeah so originally it was 30 30 Windows it got dropped to 12 so that means there's 18 windows that are not going to be replaced we reduce the quantity of Windows correct yeah price what I'm saying is so so for next year so I it's the intent to do the remaining Windows uh apply for funding for for next next year next fiscal year yes yes yeah yes

it definitely would be I mean we uh we're trying to keep this so it's it's relatively close to what the original you know funding request was it was slightly below what that original request was but we'd love to do the remaining windows but it's because of triggering the Ada that we need to take that component first before we do the remainder of the windows yeah oh yeah you can't do it

with it yeah right okay you can't do it I know that um yeah we can't get all right so we we do the accessibility upgrades so right so was it almost um so with this chain was it almost a twenty thousand dollar increase that we just got the paperwork um today I think it was a little less yeah we reduced it it was 30. reduced okay yeah it's it's gone

down so okay if you wanted to add a few more windows we'd be open to that we wouldn't argue that's all I got thank you Richard Caroline anything uh not at this time no uh Joanne um not really no I just think that it it makes sense to me that again being new you know some of the things I'm still trying to get figured out here that that so it would make

sense to me that you have some kind of study or something done first so you know what you're getting yourself into because the Ada will get triggered based on the dollar amount that you spend so it makes sense that knowing that you triggered that amount you drop back and get that that's not going to go away the grip those ADA requirements aren't going to go away yeah so it makes sense that

they did that for us and had the code consultant take a look at it to see what it triggers now we've always been on the studies not but in the future we might look at a store and properties that do need extensive we might require something like that we have on some some properties but mainly we sometimes and like this we found out that we have a problem so I think that's a that's a

good point I think you know going forward where you have projects where you're thinking about or considering you know multi-year multi-phase projects where it makes sense to first do that that study that evaluation I think you would want to have a master plan and chip away at it perhaps it's a five-year and you know you want to do something each year but right that makes sense to me so I I

really don't I was more of a comment than a question we've done it on some in the past but like I said we sometimes we we don't because of the extra expense but we might change our practice on that in the future since you know so things will come up like this so we better know beforehand and this but yeah it's just I've seen um you think you're doing something great you're going to replace these windows

and and replacing 30 Windows would be great but then there's a domino effect and it does trigger something and it's like oh no you know and it's more than just the entrance it's the restroom it's it's a bunch of stuff so yeah yeah and there's so many other things that could potentially get triggered with some of these projects and it may not be only accessibility it depends on what the

building is what the uses the function of it you know the age the square footage so many variables to it but you could trigger life safety requirements right sprinkle requirements um you know in some of these older buildings it's you know the um exit signs and things like that which are critical components too and just as a a comment um just because this got triggered for this project does not universally mean

that the same would apply to some of your other projects it depends on multiple variables so it just here it has to do with cost you have a building that is open to the public so um accessibility will be required I mean in 11 years of funding we've did some tweaking to make accommodations but nothing where we had like this where it came back right so it does happen and we

will learn from that and we'll look at you know some projects a little different right right yeah I'm also Alex hi yeah I do have some questions um let me start by saying I'm sympathetic to your play um it's an unfortunate situation with uh how things were lining up I do want to say that it would be important for something like this to kind of go through the whole process because uh as

far as I understand it accessibility uh improvements and projects like that are not eligible for historic preservation grants so as far as I see it uh the change in scope wouldn't even be covered under a CBC Grant I don't even think for any category but maybe community housing um in fact we actually told I asked an applicant in this process this year to take out um some accessibility upgrades

and improvements from their scope because it wouldn't actually qualify so I don't really see how it would be fair uh to the process and the other applicant to kind of Overlook that even if we could because I don't I don't think these accessibility improvements would qualify for the grant unfortunately the window work that you're keeping in I think still would count so I mean it would be up to the

board's discretion on how to see and I'll save my comments for that at deliberations but my understanding of it is these accessibility improvements wouldn't qualify for the grant and um it would have been kind of said at the eligibility phase kind of going forward so I think it's unfortunate you kind of had to rush to put this application together when it might not meet um the eligibility requirements okay

yeah good point I was also I was thinking about that because it does the laboratory or bathroom fit under this grant also why not that's an because that might not be available at the funding I can call Stuart and we'll find out what if it's the board's decision or if it's not or how they've done it in the past in other areas I think they're worthwhile projects right and there's a definite public benefit to it so

double double-edged coin here a yield okay all right no further questions all right okay thank you thank you all right thank you thank you thanks for the hard work you did though in just a couple of days

all right now as we move into deliberation uh you're not going to be scoring tonight but it's a good night to like see where you want to put your ones twos and threes talk about uh projects what we might be funding if we were going to do windows or this or that not down to the exact uh because we'll do that when we do the voting but just to get a sense of

the whole committee where we're heading uh so we don't want to be four but if you're against something on a project bring up what's not good but we don't want to say for or against to just my opinion we just you know but we do have uh some of our bond things that are going to pop in automatically is the Mount Hope is uh sixty thousand the bio Reserve is 78

000. the uh bomb we just took for the fire in the museum was 2021 291.88 uh that comes to uh 359 291 then we put in administration which is forty five thousand that brings us to 404 291.

uh it's estimated we're going to have uh probably 1.771 spend uh so we're already at uh 400 000. it's always good to keep some in reserve because emergencies overruns so the way I'm thinking it looks is like we have around a million bucks to fund this year that's just looking off the top of my head that would give us spending 1.4 and leaving 360 in uh Reserves the committee will will do that during

voting but just for you have a layout of how it's looking when you you start putting things together um let's see the first project we want to talk about is the Dr Fisk house excuse me Mr chair I have a question

oh that's what that's the only thing changed okay I must not have updated so the Art Association okay sorry about that the Art Association John Richard had a question oh sure go ahead Richard so thank you um so can we just get confirmation to make sure that our numbers are actually accurate as far as it's actually 1.4 that we have well last year um you know um there was definitely uh we had the

number then it changed again um and just just give us a printout of exactly so that way when we're we have a printout scoring yeah yeah just give me one second um so when we're scoring we actually know exactly what we have just some just to make sure because you know not to revisit last year but it just you know it takes time and effort to to kind of go through these projects review

these projects and score these projects and then you know only to come to find out it's like hey the numbers that we have were accurate so it kind of kind of throws it off so we can just just make sure we get confirmation that would be uh it's always going to change but right now Sandy was what 1.771 and change yeah we've been I've been going back and forth with the finance department last week or so

um to tweak these numbers exactly for that reason Richard now by the time you get to scoring next week so I got another email into them I'm waiting to hear back to them with some uh more accurate figures as well so buy next Monday's meeting you'll have exactly how much you have to spend um but but I think this number that they're giving us is pretty close to what you're going to have this year

um but I'm in I'll stay in contact with them as as the week goes on before next Monday's meeting so so you'll know thank you so much oh you're welcome anything else Richard yeah that would say it okay thanks it's also good to know that last year we had some grants refunded which was the I think the root of the problem with the change in funds too yeah and I don't think we're expecting that

this year too no we're no um okay uh so it's first one up is the uh forward Arts Association uh we'll start with the Liberation on that uh Chris do you have any uh thing you want to add um nothing nothing really it was just that Alex really did raise a good point as to what um you know what we would be able to fund as far as that because under historic preservation I don't

see how it would be covered um I don't know I I mean in my in my head I've been trying to think of a way where that would fit as far as how we could fund it and I think that's definitely going to be a steward question um because I I really can't figure out how that would fit in because you're really not it's not historic preservation because you're not making anything accurate and I thought maybe

um Recreation only because you're allowing um full public access to a building for sort of I guess recreational reasons but it's not really creating Recreation so I don't know I'm not sure how that how we go about that so I think this is one that we really it's a great project it really it really truly is but it's one that we have to figure out if and how we can fund it in the first

place it's it's kind of like when I talked to Stuart last year about the uh Central fire station and I said we're spending this amount of money for Windows and I said every year they're going to put air conditioners in and through the years they're gonna windows will be back to nothing again uh they wanted to put in uh split Minis and he says as long as it's preserving a historic building we have our discretion

so I'll ask him if this is part of our discretion I mean it's an historic building but if it's not the Art Association and it can't be open to the public is to do in the funding I mean so we'll have to look at that and see how that falls into respect there I mean right you know without being being able to provide uh the Ada I mean are they able to open

so it really wouldn't be the Art Association so we have to kind of see where the guidelines can lead us in that and uh I'll check on that Don I just want to make one quick Point um just under Recreation to I believe any Recreation funding has to be outdoors it can't be anything inside yeah I think as we active so just just keep that in mind too for recreation any other questions Chris

um no not right now Richard anything yeah um just a couple of things one is um I guess for the public to know who who was Steward that you guys are talking about so that way um you know they're not sitting here trying to figure out who that is um and the other I mean I I feel that now like this project is just being rushed just to to get it funded this year um

I think there's there's still some missing pieces to it so you know and then obviously to Alex point so I'm not sure where that where that's gonna fall um that's my only concern and that's all I have well Stuart Sagamore is uh he's like the I mean any preservation Coalition yeah all of our questions and does training and uh so when we ever have a prop a problem we always call him and talk it

over and uh see if it does fall within our guidelines and a lot of times they'll say it's within what you think Falls in our guideline I know this is you would think we're kind of rushing it uh we have had nothing major exists in the past we have had projects where we've tweaked a little to include something because they had to do this to do last year's project this is a little bigger scope we're

going into uh you know we're doing bathrooms the chair lift and you know that's what a hundred and ten thousand dollars so no right I understand so I so it gets tricky so when you when you're going into a when you're doing any kind of construction in any older buildings you have a lot a lot of these buildings that are out of code and I think that's that's where the issue I'm not saying

every project that the committee does is the case where I think in this case that's what prompted this yeah um again that's the only reason why I'm saying I'm I'm not saying it's going 100 miles an hour that's not what I'm saying but I think we're really trying you know for me I don't know about any other member but for me um it's it's going a little bit faster

so we can kind of get it on there I think there's a lot of there's some definitely some questions that need to be answered but um I mean I know this something that doesn't happen all the time but at the same time you you know folks need to do their due diligence because you know again a lot of these buildings are just old and there's certain requirements by code that you

have to do in order to get you know certain type of work done so that's all I'm saying okay well we do have two weeks before we vote so if you have any questions give these folks a call any any project uh night Chris go ahead yeah sorry can I just say one thing about that and one more second Kristen I apologize you're right I mean honestly if I have questions I prefer to do it in

a public forum because what I'm thinking I would also like for my other uh board members to hear as well in case that might prompt another question and say hey you know what you know I you know a follow-up question to that so A guess it's great to give them a call but at the same time I think it's in our best interest if we do it publicly so that way the Public's involved and everyone

else is involved and everyone's kind of you know heard what the question is um so as an example um as you guys know I'm in public service when we do any kind of construction or any type of bids if there's a question we answer it via addendum that way everyone that's on record of having pulling that that at that you know solicitation will get a copy of that question and the answer to it so

everyone's in its Fair competition and that's the only reason why I say it's I prefer to do it in a public form than just calling someone and just having a you know like I don't want to say a private conversation but just a conversation between us and that kind of given the uh the uh the respect to the other board members of the questions that I have asked so that way if they have you know

additional questions so that they they can also ask as well so but with that I you I always agree it's good to keep with the public so they can hear it too so uh get Chris go ahead no I I actually I I like what he just said about that I think that's good um because he's right it does prompt questions from other people I know sometimes when I'm listening it makes me

think oh I didn't even think of that and then there's more questions that follow so he does raise a good point um my only my only thing to that and I know um where uh Richard you had said that it seemed a little rushed and I I can completely understand that I think the whole problem is that they can't even start last year's project until they address this because they're trying to

do um they have to to deal with um routing you know taking out the granite fixing all the granite and the foundation on the porch and that and that was kind of something that was an urgent need to be done so the longer they have to wait on that the more chance that that porch is going to collapse because that porch is in really bad shape and so I think I that's probably the reason why

they're doing it this way where it seems like it's rushed and it I mean in actuality it is but there's a valid reason and that they can't even do the work that's really urgently needed on the porch until this issue gets settled so but I mean even then we still have to find out whether or not we can even fund it so it's it's kind of a sticky situation so that's it I yield okay Caroline

um I was just going to say that I can see where the possibility of us funding the um the the lift on the exterior and redoing that would make sense where I'm more concerned that we definitely wouldn't be able to fund would be the bathroom um mostly because it's this you know it's the interior and it's not really especially in historic preservation it's not you know going to be preserving you

know it's not like they're preserving an original bathroom or something like that um so I wouldn't be surprised if we could do the lift but I'd be more shocked if the bathroom you know was able to get through um but even still and there's definitely like other board members have said there's definitely some questions that I have about it sort of you know thinking about of whether or not we can actually do it

good point I mean we don't have the fun a project to the whole we could pick certain things that left the windows openly so I mean something out that's our proving on that how we wish to Grant the funding so good point uh uh join anything no not really I'm just I I pulled up the mass aab and I'm just looking at what triggers what you know and um I'm trying to see if there's uh maybe

uh Stewart who I don't know we could ask his opinion on something here um uh because I'm you know everything's open to interpretation right so I'm just trying to make sure I I understand based on the dollar amount things are going to get triggered right so the mass aav says um if the work being performed amounts to less than 30 percent of the full and fair cash value of the building and the

work costs more than a hundred thousand dollars then only the work being performed is required to comply with 521 which is the mass handicap code or if the work costs more than a hundred thousand then the work being performed is required to comply with 521 CMR uh in addition to accessible public entrance toilet Room telephone drinking fountain which you know everybody's getting away from but so there are a couple of

exceptions and I don't know if any of these would fit you know it says whether uh whether the whether performed alone or in combination with each other the following types of alterations are not subject unless the cost of the work exceeds five hundred thousand dollars or unless the work being performed is on an entrance or toilet so I guess my question is and I don't know if it's splitting hairs we're not we're

trying to make the building handicap accessible the entrance as it is the door is wide enough you're not modifying that you're just modifying how you get to it right so I need somebody above my pay grade to just interpret what that means well you go in the front way you can't because you've got the stairway you can't put a ramp or a Runway because you just don't have the the room right so

that's why the lift was the best way to go for that and and I get that but I what so is the lift me the lift is uh altering the entrance it's just it's it's altering how you get to the entrance you know and I'm just playing Devil's Advocate right now on how because I I think this is a very worthwhile project and I would hate to see it um hit a glitch yeah you know okay

that's it Alex um I already said my piece about how I don't think that uh accessibility upgrades will qualify as eligible um I wanted to reiterate that in the past we haven't particularly favorable about granting additional funding when projects haven't been completed from past grants but then again that's not to say that this applicant hasn't tried to work on that project so I wouldn't necessarily be

opposed to something that splits out the windows since they are in such dire condition but also at the same time now that they've already triggered the ADA requirements is more money and more work going to this property going to trigger anything else I don't know if the window project makes sense right now for the owner that would kind of be at their discretion I guess or our discretion when awarding it

um I am in favor of preserving this building uh Stuart saginore always um kind of tells us in regards to Historic preservation that it can't create anything new so that's my guideline for the lift and the bathroom that's interior too so I don't I don't even think that would kind of qualify under that that route usually has to be you know Street or public-facing facades so you can even make the argument that

putting the lift in the back which would be desirable from historic preservation standpoint is not even publicly viewable so that's another kind of Hiccup with the whole thing but I'm kind of just digressing um because I don't I don't think the lift would qualify as well as the bathroom unfortunately not to say it's not a worthwhile project and it wouldn't benefit the community um it's just under the historic

preservation category I don't think it would get a favorable uh opinion from Stewart on that but we can certainly ask and I'd be happy to be proven wrong foreign

meeting with Stuart tomorrow so I'll ask him on this project if he could send an email to me so I can forward it to you folks too to see how he stands on what uh CPA does in this uh instance so we'll all have a look at his ideas how we should go about this you know I've seen you guys come back did you wanna we do the kings came back if we

have any last minute questions did you guys want to ask him anything else that came back or we all set I I would be curious to know if uh getting a grant for the window uh work would be problematic for the Art Association at this point with triggering anything I know it's kind of a different area and different type of projects but I'm not quite sure if the code Consultants conversation I think I'll say this

it's a struggle for a lot of non-profits in the city to collect funding for these types of projects and you know the CP CPC is their first you know Avenue to sort of get these projects rolling and came out with Lafayette Durfee house and a number of others that if it weren't for the CPC I don't know where the these non-profits would be quite honestly so they are seeking all the funding whether

or not it would be it could be used utilized for this I don't know um but were they so early on in the process um yeah but I think what we think about with the entrance and we we understand that you have to figure out if it fits into the category that we do but overall I think it's it's going to benefit the community because it's allowing them to have an accessible entrance that they didn't

have before which means that there are other people that may not go to the Art Association that may be able to now whether it's an older population or somebody that has somebody that has Mobility limitations to be able to have them come in it may also be able they may be able to offer some different types of classes too so I think it's it's going to benefit the community in

the end if whether it it can come under CPA or something else I do think it is a community benefit and just one more thing to add the requirements the letter of the requirements may be for the exterior preservation only but anyone who's set foot inside of that house you know knows the historic you know detail and the significance of the residents on the inside we which which is just as

important as the exterior so you know you're excluding a certain population in the community by not allowing them inside of the bill which I think needs to be considered as well I think that you know maybe the the letter of the regulation State its exterior only but I think that's a narrow View of looking at it I think that should be rethought if that's the case yeah so that's what I want to give Stuart because CPAs

been changing throughout the we've been in 11 years right in 11 years the way people have been spending the money has changed to adapt to the area that it's in I mean uh some things you would never think would be funded and now it is funded because they see it as being you know preserving an old building that might not be for everybody but it is a stork and you do preserve the outside so

yeah we'll see how that goes and right you just think about we've had these conversations with the the board and uh board members but you think about you know when they hold an event public event so an event that's open to the public or if uh you know someone has a a gallery opening uh there's very likely over the years have been family members friends that have been excluded from

that building because of this and you may not know that because that person may not be coming to the board and explaining that so uh you know but I wouldn't doubt that that's the case or has been the case over the years so I just uh hope that the CBC will consider all of that so yeah we'll we'll get the information feedback and I'll share with everybody and then come voting time that's up to

committee but with regard to the windows are you aware of any code triggers that would occur if that worked so just as you know Jeremiah mentioned earlier that we look at you know typically with a study you know what those trigger points are when we brought the code consultant in it was specifically to look at egress and you know the relocating that fire escape but uh with a budget that we had

we said look at everything what could be the potential trigger points right everything from sprinklers but that's really this is that's really the only one that you saw right now you know that what would be triggered potentially in the future well it was a dollar amount for you right not one project right so if you spend 150 in Windows you would trigger right right so in the future that's a good point

you've already satisfied this project goes forward the accessibility improvements you've satisfied the requirements for the accessibility upgrades so there wouldn't be any other further triggers Beyond you know windows or whatever else they may be looking for in the future if I can just jump back so I'm I'm still reading the um the mass aav regulations here and there are some exceptions and one of the exceptions um

you know it lists certain things like septic systems this that but it does say roof repair or replacement window repair replacement repointing and masonry work is is an exception it's not a trigger

all right well any other further questions we'll close I I just have one I had one thought and I was during this Lafayette Durfee house did they receive funding for a lift on the back of the house from CPC because I'm pretty sure they did yeah so obviously it can be done that's why 21 yeah yeah I just realized that they received funding for that so obviously it's something that

it's the board's interpretation of but I mean it does you have to comply I mean it's otherwise why would you fund a store building if you can't use it for the public right and they had the same trigger amounts because of the amount of money that the committee's given them over the years the amount isn't very it's only a hundred thousand dollars yeah it's not a lot that's not a lot of money these days

to get anything and I think what it's three-year period where you spend 100 then you have to wait another three years before you spend I mean so it's you're going to trigger it if you start reading it uh it's not a very high threshold we just need Clarity can we or can we not because it sounds like to me I mean we have a summer we haven't for others

and that we want to make it fair across the board so I think that's something that we you know the board of the chair needs to find out can we can we not it Just well like I said we did do it for the Lafayette House I'll contact Stewart tomorrow and uh ask him to type up something for us as a committee and how we're supposed to look at this and then

we can determine it how you know it's our interpretation as a board people have different opinions on it so that's how we'll vote on it uh it's accessible you know we can do it but if we don't think it's right I guess we don't know you know as an individual yeah I mean respectfully I mean opinions don't matter if you can't do it um I I think if we can if if if we're

allowed to do it um then we can do it uh I think and then based on I mean they're from there is your opinion right if we're allowed to do it we can either say yes or no but if if if we can't do it because um whatever type of restriction guideline policy regulation then that changes the game um you know board member Mr Sylvia said that you know there was a project that

was denied so it's like how is that fair now so do we go back to that person that we denied before and say hey by the way we can cover it you know let's be fair it's an application this year they removed it from the scope at my request well well that's what I'm saying they removed it for that reason so would it be so let's say if if it does go through

I'm just trying to be fair guys yeah um that individual and say hey yeah yeah oh handicap bathroom really yeah yeah I don't know if no if bathroom will that's why I'll get comment on that too the lift I'm pretty sure we can we we can vote on because we have in the past the bathroom will get clarity on that how we're supposed to proceed with that I would just say that I know since this

CPC in Fall River Community preservation committee's Inception that it's been a learning process and that mistakes have been made with past grants and applications but that doesn't mean you just keep repeating the same mistakes if something wasn't eligible um I know that you know the school administration building got a ramp as well that probably shouldn't have gotten approved so I I don't think that just

because it's been done in the past would necessarily warrant uh its justification for the future okay well good I agreement on that then you know we'll call Boston tomorrow and have him give us his opinion so we can move forward all right any other questions all right we'll move on to uh the Dr Fisk house I'll be recusing myself because I'm on the board uh the Dr fiskels this has been a

project we've been working on for quite a few years uh before you leave uh Alex wraps up the outside of the building right okay so this would be their last actual uh funding for uh their building until they go inside if they want anything for the museum uh so they're looking to finish the east and west side facet with the windows and storm shutters they're looking for 79 200. uh I've always thought this was a great

project if you've driven by it they've done a great job we'll start with Chris do you have anything to add to this

you're a mucus oh sorry um I no I just I think it's a great project and I'm excited about the fact that it might finally help finish this project because I think it's always great when we have something that's done and we can say look we helped do this so that's all I have alrighty uh Richard no questions alrighty Caroline all right Joanne no questions alrighty uh no questions one of the the window

cost is reasonable and Jim uh Saul did say that this was going to be his last request all of the visual from the streets will will clean it the back of the home and and the rest of the building will be done by their own independent sourcing so yeah no I I think it's a good project yeah should go they do a great job over there I mean they didn't they'll have the backside to

finish which they don't want to come in front of us because they don't think because the public doesn't see the backside they don't want to use our money so I mean this is a group that has worked with us through the last three or four years so it's a good project uh next the academica club I did call Mike Dion about uh the plans they submitted um he had used some plans that were done

in the past and I asked if he had other drawings coming which he does have other drawings coming because I said there's no electrical or any of this and he agreed and he said there was a couple of things that they were going to have to do before they got their funding and uh I said well you know we we had some questions about uh two units we didn't think was uh sufficient

so they did say they were going to uh three units and uh on this application the uh the elevators are 275.

uh I mean everyone's looking for affordable housing I mean it's it in my opinion I mean I'm for affordable housing I don't know if it's best piece made or best waiting for a better project to come before us where we can I mean I don't know if you guys have looked at past projects CPA has done up in shovel town I think it's an Alton Mass uh shovel town was where they made shovels

Factory closed down CPC came in made a gorgeous affordable housing are we going to have that come before us I don't know but if we spend sometimes I think we spend on the little things and we Chip Away we'll make a dent but a positive impact with the taxpayers money is what I'm looking for and uh so I'll just put that out there as uh you know we did get the extra housing so we'll

start Chris you have any questions to add to it um I don't have any questions I mean my my thought on this just because it's the conversation part of it so they're requesting 350 000.

which is an awful lot of money um and we'd be getting two affordable housing units might be up to three now huh it'd be up to three units now but oh okay three units but it's an elevator so just for people know what money is going to be going for right thousand um I don't know and I mean I think because they originally had said the application was for historic preservation and

for community housing but when I asked about the letter from the historical commission they said well we'll just go for housing um I don't know I I just have some reservations here it's it's a lot of money for a small amount of Apartments of affordable housing units um and unless they were also going to put a preservation restriction on it through us I understand that Mr Dion said that he was willing to do that but

but unless it came from us I wouldn't do it because I know we had already funded this building before and the preservation restriction was not put on it for whatever reason because it was it was a different owner um there's just been there's just a lot of questions about this for many um I don't feel fully comfortable with this one so maybe somebody else's other thoughts that might put my mind a little

more at ease or just has other questions that'll be raised um but I'm I'm kind of empathy on this one yeah I did forget to add that uh when I'm talking to Mike Dion from CDA that uh I said one of our things was that the historic preservation well we did not get one if we did come in on this project we would want to have a historic preservation restriction because he's going to have the housing

restriction and he agreed to that because he was going to put the historic on but I think as a committee we would feel more comfortable having that on our end so they would agree to that uh so I thought I just I just feel like it's a lot of money no I understand your point there yeah because I mean we had we had another one come before us the Notre

Dame and we didn't fund them for nearly this much money or their elevator and I believe there were just as many units that they were going to get um and and I mean there's been so many issues with this from the get-go even from the previous applicant and that so um I don't know that that's just all yield and I'm curious what everybody else feels I agree there is there's got to be a cost factor in

350 into three units is it worth it for taxpayers and stuff uh Richard you any questions yeah so um so um quite a few things um so I always get concerned when folks are asking for for housing um money to to you know it just I always get a little leery I mean I don't want the public to think that you know folks can just buy an event investment property come to the CPC and

then request funding and then say hey we might just do two affordable housing because some of the things that go in my through my head as as a as a as a as a human being it's like okay well what kind of Lottery pool are they going to have who are they going to have living there like who's going to police that um you know we we I mean I wasn't here

prior to the the first project initiated but we missed the deed restriction on that too it's just a lot a lot of a lot of things going on in my mind that I just I don't I don't feel like this the funding for the CPC it will be good for this project um you know this is a lot of red flags um so but you know with that I I yield I

might you know I have some other Reserve comments but I'll wait to hear from the rest of the community to see what their thoughts are I mean that is a good point on I'm sure the exact amount but we have a couple hundred thousand reserved for housing if we don't use housing money we have to put a percentage aside every year so sometimes people look and say oh I don't spend any money on housing but

the reason we don't spend any money on housing is because the projects aren't there for us I think and if we do open it up to everybody coming in on like odd Street wanting to do their tenement house you know it's just where do you draw the line you know well right I mean it's it's easy to I mean so for me I mean it's very easy to explain to the public

if someone were to raise well they're not really spending money on on housing to your point I mean it's you know we can present the projects that will present it to us and and the reason why the committee as a whole whether it was a nay or a yay I mean it's very it's very simple yeah um you know you you know we have to do our due diligence I mean these are taxpayers dollars I mean

you know how many folks out there don't have an investment property that they would love to fix up I mean those are the things that I'm sure the the you know the the citizens of Fall River probably thinking like what you know what is it that they're basing it on you know three apartments for how much money I mean for for Windows that that's a lot of money yeah you know and then again it

boils down to you know what kind of Lottery pool is it gonna be you know who who's going to be in these units who gets to pick yeah or is it it's random like hey does the owner say okay I'm gonna pick three people or is it like I know like in certain cities or towns they've done different types of pools and stuff it's like would it be something like that again I'm new to

this process as far as housing but this is just kind of kind of some of the questions that I that I asked because I I like to make everything to be fair yeah you know that's all that's why I figure teaming up with CDA this this year was a good move whether we approve the project or not it sets a presence of how we're gonna do this in the pre in

the future you know when people come before us you know they have to be vetted and right because the other thing will be I'm like hey we'll just give them the money for just the three apartments that he wants to do for affordable housing yeah the rest you know they can they can do on their end you know yeah alrighty uh any further okay thank you Caroline um not so much question more you know I

certainly feel the same way about this project um the the sticker price is a little high um you know especially when they said was it 11 units in total and three of them will be 12 in total okay um I mean I I know they can't have you know all of them affordable housing but for me I just feel like 350 000 you know for Windows and three Apartments is kind of

a lot and I know the elevators in there as well and elevators are wildly expensive but it still doesn't fully add up to me um so I think you know I'm a little hesitant but I'll wait and see all right join any questions yeah I do have a few so like as the rep for the housing authority of course I want to be you know very proactive however I don't want

to be foolishly proactive and be an advocate on something that I do have some comments and questions and concerns about um and 350 000 is a lot if if it's three units that we end up with I I think that is um a lot my concerns really are more with the drawings from what I'm seeing here I'm and they raise a lot of red flags to me and I know that you mentioned

like this is not the set however this this set that I'm looking at does say permit set which makes me think this was submitted to get a permit um so my my concerns that I see I'm just gonna there's one set of drawings here for an elevator um that are from 2019 and it says progress says progress set draft written right on it and these were done by civits in 2019 this

where the elevator is shown on these plans is not where it is in this other set of plans it's a complete different location within the building so the other thing is you you'd not be able to use these drawings yes unless civitex has agreed and signed off and done the drawings these drawings would not be you can't use someone else's drawings the other question I have on the set that does say for permit um

and this just like I went through all the drawings that's that's what I that's what I do um it says original drawings done by vetrone architecture which makes me think these drawings were not done by vertrone there's another title block on here that says signature Solutions Madison Lopes residential Design Services um I'm just for reasons I'm very concerned with these drawings that I see

really who are they done by who who are these drawings done by who they need to be stamped signs are you know with a licensed architect engineer and I don't see that and um I'm concerned that I know I while I wasn't here I know there's a past history with this building that it had come before the board before um I'm concerned that I'm seeing drawings that they might not have permission to use

yeah if that makes sense no I think that you just use what they had on hand and put the presentation in I know they have drawings coming but it does add to I think it's more likely is yeah yeah so um that just raises a big red flag for me when I see something like that I wouldn't want somebody to have done that to me good point yeah Alex um yeah quite a few things uh

for one going off of Joanne's comments not having their drawings ready for us to review is problematic from the get-go I think um there's so I heard a couple times windows for historic preservation Windows aren't part of this project it's just was I think originally intended in the eligibility application then it dropped off so there wouldn't even be the windows to the benefit of the public

um generally that's how you could kind of try and spin it um I have overall concerns with how much money the community preservation committee gives uh per housing unit I don't think we really have any guidelines or preferences on say a hundred thousand dollars per unit or in this case 175 000 per unit but now there's three um I don't so to be clear I think the The non-starter Almost Is that the deed

restriction for historic preservation isn't already on this I think it's hard to justify that the grant they received in fiscal 17 to 85 000 that they already not this owner the previous owner already got uh wasn't it didn't get that deed restrictions so so basically it was a free roof for the academica so I have problems with giving more money to this building even though it is a different

owner and you know I won't hold past transgressions of previous owners or anything to them but I do think trying to convince the community to give more money to a building that already had money that doesn't have the protection on that they paid for is a Hard Sell and I think any project we approve should be an easy sell you shouldn't really have to convince the public I think it should be pretty pretty easy

the public for what we approve I did ask Stuart saginor the community preservation Coalition uh liaison for us if there was any guidance on you know how much funding you could give per units I sent the application over for the elevator he did note that there was an extremely lack of detail in the application which there was it would almost be non non you know a non-starter non-eligible just based on no lack of

information that was included not to mention the drawings that were wrongfully included um the answer he gave so so even before that there was a newsletter that showed a Brewster community housing Community preservation project that received 550 000 and they created over 30 units of housing so I mean if we as a community kind of want to go for a benchmark on how much funds and what

kind of project we want to see that will actually make a difference in Fall River maybe 30 units would be more than two um the the two units that they started with were gonna already be deed restricted affordable units from the Community Development agency so they're originally asking for three hundred fifty thousand dollars for a deed restriction that we didn't even need to give them because they were support

they're going to already have it on place so it's another Hard Sell to the community that they'd be getting something for their money because they would already be getting this need restriction for their money which kind of lends to creating another third unit so we can kind of talk about how many percentages and you know 10 affordable per project or whatever you kind of take whatever opinion you want on it but we

don't even have to do that I don't think um what Stuart said about the amount of money per housing unit and then the whole elevator thing um I'll just kind of read some of it he said the elevator can't serve both the market rate and affordable units it has to be spent on the affordable units so we would have to know that the elevator was solely servicing the affordable units

which I don't I don't think we do now um and he says the amount of funds provided should equal the value of the Restriction that the city will receive the affordable deed restriction the normal way to do this is to calculate the market rate value of the unit and then also calculate the amount an affordable unit can be sold for the difference between those two numbers is the amount you can typically invest in

the project so going forward maybe after this year when we kind of look at the application going next we're next year I think we should maybe kind of talk about community housing funds and how much we would kind of want to set aside for for future projects or anything down the line um so in short I'm not I'm not feeling good about this project I don't think it's ready I don't think the value for

the community would be would be there for the grant requests with what they would be giving at this time past practice we've put one elevator in four units and I think the uh Grant was for 280.

so he's uh more than that and we're only getting two maybe three so yeah it is a little not one of my you know I don't want to say my favorites but it's yeah yeah that's challenging so yeah Rick on the tail end here okay um I I have not noticed a letter from the historic Commission in this packet um I believe that's automatic it has to be in this packet otherwise we shouldn't

consider this package and the other the other is that this elevator is going to be used by all the housing units and the function room so now we're helping a business that this is going to be an elevator installed and being used also for the function room up on the second level and um the the other thing that we didn't get an answer from we tried in fact I think it was Alex but

this owner is is he going to own the restaurant or is he the owner of the building and he's going to lease out of the function rooms and the restaurant portion that I don't know if he's I don't think he's gonna own it I think he's leasing everything right so he's just a building owner right putting a building together and I I also take exception to the high cost of the elevator installation for

the service that it's going to be given so I just those are high yields those are my questions when you're on the tail end I don't have a few minutes like I say uh I mean I don't want if people are watching I don't want to think that we're negative against uh community housing but we do look at every aspect and think is it a good is it worth putting three units for 350

or two units for 350 or 275 so if we come across like we're not for it we haven't voted yet so but uh we just like to for you guys out there to know how we're thinking and how we're spending your money so uh it doesn't come with shock uh to you or if we did happen to vote no why we voted no or voted yes that was my reason for asking that other

question about ownership yeah if if we're putting an elevator in and a good portion of that usage is going to be to operate a restaurant in a function room yeah what are we doing when we support supporting uh an operator or an owner of a restaurant will be supporting his business we're dealing with taxpayer money and I I know that you're a big advocate of making sure it's spent correctly and that was the reason for

that so yeah is that what I mean is it the best way to spend 350 000 bucks we have to decide and you you know it's it's not an easy decision but we will make it you know uh any other further questions we'll move on to the St John Baptist Ukrainian Catholic Church oh sorry I'm Richard oh yeah so so it's how do I say um to your comment like you said to the

public that you know we're we're not negative we're doing our due diligence and I think having this um open public form that everyone is expressing their opinions um you know just goes to show how much time and effort the community um uh board members put together to kind of review all these applicants whether it's housing whatever it might be it just it just shows and the public will

see that we're very transparent and we're doing our due diligence that we're not just gonna just sit here and just um fund every single project or just yes everything at that we're asking all the necessary questions that that that um that we can because again I mean I some of us I mean I'm not a construction worker I'm not going to have all the all the questions to to some maybe some of

the work that might be done but maybe one of my colleagues might so I I you know I think we're doing our part in it and I think the public sees that based on this public forum so I just wanted to say that with that I just wanted to say go ahead to Rick's thing about the letter from the historical commission they I think are technically pursuing it under community housing now and I believe historical

commission letters are smart only for the historic preservation category and according to his application he was going for historic presentation and that's enlisted his his document on so I'm just going by his application yep thanks yeah okay but I I had brought that up at the meeting where they came before us and I asked about that and when I asked about the letter and they didn't have it he

said oh well we'll go for community housing and he basically just kind of mixed the whole thought of historic preservation I guess because they didn't get the letter I don't really I don't really know why but that was just another red flag to me well I mean he's putting in an elevator so that's really not a stored preservation on our end so he had to go the housing route historically they didn't have an

elevator so I don't think we would have been able to put that under the preservation next unless we have any other questions and comments okay uh St John the Baptist Ukrainian Catholic Church uh doors windows uh stairs Foundation railing basically uh fixing up the outside uh which does need it I mean uh it looks like a really good project and a good neighborhood I think uh the stimulus of fixing up that building

would be great for them plus it's a historic building it is a church but we're preserving the outside for people to enjoy how that architect looked back then they're looking for 58 000 uh I'll start with Chris any comments um no not at this time okay Richard yeah just real quick to what um uh board member Sylvia said earlier um you know that these some of these projects well the projects should be selling

themselves and I think this project did um so and with that I yield yeah and uh actually they're in the audience too they they did you guys put it together a great presentation so it always helps uh Caroline anything uh not at this time okay Joanne no no no no questions just I thought this was a good packet of information okay very good um just that I think it's a good value

for the dollar uh I'm I'm happy that it's I'm always happy to see projects in the South End of the city come before us I think this is going to be a this would be a great uh project for the the area in fact I I'm actually curious to see what under the vinyl looks like if um if if there's any uh future work good Rick okay well yes it's for the

amount of work that's being done in today's market the price is very very very good price and the design of the building uh you know it's it's a it's a really good project and I like the idea of maintaining it's a very simple building very simple children and you need well I was you know it's very funny but I showed this to my wife and she says oh we saw something similar to this in Alaska

and it was the Byzantine Catholic Church in Alaska also almost the same yes exactly and uh so just just the comment but yes we were there it was very nice so I agree I think it's a very worthwhile project all right any other comments we'll move on to the next one the next one is a Tupper rolling Club they did change their uh uh they were going to put docks and lanes and marking

they did go down to 135 that they're asking for uh the one nice thing about this is uh people are always saying like ah kids don't have enough to do I mean they are offering uh classes rolling for uh the uh fall River's kids so that's a plus on their side and uh there's not a lot of things rolling clubs there's one in uh there is one in Westport but not as active

they almost got the Olympic Training down here which is a plus so there is uh some things on that end the only negative that I have that we haven't got from them is uh a letter of support from the water department since they have that property under their control so that's my only thing if I know we have reached out asking for a letter from the water department um so I mean granting money to a project

that doesn't really to me have a support letter from their landlord basically what I'm looking for so we'll start with Chris any questions um no questions that was my my one concern too was that we don't have a letter yet from the water department so it's kind of hard to say you know I want to fund something when I don't know um what really the logistics of are they going how long are they going to be

there for do they have the support of the water department and then for how long um so I'm still I mean I'm on the fence unless I unless I hear differently from the water department it's a great project I absolutely love this project but to me that's kind of the one sticking point is you know and and we in our application we require letters from um whichever board or um entity they would fall under and we

don't have that so to me it's not a complete application yet Richard yeah so I I I at least I disagree with my colleagues I think that if the water department is leasing the property obviously you know um it's it's for a city to release a property so when I I think they have to go through a lot of variables to in order to to get the lease so um I'm not too concerned with that I

mean they did get a letter support from Senator rodericks I'm not sure if maybe um you know what the delay is uh maybe if there's some kind of explanation but I mean I think overall I mean this project will be huge um here in the south coast in Fall River I think just the dynamic dynamics of it um and just they're so diversifying you know Sports here in the city I mean

think of the impact down the road I mean I I've seen it personally like I said again I mean I I lived in Cambridge and I actually I I worked as a lifeguard down the street from with where they held all all the uh all the meats and let me tell you had colleges from from from everywhere you know coming down and competing and we can say that we were

doing it here first in Fall River in the South Coast that we're we're doing you know a different type of event and you know and this also like I said I said not last meeting this also brings revenues you know you're bringing in all kinds of folks and now they're going into the community they're shopping around they're saying hotels staying at restaurants and it's another foot Mark that you know someone in in you know

California Mississippi Alabama could say oh I know Fall River you know it's it's huge and and you know I think once once it gets off of the ground I think that's what it really needs I I think it'll get going it's just I think it's just the amount of um contributions they've received I mean because it's self-funded so just just them being able to just be self-sefully funded and then also I mean where do you

go and get anything for free now nothing's for free yeah you know yeah the price of eggs is how much what eight bucks you know for them to say hey we're gonna do this um and we're all the the kids of uh you know Fall River will be able to attend for free that's the return on investment the way I look at it so um I I think it's a phenomenal project

I'm not I'm not too concerned if they get a letter from the water department or not that that's not going to stop my my thoughts on it but with that ideal okay I might get Paul Ferlin a call tomorrow just to see how his feeling is on it and I mean if they feel okay I mean hopefully the letter wouldn't be bad but I just think that you know everyone says who would

rope but I mean who played intended to you God had intend to said I think this is an opportunity to get people kids out of the house and doing something fun because it just seems interesting I mean I'll give you an example so look at the South Coast Plaza there's someone made a comment like well you're going to have all those shops who's going to go there well if you build it people will go you

go in the South Shore Plaza which I do you know the place is always packed yeah yeah you know so it's the same thing if if we build it people will come you know um and and again it's just another you know um uh foot Mark or Fall River diversifying kind of what we do here you know for for our kids so some you know in a different additional sport than just the regular traditional sports that

we have here yeah the group can I just one quick thing sure so I I completely I agree with every single thing that um Richard said the only thing is I think in keeping things fair when we require letters from everybody else for certain things and we did ask them for this letter I think we still need to you know if we're keeping it fair we need to keep it fair and we

need to get what we asked of them and that's that's my only that's my only issue I completely agree I support the project I think it's a great project but when we're asking for stuff and we're not getting it that's my that's my one concern if we can get it then absolutely I agree we'll reach out again tomorrow to both Paul and the city to see if we can get a don't let her commitment you know

you want me to email drop my email yeah go ahead and email them yeah I I've talked anybody on that email please huh can you copy me on that email absolutely we'll just copy the whole uh board down on that that way we'll know it went out

okay uh where do we end uh Caroline any questions um really no questions um I'd also like to see that letter before you know just trying to figure out why they haven't entered in yet um but otherwise I also think it's a fantastic project um and I personally had no idea that we had such a um you know admirable Waterway for rowing um so certainly taught me a little something

about you know the city I grew up in but um if we get the letters before I'd be excited for it okay uh join any comments um not really just echoing everyone else you know looking for that letter and I can are we able to ask them what if they're leasing it what's the terms like is it a two year three year five year ten year what is that lease I forget what he said it was

oh you know that right it's a 10-year lease they're into the fourth year they have six years of remaining okay thank you Alex um I would just like to say that I'm a strong believer in Fall River playing up its strengths and I think the what Southwood top upon is a very undeveloped strength that the city could use and I'm happy to see this project come before us they are a new group and I think Paul

the Cloutier the the applicant said they were a first-time applicant so um I'm not as worried about the letter of support as Richard said they do have a lease with the water department um that in itself is some agreement but generally when non-property owners submit for Grants they do need a letter of permission from the property owner Any Grant uh award that we give could be contingent on that litter of support I I

would add I believe we can make it contingent on receiving the letter of support as well that's it Rick there are a few letters here that that was supported by the public school system of Agassi and Atlantis also highlighting the advantages of having this uh getting their students involved in it so at least school systems obviously Atlantis and public school system are enthused about this

and I think that just the added tourism people come down to participate they participate for a weekend and that means hotels restaurants shopping so I think as a tourist attraction also you know it's positive in addition to the the children that you know in young adults that are going to be involved in this program I mean they just did that beach over down there so it's just going to

add to that area where you keep putting money into it getting people to go to the pond you know and enjoy what some of the best benefits you've lost audio testing hello okay I can hear you I can hear you now but oh we lost it for a minute oh okay I was just saying how like the the pond has so much to offer for us we did the uh Dave's Beach the picnic area down there

this is just going to be a continuance of adding to what our Waterfront can be so uh Paul if you're listening to this meeting you've got our votes but you just try and get us that letter and make a a little more easier to stay within our guidelines that we have followed in the past uh just to keep everything even you know so uh if no further questions we'll move on to the next one

next one is North burial ground uh this one we've uh and this will be finishing up uh the project it's the uh do the gates of masonry uh restoration they're looking for 93 000.

um we'll move on to questions I think this is a decent project we did the uh the gate house that's finished um I know I was talking to Chris and they're looking at doing different things to improve that Cemetery which I think would be greatly enhanced because I think we should respect uh our past but that doesn't have anything to do with the 93 but just uh we'll move on Chris any comments

um no I mean I think they did a great job on the on the Gatehouse so far and it would be nice just to see more work done I know it's the the gate itself the columns on the gate are really beautiful and I'd like to see them Resort and have a gate put in and I think there's probably going to be a lot more eyes on that area with the um

the train coming so it would just be nice to to have that part of our city be enhanced as well hmm okay uh Richard any comments uh no comments all right Caroline no comments all right uh Joanne um just don't I'm sorry just a question so on this form it says they're requesting 110.

yeah 110 yeah but I have 93. yes it's 110 they're requesting I think originally was 93 000 and they I think they bumped it up to 110. okay all right so it'll be uh that last before yeah okay Alex did you have any um no questions or anything like that but I just wanted to say that they've done a great job I like the attention they're giving this Cemetery um similar to Kristen's point about the

train bringing increased access uh once Route 79 that Redevelopment project wraps up and that whole area becomes more walkable it's not out of the realm of possibility to think that there could be a lot more historic uh tourism at that uh Cemetery yeah it's kind of like if you go to Boston and walk the Freedom Trail and you walk by the old cemeteries I mean we have well-known people that are in our

cemeteries that it's a great walking tour and I mean it that's what you a lot of people like I mean it brings people in to look at it I mean they're doing a great job so I yeah uh Richard no no comments I just other than I think it's a Well worthwhile project and it's finishing up the existing detailing of a project that was done okay uh next one is the former School ad building

uh this is for the back porch derailing patio uh the uh porch fence uh they're looking for sixty thousand it is in bad shape I do think it would improve the building as an historic building um that's I have to add Chris any comments no not at this time oh um actually did we did we get a letter an updated letter from the historical Commission on this one because I don't remember seeing

anything yet I haven't gotten anything not yet no I haven't gotten any we do have one on the last past applications I don't know if that appeases yeah yeah well well that's a different it's a different um application all right so Richard uh Mancini yes did they did they reach out to the historical commission yet they have not at this time were asked at our last CPC meeting when they attended they were he's a project

the rail all right okay then I mean I still I love the project I think it's a great project and I know they've done some some good work in there so far but it's still an incomplete application because it says right on our application we require it and we ask them for it and it's not they are so the application is not complete already I mean I hate to be sticklers but it's

it's the fair thing to do and if you're if you're asking for as much money as some of these people are asking for you as an applicant also need to do your due diligence and you know Fair it was fair we need to hold everybody accountable to the same standards good point and that I yield okay Richard let's piggyback off of Chris I agree just everything obviously has to be uh

fed across the board and with that ideal okay Caroline no comments okay I know in these letters we've asked I mean you could see Sandy's been sending him out for requests for quite a while I mean we started in October and now we're into March so they should have these easy things in uh they might not think it's of importance but to us it's part of the application and should be completed

so can I just say one thing John yeah I'm sorry um so under number five Community City endorsement in the section B and this is in bold print if a board or commission that the project falls under does not support or provide a letter of support for the project it will not be considered for funding so I mean it's right there in print and it's in bold print so and we have I mean

this is our application we have to take that part seriously yep I agree I agree I just want that out so the public knows that's exactly what it says on the application so Caroline um you've already been to me oh okay Joanne today no I am I have no further comments Alex um I would I would just say that we could also make this contingent on receiving the letter of support should

we want it to proceed with the grant we could even give a date like a deadline whatever would kind of be the committee's preference that's all I have to say it's a I I went by there recently and this particular area definitely does need some attention but um the letter is easier to get than some other things in the application so uh it's up to the committee I think yeah I agree I mean uh

you know sometimes people think we're a piggy bank and we don't really this is it's a requirement we should stick to our guns if they don't have it in they we don't fund a project uh because application was incomplete so we'll reach out again but if I think if they don't have it in by 27th the day of voting that it would be a non-complete application in my point of view

let's see uh Richard yeah well there is a commission meeting historic Commission meeting on the 21st of this month if you want to send them a letter Sandy just letting them know that there's a commission meeting and we are going to have the option of Zoom yeah but your your voting meeting is next Monday 20th oh the 20th I thought it was 27th yeah no it's the 20th oh okay all right I'll I'll confirm that with

the city clerk's office but I believe it's because I it's like this immediately the week after this one I will confirm first thing in the morning and let you all know but I I do believe that it's um next Monday and if you want a date no later than to my email this way I can forward it to all of you on a deadline to get those letters just let me know

well it should be you have other you have other projects that haven't submitted their letters of support either unless Rick you've gotten them through the historical Commission which other ones are they have we already just for the record the um the maritime museum has not submitted theirs uh the Art Association was asking they they did I think I forwarded that to all of you um they did get their letter of support

full Administration all both projects yeah yep I was projects the if you look at the the deck and the railing that's in dire need of repair and that's fine but when you look at the window project we have not seen the windows there's still the the sample window is still on back order comment when we had our discussion was that it was maybe 20 weeks out yeah then it's got the contract has got to be

lined up and then they've got to get in install to install the window and take a look and see it's it's really out there quite a bit yeah and to fund a project when we have not seen the windows this is a large project really again raises concerns well a lot of Windows we have when we did Lafayette House and we've done uh Dr Fish House they have to follow the standards set

down by the state so we don't always see the window that they're going to get so I mean I'm okay with that part but not having all the paperwork in that is just as important you know I mean I'm sure we get the right Windows because they have to follow otherwise we don't pay for them so they're on the hook so but uh yeah Ashton just because I'm not I'm not understanding so you're if if

construction starts on a product they can't start construction until the project is funded right but they can put in a sample window they were what they wanted to do was try and narrow down the cost they were going to get a sample window but sample window is not coming in for 20 weeks so they were going to have a contractor put it in and estimate how long per window it

took them to put it in so they could say how much the windows were going to cost so I guess in theory they would maybe not count that sample window as part of their project so they didn't start their project but actually we never clarified that so that's an assumption yeah yeah so but that's 20 weeks out for the window but if they get it 20 weeks out and then they ordered the rest it's

another 20 weeks who knows how long it's going to take them to get window restoration can be quite time consuming you know supplies in general are taking a long time I just wanted to so that's putting in that sample window is not considered starting construction no they just wanted to get to a basic per cost per window like the window came in at 300 it cost a hundred dollars so 400 times 30 Windows that's how they

were looking at it so but we probably should clarify that we probably should have clarified that that wasn't that was broken out of the scope though because I think it would technically be if it was part of their project and they started before granting warning I think you would be starting the project if they're well that would have wouldn't be included yeah I mean I don't think we

clarified that in their numbers and everything like if it was one of the windows yeah depending on repairing yeah um okay so um one and on the school ad uh window replacement uh did anyone else have a question Chris any comments on that one we're on patios though oh patio we're gonna work finished up okay so unless we had anything else on the patio I yield okay uh so on the window replacement um 260.

um it has to be done to Historic standards I mean they don't have a copy of the window we we don't have a letter of support from the Historical Society um and there's quite a lot of money this year we don't have a lot of money so I mean we've been asking for letters of support so that's my feeling on it uh Chris do you have any comments on this

um no just seeing it as the other project we asked for the letter and you know I'm not gonna really consider it until we have that because it's not it's not a complete application and based on our um based on our own rules right on the application we won't consider it for funding unless we have a complete application so same thing I love I I mean I think these are great projects but if they're not

giving us what we've asked for um they're not doing a due diligence as applicants and the fact that they want money from us I I mean it's you know the same we we have to hold them all to the same standards that's all that's my only comment I I just I still think it's a great project I know the building needs it I've toured the building um it's a beautiful building and it

definitely needs the help so hopefully we can we can get that from them soon the only other thing I wanted to throw in uh when I was driving by the building every window has an air conditioner in it that wasn't addressed and we're going to spend 260 000 on new windows to have air conditioners go in out in and out we're going to be back to the same problem five years down the road Windows torn

apart leaking so I I don't know you know that's a question I have too I don't want to replace something and have them come back you know uh and we're not into putting split minis into the ad building so but uh so um just real quick uh just to determine with the one so as far as the application so you have um first time applicants that you know should read thoroughly the application might miss

something and then you have other folks that this is not their first rodeo from what it sounds like so you know for some of these products this is not the first time the school department has come before the board asking for funding so I mean I have the lower request and I don't think should should be something new that they they're not aware of uh but and then to what you you're what

you're saying uh it's a chair is that it's true if every window has an AC unit do we even want to fund this project I mean yeah taking AC unit in and out in and out every year I mean at some point you know down the road you're looking at to purchase new windows so should their focus maybe be looking at the HVAC system that they have I'm not sure what

the issues are over there as far as HVAC if that's the case but yeah that's something uh to consider and without a yield yeah good good point I mean maybe you should look at that first and then come back to us uh Caroline no comments all right Joanne not real comment Alex no new questions it's an excellent point that you just made John a good observation um uh the windows that were highlighted as being

the style to install are six over six so what do you do do you take one of the new windows and stop removing a section some of these panes of glass and forming some you know what are you doing six over six it's too narrow too small yeah put a window of air conditioner and so what do you do here yeah or do you I don't know do you raise the window and

then have to build the box to stick the AC in the point is very well taken all the more reason why I think it behooves us to look at the window when it's installed and then find out what's going to be done how will they how are they going to transition that for AC what are they going to do well we can visually see the the thought of well we're going

to get the window and put it in and that's what it is I'm going to follow the standards but they're going to modify the standards so your point is very well taken okay uh any other comments on okay we'll move on to the next one uh Northwest upper Pond sea wall for assessment study the only one good thing about this one it would open up funding for federal grants to replace the firewalls I mean this

application request has been on I think two other times so it's been before us it is a light funding year I don't know how the board feels about studies but in the past we've kind of overlooked them but this one where we'll gather Federal funding do we want to take a harder look at it I'll leave that up to you guys uh Chris any comments uh no not at this time uh Richard

um just real quick the only comments I have is um I mean I know that the water department came before us and said this was in in dire need uh this is almost to declared as an emergency um if this was an emergency the city should have taken care of this a long time ago as far as um I kind of view this so I don't I don't deem it as an

emergency I deem it as they study to potentially fix it down the road but I am glad to hear that they might be some federal funding and I would like clarification on that as exactly from from where from what type of funding because I know a lot of the monies that were kind of um distributed federally to say like as Opera funds um they already been allocated for so what federal funds are they going to receive

um because again if they're looking to have um for this city it has to go in front of a board um so I'll be curious to to see what what that board would say if they would approve um funding and if if we went ahead in in the CPC uh funded Dr study that IU I I don't remember where he said he'd be getting the funding from but Paul Ferlin and the water department are excellent

at getting funding I mean yeah I know we'll miss uh board member Mr messini said that um he he suggested that with with the Opera funds be um will be eligible to to uh to do the work um and I think that's where we left it off last time and you can correct me Mr messini if I'm wrong but I think that that was kind of the direction that that

uh that you were going and I agree with that with that with that motion because again I mean this because if not this is just going to be another study that's going to sit on the Shelf because the Well's drying up again I'm everything's been allocated for unless the city does this there's so there's two buckets when it comes to Opera this restricted and unrestricted the only way they can get this done if it's

unrestricted and then depending upon how much the project is going to be you know if it's going to be 200 300 400 000 that's you know significant amount of money um based on just the study being 82 000 this project is not going to be something very cheap which I don't want to say that it wouldn't be funded from there but I highly doubted that it would be found funded for from

for my performance so with that I yield yeah okay uh Carolyn anything I know how common this is alrighty uh Joanne no I don't have any comments Alex I just wanted to say that I think it's a pretty good project I also appreciate the alternative funding uh sources that they've been paying attention to because we ask of it we ask it a lot uh if if it's considered in the water department

has done a good job with this um I do want to say that I think we're fortunate enough to be talking about a condition assessment and not an emergency repair because I think the costs could be uh probably higher if it would ever get done you know maybe they'd decide that that Granite is better at the end at the bottom of the pond you know who knows I think it's it

would be more it would behoove the community to take the condition assessment and make take preventative measures uh rather than react to it okay Rick I second those comments uh I I like the project and if you I do a lot of walking up in that area and those walls are getting bad and starting to deteriorate and they can be saved so it's a good thing to get a good assessment done and and then take the

war sections and repair them and maybe it's a gradual process it might be a a process that's going to take another five years or more but at least they'll know what's structurally not sound at this particular time and then you know work it in piecemeal and I agree with the project and I do want to add that um never mind that's all good enough okay any other questions the only comment I have is I think this

goes back to an earlier comment I had about trying to get a master plan you know in place and I think based on what Rick said this this would be something that it would I'll it would outline what might need to be done over the next few years I mean I deal with deferred maintenance all the time and it's it's it you know people like to see brand new shiny stuff and

well a lot don't want to fix up what you have already but um I think it's worthwhile in the past we when we did the quicker Shan Trail rail trail uh if we didn't do the study Federal funding would not have come in right so by us doing that we now have the book or something else yeah um and our next project coming up will show how uh the Adirondack Farm Bio Reserve I do

want to say well and so if we if something did happen to the Sea walls if anyone could correct me if you're wrong I think First Step would be a conditions assessment to make repairs in which case we could see an emergency application in the future and uh any condition assessment or repairs would probably ultimately fall on the taxpayer in the end whereas this would allow the water

department time to leverage additional funding yeah I mean either water rate goes up or yeah it's an Enterprise fund so but on the next one they're asking for 415 658 but on CPA they're only asking for 141 329 they went out outside source and got another 260 to almost 268 thousand dollars uh and they've done that a lot in the past so just tying that into the other one they normally come up with funding but

the uh the one we're on now uh I think this is a great project I mean 141 for uh Seven Acres of farmland and uh to put out the three houses out there for uh um opening up to the public for hikers I think it's just a great opportunity to just enhanced that Freetown Forest area which we've invested quite a bit of money in already so Chris any comments on the project nope nope I love this

project and um yeah I mean they really are great at finding ways to fund um their projects I I hope that other applicants will look at their projects that they've done either in the past or even currently in their applications and see what it means to um to look for other sources of funding and the way that they find them is is pretty impressive so um you know I I think that this is a

great project I always have so I uh that's my only comment I'm sorry Chris said this is a great project I mean the water department does do a good job you know getting you know trying to get funding from other sources um so with that I yield okay thanks Caroline uh no further Thomas okay uh Joanne I'm I think this is a great project and commend them for going out and finding

other sources of it you know other sources of money for this but I think it's I think it's very good okay uh Alex same thing great project amazing return on investment for the community of Fall River in the end yeah again I I second all of that but I'm also getting involved in doing a Form B study of that whole area and Mike labossier has located someone so it'll be a lot of

work being done and I'm getting very familiar with what's going on out there but also the intended use of this property is going to be to enhance all of the visitors and people who am into that whole biosphere area they're going to be able to have a headquarters where they can get the information they can where I start running tours from there so it is it's an excellent project and

it's going to be a tremendous asset to the city a foreign when it gets done it's a great way to get kids into the woods and uh I mean what they have a 20-mile trail now that goes the whole way over to Dartmouth and back I mean so many trails so many bike trails I mean it's just kids need to be open to this and have the opportunity to

see what Wildlife is you know so I think it's thanks to the CPC the historic commission put money in it was going to be how Lima was going to run this this project and he subsequently passed away but it's that money that is allocated through CPC to do a Form B yeah there was there's no recorded history of most of the items and most of the areas on almost 60 percent of the land in full

River yeah so we're going to try and do that because good any other questions I have comments on okay we'll move on to the last one the Maritime Museum uh it's a avac uh study let's see what they need to put in uh 91 000 for uh architect designs I know this is important to uh preserve history and the documents down there I'll open it up Chris any questions um just a comment similar to the other

of course they did not um submit a letter of support from the historical commission we did ask for it and it's right in the packet again so it's not a complete application if we haven't received it they it and it's not that they didn't see the question because they are they attached a letter from Mayflower wind and it's right there under the the category where they wrote it but they didn't put one from the

historical commission and we requested it so um yeah that's my that's my only comment okay and they're not a first time applicant either so I hope they're not okay okay um Richard uh no comment Caroline no comment Joanne um I I just have I have a question you you mentioned before on another project that it wasn't anything that had come here before tonight and I'm just I just want to get the ground rules um that

on the back of a house there they were they hadn't asked for for any funds it wasn't I don't know what project because the public couldn't see it well that's they decided not to write the Dr Fish House you guys aren't going for funding for the back of the house because Jim said he didn't think it was generally with all historic preservation projects the benefit usually has to be towards

the community so Street facing facades are emphasized over say rear-facing spots where no one walking a sidewalk or driving the street could look in you know marvel at the historic architecture or anything like that so how does that play into an HVAC project uh it could play a different a couple different ways it's all on a case-by-case basis if you take for example the center fire station project

that we approved last year that John mentioned we did the split uh the split HVAC system for uh you could argue uh that installing those hvacs removes the air conditioners which were damaging the historic facade because they were ruining those medallions and you know you just kind of Dripping on everything for this one I believe the argument is it preserves the history within like the

documents and the artifacts so it's a bit different compare a different comparison okay that helps you it's just trying to figure out to figure it out that's fine I know when we got approval we'll do the uh split minis for the central fire station uh Stewart said it was up to us to determine if it was historical he goes first it is saving the historical Windows because you're not going to be

putting the air conditioners in uh so that would be protecting the building saving the windows and controlling for other damage doesn't happen uh so like the uh Maritime Museum they have the old photos the old print gets too humidity they stick together they could lose stuff so that's why they want the study to do this I know Rick went down there and looked at past projects we did uh we don't know

if the elevator works or not it wasn't open for us do you want the the elevator is non-functional right now problem is that they have not received an inspection from the state or the elevated inspector and they've just signed the document with another elevator firm that's going to come in check the elevator make sure that it's functioning and functioning correctly and then they'll call the state

inspector in to get an inspection on the elevator but it's been funded it's installed it's been there for a while but it's it does not function does it cannot be a funds can't be operated you can't go in there and use the key that I'm not allowed to no inspection okay and an electrical project nothing's been done on an electrical project outside of building a a containment area and that's going to be

it's they're moving the entire service the electrical services in the basement and they're going to be moving that entire apparatus up into a room on the first floor that's that's the intent so I got a lot of work to do yes yeah is the second floor open to the public uh you can move stairways they have right in the back they have one non-compliant stairwell that will get you up there but there's

no handicap access no second means of egress off the second one second means of egress no I also don't think the second floor is technically open to the public you can make reservations well there's like a Library part and then there's a big kind of storage room that they hope will be something one day but people I know use the library I think you have to make reservations and stuff like that so it's

technically not open to the public documents or something like a pretty historic uh they've got some really historic uh books and photos and maps and things up there uh in this in this library and that's one of the reasons that they want to get some some humidity control in there there's nothing now they want to get humidity and temperature I've seen them photos where they start sticking to the glass or

something and it's just I mean I can see where it's important to have um um any other comments on them projects that overall or any I was just gonna also mention since I mentioned for the other ones that if we were so willing we could tie tie the grantle of the award to you know receiving a letter of support um and also mentioned that this is also one of an applicant with the outstanding

project that hasn't been complete and Rick said it's moving but it's it's hasn't started yet so that's my only thing is when we're in a tight year for funding I mean the elevator probably does work they don't have the permanent which is fine but they still have a lot of electrical work to do and non-profit I don't know if they're going to be able to finish that this year could they wait until next year to get

this done I mean do we really want to pay for work and let it sit on the shelf for a year two years that's the only thing I look at um and anything else I guess if people are watching and if you don't have everything in it might sound we're like we're nitpicking about historical uh letter from the historical commission but uh we we do require it so uh if you

want your projects to move ahead uh please do your best to get this information into us to make it easy um I don't think we have anything else on scoresheet discussion um we've got one two and three we take the lowest scores and then we work our way down so this year around uh make sure your ones are uh did we get down to the I can't uh will we how many yeah you

could yeah four ones four twos and three threes uh one is your most favorable three is your least favorable so those four ones four twos and three threes because you have eleven projects okay now I don't know that you're gonna be able to score this until last minute because if you don't get your letters of support obviously they're not gonna be eligible or considered so do you want

a deadline of Thursday for them to get these letters of support in uh yeah I would say a deadline of Thursday is fine yeah I mean pretty much I think everybody has probably a good idea what they want to fund but like I say if we pull a hard line where we say you've got to have everything in then that does knock some projects uh out of the high categories Chris so I

I cannot understand the Thursday deadline and see that's the issue so they're going to have to go before the historical commission which means the historical commission is going to have to have a special meeting because they're already meeting next week if we need this before Monday and the historical commission needs to give 48 hours before um before any public meeting so that they can have enough time to put the

agenda out there and if they're trying to do this tomorrow I mean they're going to have to do this like figure out a date early tomorrow and it's not it's not going to be before Thursday so I mean I don't know how else how else to do this it's it's not like they weren't told they were all told they were all told at the eligibility hearing if your project falls on the

historic preservation you need to get a letter from the historical commission they were told when we had the um the funding hearings you need to get a letter from the historical commission so at this point they don't have those letters in and I don't see how they're going to get them in by Thursday so I don't know and I I understand um commissioner Silva's um thought on having the the um

funding contingent on you know that we Grant it as long as they get us the letter but even in our application it says they won't be considered for funding without the letters so in in essence even if we do that we're still considering them without the letters and we're going against our own application criteria at this point I I don't know how the historical commission works on a letter I mean

well they have to vote don't they they have to vote they have to have a meeting the previous project you would not they have to make a presentation and then very similar to what we do here we question uh and and then we'll take a vote on it and then the letter has to get written up but again as Kristin stated it's 48 hours which means it would have to get in by Tuesday afternoon and

noon at 6 00 PM in order to have a Thursday meeting Thursday Thursday would be past the deadline unless we set a Friday exactly yeah yeah it's kind of do you remember it's up to you right I mean I I think we gave notice uh September 9th when we had our applications come in it said it right there so I mean they've had since September to get all this paperwork in

so what are we going to do postpone our meeting because people didn't get their application completed and the meeting is next Monday I forwarded you all the um paperwork from the city clerk's office I mean it's it really is not fair to all the other applicants who did their due diligence and got everything they needed and especially I know like the thought well it's a first time project it's a first-time project we

have all the people that came in for first-time projects and they have everything in that we requested of them um so you know it's a matter of these are people that are applying for large amounts of money you're not talking about we're going to give somebody 20 bucks for something you're talking tens of thousands sometimes hundreds of thousands of dollars and yes I think it's important that we hold them to the

standards that we set and if we set the standards of this is what needs to be done then that's what needs to be done and we need to hold them to those standards okay and that's I mean that's just my that's just my opinion but I mean we we set those criteria for a reason and if we're going to hold everybody if we're going to play fit here then everybody has to play fair the same way

and follow the same rules and we have to expect those same things and if we're bending over backwards and extending things and and doing last minute then it really isn't fair to the people that did things the right way in the first place I think we've bend it over backwards already so uh we have Alex um the questions about would it be fair and how that would weigh on approving it

is perfectly valid and I think everyone can you know determine that for themselves I think that if the applicants that are trying to or said they were pursuing the letters are actually pursuing it it wouldn't be unreasonable for us to check the historical commission agenda on Monday or Friday which it would be solidified by then and see if they actually did get on the agenda with the intent of getting

their letter in which case we would in theory receive it a day after which we could like I said make a grant award contingent on the approval knowing that they went on there they're on the agenda for the next day that's just an idea for um about a minute and a halfway I guess when do you put out the agenda for uh ironically enough I'll speak to Jason today and he's going to be putting that

in Monday I'm sorry Friday yes so it would give them so they've got you know so maybe they were planning on doing that we could make our deadline Friday if they applied for a letter have them let us know because I don't think the people who were here at the last meeting would have there would I don't think there was a historical commission since then a cerebral commission meeting since then right

I don't think so no so if they did say they were going to get it and they were intending on getting it they still hadn't hadn't had the opportunity to do that from from what we well they but I mean they really I know it is for they had the opportunity to do it really have had the opportunity to at least reach out and say since okay I mean the last meeting I mean

I mean he told them so they've been sold twice already they were told that the other disability hearings that they were told of the funding hearings so do we want to give till Friday a deadline to make sure well we'll get the agenda if they're not on the agenda we'll say it's an incomplete project and not put it in voting and even if they are on the agenda we can still vote you know how

but not on the agenda it's an incomplete project should we even vote on it no okay comments questions so the I do the greater Florida Art Association was asked at our meeting and we did get a letter from the Fall River historical commission yeah we had a special meeting in attendance okay and we do that when there's a there's a storm we'll get out there and present take care of these individuals

we'll make special accommodations and that's what happened okay I happen to be I visited at the Arts you see a preservation just to to look at the windows and look at the city and I had made mention to to Dana and that I was on a Saturday morning at nine o'clock and at 10 10 30. she called Jason and had a scheduled meeting so anybody could have done that and apparently there are still people that

have not even reached out to the historical I have something to add um but it sounds like this board is just scrambling for applicant and the applicant should be scrambling to to get themselves to the agenda we we shouldn't be dragging this meeting on any longer right right because folks didn't do that due diligence it sounds like some folks did and some folks didn't it's not up to

this boy to chase anyone if they want the funding to the board's point I mean we're not talking about five bucks 10 bucks we're talking about hundreds of thousands of dollars so please do do your due diligence so that way you can be illegible and your project will be voted for okay with that on you all right so on Friday when we redo the exploring applications if they're not on

the agenda do we want to take them off the scoring because I don't think they should be on it if they don't complete an application yes but so if they're so say they get on the agenda because they're watching the meeting tonight and say oh well now they're not going to give us the money so they're going to hurry up and call Jason tomorrow to get on the agenda which they didn't even

bother to do in the first place and what's to say you're even going to approve the project is okay so we're gonna say say we say okay we're gonna approve you contingent on getting a letter from the historical commission and they don't get it but it already knocks somebody else out of the running so now we have to come back and vote again to add somebody else in that did their due diligence

do you know what I mean that's why I don't want to vote for somebody who doesn't have them I'm talking about hand holding at this point I'm sorry go ahead John if they don't have a complete application I don't want us to be voting for them because that's going to take somebody away that did all the hard work right so we shouldn't even consider them we can say okay they're

going to be on the agenda for the historical commission at their meeting on Tuesday but there's no guarantee the historical commission is going to say okay well we approve this project and and the fact is we've given them time to do this and they haven't done it so at this point we are hand holding and like Richard said we're chasing down these people when they should be the ones that

are doing their own due diligence just like all the other applicants that did things right it's not fair even and I can understand what commissioner Silva is saying because there are some great projects that I fully support but they did not do their due diligence and I don't think it's fair that we're going to extend things passed a deadline past our voting deadline at this point Mr

chairman the letters will not be in but the time we vote right could Kristen put that in a motion and we'll take a vote on it that way it's cut and dry we know that if there's no letter okay then we remove them from from the list Let's uh can I just say one thing first sure right um so I personally am fully in support of you know having that hard line I just

think we need to be clear from that at the beginning of the process not a week before the end of it I think we have been clear though I know but pretty sure if you look at it you know from a fair perspective we've already had multiple letters come in late so we we let those letters come in late and then we're not letting these letters come in late there's no clear break of where we

stopped considering it that I think could be fair to the applicant uh any more so than we've already been I'm just trying to look at it from you know giving everyone the same treatment so far that it this is in the middle of the process of the 11th hour and we're coming up with the new kind of restriction the application said it would not be considered but then we should not have considered anything that

did not have the letter the required letters as soon as it was submitted during all these deliberations that would have been fair I think it wouldn't be considered for funding funding is we we are we are voting on Monday that's when we are considering who gets funded and who doesn't this is still all talking this is still all deliberation and this is where I mean we've always let some letters come in a

little bit late because we have not voted on the applications this is where we're getting things in even before the vote but my point is on Monday we vote and if these letters are not in by the time we vote then I would say then yeah that's your deadline and the last time we were here we told them those letters had to be they needed to have those letters we told them at the last meeting

they knew when our next meeting was because we said when our next meeting was and those letters are not here yeah in the past we've always helped applicants if they ask us what they need to get in but on this circumstances we're voting so our vote is on which everything should be in on Monday I mean if it's not in I don't think they're going to vote you know so if somebody

wants to make a motion if all contents are not in by Friday they won't be put on the uh project voting list if anyone wants to make I'll make a motion that if all of the applications that are now being considered have not given in all of the letters that we have requested that we do not consider them as part of the voting that okay uh okay uh we'll do roll call vote um

I don't know if we um no we all know so why uh Chris Kristen Cantara Oliveira yes Richard yes Caroline yes Joanne yes Alex no uh yes and Rick Mancini yes I mean it's hard for me to say yes on that but if we're going to stick to standards I mean I want to pick and choose but you can't do that so I mean um folks have just got to get in the

paperwork and uh I mean we can't be taking different sides on one project and then the other one we're we're holding them uh accountable for everything so um okay I need some I need clarification for me in my role for you um do you need me to contact all these people to say you need to go to the historical commission you need to go to the water department just direct me yes you need uh if you

could send a letter out to uh we need a Tupper rolling Club they need a letter from the city uh uh forward Administration they need a historical commission sign off uh let's see who else here um and we need those letters by Friday by Friday we need a commitment all right there's no way they're going to be able to get some letters why Friday because the historical commission would have to

meet Friday on Thursday or Friday that's out of our hand I mean we just took a vote we voted on it and since they've had time we've passed the motion uh it's it's a hard decision I mean if they don't come in they're not on I mean so I will I will wait Friday at the end of the day if I don't get anything I will update this score sheet

and email it to you all Friday night okay is everybody okay with that sounds good okay any other discussion on the scoring sheet Sandy I would just say um can you just copy all the board members so we can all be in the same page absolutely whether it's room it doesn't matter um just just copy us and then that would be great um whatever yeah and whenever I

get I'll forward to all of you as I get things sounds good Sandy can you just make sure all those are bcc'd emails for us so they don't reply all and we get an open law violation because we're all emailed on the same thread with responses coming in oh yes okay so what do you want me to do Alex BCC all the members so the people you're emailing can't reply to all and then

because if any one of us replies to all accidentally it would be an open meeting law violation so I'll just do a cc at the bottom of every letter and then put all your names on it yeah BCC not CC they can still reply Danny you can just send an individual just to make it easier just send us yeah I'll send you all separate emails you don't have a list of like 50

candidates just like what yeah uh I'll send you each yeah yeah that's not a lot I can send you all individual emails on each one of these as I get them you could also just forward the responses to all of us so you don't have to send a Division I will emails yeah I'll do that as well so we don't yeah just to cover ourselves yep yeah I'll do that um all righty uh

so we're all set on a score sheet uh any new business I did want to mention something possibly for the agenda to discuss uh next time I don't know if anyone saw the recent Herald news article on the bank Street Armory uh the the RFI that went out and the two proposed or the two people that came to look at it um there was a paragraph in line at the

end very end of the article that kind of caught my attention where the cities well not the exact attorney Matt Thomas I think is working with the city but not a city employee um said that the city could change the deed restriction on the Banshee Armory which just for the Public's record receive Community preservation act funds twice so it has its historic deed restriction on the exterior article and

it said interior but it's the exterior of the Armory so that's the protection that the residents paid for and um in the article it it suggested that that deed restriction could be altered depending on who the buyer is in their plans and that would be acceptable from the Massachusetts historical commission if it would save the building so I just think that might warrant discussion I

emailed attorney Thomas and attorney Ramsey I heard back from attorney Thomas on his thinking um I'm going to send it if I didn't already to Sandy and she could send it to everyone and perhaps you could just talk about the deed restrictions the preservation deed restrictions we put on properties how we feel about them possibly being changed since that is what we're working for is essentially

it's the deed restrictions on these things um just just thought I'd throw it out there in case because it raised a red flag for me um and just they aren't because it's implied that it could have they could be maybe removing it or changing it but it's on a case-by-case basis depending on the plans so I believe it has to be submitted for review so it would give the community and the committee a chance

to weigh into if we agreed or didn't agree with uh the change in the Restriction that we put on you want to put that on our April regular meeting it's not necessarily time sensitive I can like it's whatever we want to talk about honestly we can do voting uh we should do project updates yeah well uh I was looking at the third week uh to have our meetings I'm not sure what the day is

good for you guys but uh third week look at it send in what days are good for you and we'll come up with a a day works for me do you want me to put that on the next agenda to set a regular schedule yeah or you want to do okay so the next agenda will be just voting because I'm sure that it'll take some time and then I'll add to vote on a

regular scheduled meeting date every month okay all right and I'll send everybody I think I sent everybody um what's available and what's not available for the hearing room um but I'll send that again I don't normally we haven't had a lot of meetings in the summertime but sometimes I think we miss uh like some training we could do uh updated on projects even the application the eligibility form I think we could

take an extensive look at some things like we just ran into the problem with uh ADA compliance I was going to have the building inspector come down maybe one meeting just go over general not in depth because I mean we're not contractors and all this but what might come up for a project so just different tidbits that help us coming up next season so make our job a little easier

no further and it also helps the public again yeah huh no I was I was just saying it also helps the public as well oh yeah because then they know we even for you know what's expected and what what kind of things they might run into as well so I think that's a good idea yeah so can I have a motion to adjourn then I'll make the motion to adjourn all right roll call vote Chris

yes Richard yes Caroline yeah Joanne yes yes Alex yes John Yes Rick Mancini yes well folks thanks a long meeting think good meeting so next week