3.20.23 Special Charter Review Committee

today is Monday March 20th 2023. it's 5 p.m and we're located in the atrium at one government center and I'm Rena Brown your chair the open meeting law pursuant to the open meeting law any person may make an audio or video recording of this public meeting or may transmit the meeting through any media attendees are therefore advised that such recordings or Transmissions are being made whether perceived or

unperceived by those present and are deemed acknowledged and permissible if you guys would join me please in the Pledge of Allegiance I know we don't have a flag I point myself that way because I think the flags are standing in front of the building over there no that's why they should be okay I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the Republic for which they stand one nation

under God indivisible with liberty and justice for all thank you and if we could start at my far right and take attendance please Paul Machado John Mitchell Rena Brown Laura Washington Kathy namkovich Tracy Almeida Tim Campos I'm sorry Alan and at this time can we have any public comment absolutely I heard on the radio that you would be speaking about the yeah when he vacate like he did recently the past

unfortunately could you give us something yeah oh yes I forget people don't know me I'm Edward out first hiya a-l-f-e-r-o-s thank you Ed thank you oh I'm sorry it was an 1110 Hancock Street uh unfortunately She Knows by my hat I was in the military and they had what they call umcj article 21 is what they call the tune of command also they have on the federal level thank you for your service yes

president vice president and the Speaker of the House that's how I don't know where it goes after that I'm looking at the table and most of you for one young man here maybe remember 19 63 November the 23rd when President Kenny was assassinated president came was Johnson the reason why I mentioned this because President Johnson in his first turn did not have a vice president they did not set up of Vice President

to 1969.

so how much did I got to do with this if the man had to vacate this office the shuttle City chairman to take his spot the vice chairman should take the Chairman's fund indeed next person line should be the number 10 person okay the only time would that would not go in fact why on the President Johnson his first term because it was close to election say look the chairman texted math place

and it's like six months it didn't it shouldn't be the power of the the chairman of the of the so the council should be unfortunately be a standby if the med fake eggs also he should not have the power to for the legislation he can what a legislation put out by the committee all other places uh what was the other thing I want to say about his pollen

I was oh yeah I also noticed he had a terminal off office but I I'm still in favor of two years a lot of people go and say oh well if you if you look at the federal level every two years people running for the house run it again that's another thing that's 300 for the mayor 150 for the other posts now I never I read the chart of them so

my mind is a little fuzzy on this that the person who's running for any office have to be registered to vote no answer well we can't answer the questions that public input we can listen to you okay and then it becomes part of the record we can refer you to the Charter again the answers may be in there unfortunately like a lot of people I toured away uh the the other thing the last time I

spoke yeah pretty cool I'm wondering as we know in the federal level the chairman of the city council if the mayor did something against the law can they teach him or do some other punishment so uh I'm gonna let it go on that thank you Mr Al Fords any other public comment just in time please and your address Augie 25

I'm kind of disappointed in you know the amount of time taking on some issues especially capitalization it's supposed to be done by June 1st he had to schedule chapter 125 that night in chapter two first during the four meetings away I don't know if you're going to make it I would suggest that there's no disrespect to the committee that you know you stick to the issues that were problematic and last time the child

and if there were any new issues to fall one thing you can do is probably ask for an extension of time from June 1st because I don't think I think it's totally untreated

15 months we can get started until December it's with no fault being around so if you carry it Karen pass through first you know in an exception of time and caring passion to impressive and violates the charter bus once in the first time okay but in these things reasonable reasonable energy the 110 dollars we go by June 1st can't perform it too long because that's better Comfort at the time to have to

specialize to prevent legislation and all that ticket from city council and they've got to schedule money and then go to sleep I'm going to respect your lives foreign recall multiple jobs temporary activities other than that you know people may not address but there's no kids in coverage that was important things pretty good you didn't tackle some new issues mayor they're trying to take some discussion

what conference

you go to workout Foods how many you're going to have you have vacancies you welcome to how they're going to be held by the resident big requirements

if nobody runs you know what there's an insufficient number of candidates and you know how do you uh what number do you have to stay with yourself you know right now the city is divided into nine blocks just don't happen to have time that works we had to a lot of the challenge that I read from other students they had children in page 11.

50 one one seed on each side everything else foreign

more involved in it what do you do what do you do again increase

I don't think the advantages

here so yeah spend time you know again in the past address there's no issues presence of the city Intoxicated by address and all that thank you thank you Mr August any further any further public input all right Mr Speaker

with managed by a city management like Seaton but if you ran for office no matter school or whatever except for men you had to come from that war and the only trouble proposes like you said a person from a certain law and you have the information that's a problem and uh the other thing about what to do is I look at Four Rivers and it's two parts of four wheeler you

have to go out of state to get to it you think they're getting good reputation and I I know most of the I heard most of the people who are and people who come from the north end where the south end seems to have to like happening like nobody the only time I ever saw it with uh

scooper thank you Mr alfords did I say it right Mr Alfred I'm sorry I'm using people I only use nickname thank you uh moving on the minute any further public comment okay moving on minutes from the February 27 2023.

motion to accept by Dan Roblox seconded by Laura Washington all in favor all in favor unanimously item number six committee election of a charter clerk orphans let me explain for one second what that is there is a lot of discussion about a lot of issues going through the charter and our clerk takes most copious notes however it appears that a clerk should be designated as the person that just

takes the notes on the changes to the Charter just to not that he wouldn't be taking those notes but then he would have to go off of those notes to go through all the changes we made if we have a charter clerk a person on this committee who is just designated as a motion is made or A Change Is made that they keep separate notes uh with those changes for that meeting I think it it

um it really will streamline later on when the final report has to be made and the two clerks would work together basically on that final report so that said there's a nomination on the table yeah I'm gonna decline that I'm I know I'm not here for the two meetings in April already so I don't think it's fair to say this and then not be here thank you meeting Kathy declines the nomination is there another nomination

Campbell motion to nominate Tim Campos that's okay uh I'll accept Okay second I'll second that motion motion seconded by Laurel Washington for Tim Campo says the charter Clerk and any further discussion on that all in favor and unanimous congratulations Tim you are our Charter clerk okay and I am confident if there are absences I've also at our attendance uh Committee Member Mimi laravee had a

conflict with tonight she had a school committee meeting okay and then moving on um I took the liberty of just picking out some sections that I thought uh needed changes right away is versus the time we took on everything else one of the other things though to keep the record complete is that before we discuss it I'll read the particular section we're discussing into the record okay

um first item is section 2-2 titled president and vice president election terms Powers subsection a election and term as soon as practicable after the council is elect have been qualified following each regular city election as provided in section 9-11 the members of the city council shall elect from among its members of president vice president Who Shall Serve for a one-year term the

method of election of the president vice president shall be prescribed within the rules of the city council subsection B P powers and duties the president shall prepare the agenda for the City Council meetings the president shall preside at all meetings of the city council regulate its proceedings preserve decorum and decide all questions of order the president shall appoint all members of Committees of the city

council whether special or standing or other such appointments as are established by the Char harder in ordinances in making appointments as established by the charter and ordinances the president shall appoint City residents the president shall have the same powers to vote upon measures coming before the city council as any member of the city council the president shall perform any other duties

consistent with the office that are established by Charter ordinance or other vote of the city council the vice president shall preside in the absence of the president discussion suggestions leave it take it at least two issues that will come up that we might want to clarify and I'll start with 2.2 a just going to tell you the issues I'm not saying they're overly significant um The Way Forward currently does it

is that come December 31st Fall River treats it almost as if there are no there's no president or vice president of the city council so I believe in the very first meeting which is usually the first week of January the city clerk calls order and then they immediately elect the new president vice president and so forth some people don't think that's a proper way to do it that is how Fall River does it the

suggestion is that the president maybe the President should remain the president of the city council until the new election and that the city council shouldn't be involved either way that the city clerk shouldn't be involved in it okay I think this past year city clerk called an election there was an issue somebody challenged it and as I said fall River's done it correctly with the

questions whether we can tighten up the line for that issue as for 2.2 B the issue that has come up in the recent history is there's a very big difference in our Charter as to what the difference is between an absence vacancy the way Fall River does it is that president of the city council is not there for that one meeting the vice president steps up and acts and act president so that acting present

just for that one being however if there was a vacancy Fall River does it that the vice president just not automatically become the president that there's a new election to decide so once again I'm not given my opinion on it I'm just telling how far whatever does that I know some people believe that the Vice President should automatically become the president and others believe no followers more

in a better way which is you have a new election honestly the rules are city council makes their own rules for things like this so it's really up to them so I'm not sure that the charter needs to tell them how to run their own business do you know why the city clerk was calling that first meeting um is there any ordinance or any City counts it's always been like that from apparently the beginning of

time is that the first meeting after elections you know when all the brand new nine City councilors are elected it's the clerk we'll call that first read in January prior to elections that the city of president is not the sitting president after the new election I guess it makes sense because for example the sitting president could possibly not get reelected so there's a reason why Fall

River does it the way it does it so why doesn't the last City president just set the date for the first meeting like let's say December 31st is the last time that sitting Council sits um I I aren't the meetings already set like when you have a city council meeting this past Tuesday do they say okay the next meeting is April um yeah right but generally the meanings are set by orders the gentleman we're speaking

English for second and fourth Tuesday right right my personal opinion it's just that is I don't really see a problem with the way the follower has done it and throughout its history I would just suggest tightening up the language unless we see there's a problem we can definitely tighten the language to make it clear because they wouldn't have a president for the first meeting that's right there's no president

there is no there is no president so somebody has to call me you tend to get up there and I mean the city course is the Bugatti and of all the records so what put the language in there that the city clerk calls the first meeting yeah I mean do we need to put everything this is what I mean the language some of it most of this language is my judgment most of

this China is worth a role watch now but you can get all of what we all vote right you know I mean we say right here the method of election of the President and Vice President shall be prescribed within the rules of the city council so why doesn't the city council figure it out the the term that could be the language that could be tightened up a little bit Shall Serve for a one-year

term I mean I'm not saying it has to be tight enough but that's the part that could be tightened up what is one year internally you know one question people find out about the elections could be January 6th one year and January 4th the following and they could have lost election in November I'd refer that to the city council to figure out who they want to call that first meeting quite frankly I don't think it's

I don't think the city council right but that's the two issues yes in the last three years and we'll tell the city council figure I mean I don't know I I just think that if the city council writes its own rules that the city council can address it wow I agree can I speak on that no we we've already passed the time for public input will be briefing I'm sure we could get one

do you need one I think we have it yeah we're getting it I am something I want to add to uh one of the problems I see in 2.2 section A that just it's just a thought something that I always thought that we can just talk about here and maybe it'll say the same thing but um I always thought where it says city council elect members of the President and Vice President I always thought it

should be a city council shouldn't be electing that it should automatically go to the top vote getters the whoever was the highest two vote Getters should be president and vice president and um that's just my thought I don't know what other people think but it's clear and it's always been the city's always on business like that I'm probably on a rubble feathers but you know they vote

for a president but I I just think that it's sort of cleaner process when the top vote Getters get President and Vice President and it certainly solves the problem who calls that first meeting if the top vote but yet automatically the president yes just so you know cushions is very clear in there foreign what would help if it is you're saying I don't know if we can really do too much emotions to change it

might how we make nobody made a motion to change it um is there a motion to change it well I open it up for this I'll make a motion to change it what's your motion I motion that we change the language from um the city council shall elect from among the members the president vice president that the top vote Getters become president and vice president can I can I ask can I have um

information good can we can we have more before I make a motion give me a point of information all right I gotta withdraw my motion I withdraw my motion point of it can we have just more discussion I'm not trying to make a motion I just would like to hear what other people okay all right so I make a motion back on the table to um change the language in the charter for president

to top vote Getters automatically get President and Vice President can I check in that motion thank you motion made by Laurel Washington to change section 2-2 a election and term that the President and Vice President are the two top voters respectively seconded by Kathy nimkovich am I saying that right yes thank you okay yeah there is though but for just for a minute um Mr Higgins you have some public input on 2 2A

no inauguration is always the first or second day of January right if the term of office is a year then it doesn't expire until January 2nd or 3rd of next year so there's no reason to the current president can't call the rating for the first meeting because he's still president until January well and that's what I thought too but what if the current president isn't re-elected that's the question

then the vice president calls it said it's very clear the vice president is the person who is designated in advance in case of the accidents or resignation I like what happened with the city council District what about if we did top two vocators for the first meeting call the meeting and then at that meeting when they would normally elect President vice president Now you kind of saw the city clerk issue and right

that's what I think if it's the two top vote Getters then you solve the city clerk calling the first meeting right she called it she but she has been she's always called that first one right all the time but when the cop pulled me over which stop sign is that Mr Higgins yes well I'll make a motion to add what you said which was adding the top two VOC editors to be president and vice

president for the first meeting and then at that meeting they'll continue to they'll do their normal process of electing the president vice president for the remainder of the term so there's two motions so there's two motions Laura Washington's motion is two top vote Getters are President and Vice President they call the first meeting Tim's motion if I'm correct is the two top voters are the president

vice president they call the first meeting and at that first meeting then they vote for president vice president so in effect you're only changing it the cold for one meeting well let me say I'm not in favor of changing myth at all the U.S Senate the U.S House the members elect the speaker the members elect the Senate President if it's good enough for Washington D.C it's good enough for the

state of Massachusetts it's good enough for what it will fall river the way we elect people here okay because you're on the top won't get it doesn't mean you're the top choice of everybody that votes okay you could be the ninth choice of somebody that votes because you get the most votes it doesn't mean you're on the top choice of all the voters so I don't disagree just we're trying to solve the city clerk issue

but can we respect everybody two separate if you're gonna change it and change it permanently don't change it for the sake of calling one meeting

I think it is a it is a legal issue because it can be challenged her calling the first meeting because she's not entrusted with the authority to call the first city council meeting or any city council meeting well that's the Arts that's the argument there's no difference of opinion I'm not right now um when it's an election year Clark has Authority you could have nine new members who's going to call the meeting so

I believe that the way Fall River is doing it is perfectly legal Mr Higgins and I think at least had this debate discussion in writing if not on the telephone before so I understand this point that it is slightly different when it is not an election year and when the city council has decided to just have their next meeting that's the part that could be tightened up or not but clearly the clerk can call to order

the median after an election right if this Charter look why can't the outgoing president just set the date for that meeting though is there anything that prevents that well let's say the December meeting uh is the fourth Tuesday and at that fourth Tuesday that council president says January 6 is the first meeting let me play Devil's Advocate president of the city council was elected for a one-year term on January 4th

and they got elected they got beat November they're still the city council president until January 4th they could conduct that meeting and then at the end of that meeting they're done well assuming that you're going off the calendar year and the discussion earlier 365 a day a year right a calendar a year so but that's right absolutely first and um there was a point made that we didn't

maybe tighten up that language to talk about what is the term could it be from term to term so that it covers 367.

days perhaps in the given year that you know that's a great idea right so if it's the term year and they're sworn in what is it the first two twos what what's the swearing-in date first Monday first Monday so if there's one in the first Monday on an election year I was thinking change one year until instead of saying one year they're elected until the first meeting of the next calendar year that's that's right

I believe a word or two fixes the ambiguity members of the city council electrome Among Us member President and Vice President Who Shall Serve for a until for one year term until the next meeting until the first meeting the next calendar year before this time would expire after yeah December 31st sometimes one of two ways so there are there's Laura Washington's motion to have the

two top vote Getters segmented by Kathy um on the table and then there's Tim yeah I'm going to withdraw that and Tim's motion is withdrawn 365 days no but my motion is term to term and I don't know if I made one do I need to make yes okay my motion is we change the language from one year to term to term to solve the if the problem of ambiguity so the is there a second

second one motion she Amendment uh oral Washington's motion because we haven't disposed of the original right let me just talk about my motion for a minute so I'm just to my colleague and uh seat one over there let me just say that um although it may be good for Washington and the state of Massachusetts I don't necessarily agree that's the cleanest way to do it I'm just say that's okay that's okay but

I wanted to have discussion on because that is what I feel but I will withdraw my motion because I think that is a great idea and it was just you know I want discussion I think that's a clean away but I will withdraw my motion and um no it's okay if you believe strongly and emotion the minute you see our position you will withdraw your motion by all means there's a motion and the second

put it to a vote if that's what you want this is democracy no I am withdrawing my motion oh so be it so Laura motion Laura Washington's motion made by Laura segment by Kathy is withdrawn there's a new motion on the table by Tracy Almeida that the language read and I'm just going to go right to the end of that sentence a president and vice president Who Shall Serve for a one year term

to term you take out one year till the till the till the end of their term so you're saying one president no that would be the term in terms two years right in the beginning they don't stay president for the two years I was in favor of Laura so one term here so they serve for a one year term until the next term which would expire at the end of the first meeting or the first

meeting right uh Mr clerk do you have language to clean that up um the President and Vice President Shall Serve until the next election which I'll serve until now they're going to serve for the first meeting well can you say for a one-year term until the next election until the end until the first time until the first meeting of the next calendar year yeah that's the language so President and Vice President Shall

Serve until the next meeting until the first meeting of the next calendar year right that's the length is that your motion that's my motion Tracy's motion Tracy's motion is the president vice president I'll serve for a one-year term until the next first meeting of the next calendar year until the first meeting the next calendar of the next calendar year that motion was made by Tracy seconded by Tim Campos

all in favor aye opposed um I'm abstaining so one two three four five six in favor one abstention one opposition motion passes moving on to powers and Duty section 2-2-b my only issue was this the last line says the president shall preside in the absence of the president I just wanted to put uh you know a time period on that I I don't know if it was public input or Alan or whoever I I think

um there just needed to be a time period on that because as you read it now if there's a mayor vacancy and the president fills in for the mayor does the vice president stay the president and we we answer that in other sections but I think for this right here it's just talking about the meetings either it's the vice president shall preside in the absence of a PR of the president

for the meeting he misses for two consecutive meetings after that Revisited I mean I just think there's a time limit there should be a time limit on that was my when I read it but this but you know what this doesn't refer to those sections so we're cut we're going to go to vacancies afterwards um like filling of vacancies can we just reference the or reference 211 because we we we we we go to to vacancies

either that we need to refer to 211 um because I think that's the only one like in three eight because three eight references the temporary absence of the mayor then at 310 talks about the vacancy in office of the mayor and all of those talk about the city council president filling in for the mayor they talk about death you know sickness or other cause but for these purposes either we reference those other

paragraphs except as prescribed in but I have a feeling that there may that there may be changes to those others so I just think we need the need to for now at least add the reference to the other sections am I making sense which is a sad reference to yes I understand why though because there's because there's no time period here the powers and duties of the president you know they set the

agenda they run the lease and what this is clear and this is why the word absence search the vacancy it's just when the president's not there that specific day then that's what it should say then that's what it is for that specific day and is there a time period what if the president is out for three meetings according to cushions the vice president but we should reference the vacancy

Clauses in the in the charter that's all I'm saying right now that's the way it's been for the West yeah I don't know uh

I just think that you know 211 the vice president It's very effective no I know it is I'm just saying yeah I just think it needs to reference those vacancy points that you can't just say the president's going to fill in Forever what what why become a parent recently just just survey is where is you know at one point if somebody missing meeting after meeting can you does that maybe have since become a

vacancy that seems to be what's your suggestion that's it there was an issue with this uh it turned out he it was a long-term illness of a of a school Committee Member some years ago but there were called uh for him to act by the public that was nothing ever done through a recall or anything like that but you know if the president's not there the vice president steps in that's it

that's the way it's been that's the way it should remain with all due respect to my esteem colleague inject I understand wanting to tighten the language of it but you can make it too tight I mean we can spend hours going over every syllable of this that's fine all I wanted to do was reference the other portions of the charter after that line then put the sections in that reference it if we

change it then we can go back and tighten it up right we've spent almost two hours last meeting I'm definition I I hope the gun we're not going to spend two hours fight me move up again that was watercress well if I could just finish my flight please the way things work right now is for example the body itself in this case the city council would decide whether they think it's

time to remove the person who continues to be absent right in fact there was a in the history I want to say in the 60s but don't quote me on that the president died in office and the city council decided they were they didn't want to elect a new president the whole time they let the vice president serve as active and I think it was maybe their I

mean I can't get in the mind of it the idea I guess is they didn't want to replace the president they want to continue the vice president of the whole time so by far is it's up to the city council right now and I don't really see a problem with that well it's not up to the city council it's up to it's up to section 211 really the charter speaks to vacancies I just

want to add the sections of the charter after that so people can refer to those Charters so when somebody says what happens if there's a vacancy and they read that they know to go to 211. that's all I just want to add the portions of the charter that refer to the vacancies to put in the portion of the vagina that refers to the vacancies in section two as the chair references

second that motion and what are those any more discussion what 211 um if the president was absent for an extended period of time the only thing that the city council could do if they chose and this was done very recently they could call for a new election right for president if they could not that prevalent would still be a member of the city council on Western until they will recall right they were still a city

council member that that we've just done very recently where you had the president uh uh resigned the presidency she stepped out there was going to be a vote if she didn't step down there was going to be a vote having a new president but even if the president is replaced the president is still a member of the city council on West they are recall or resign so there's a motion on the table to

reference section 211 after that last line made by Dan seconded by Laura any further discussion on favor motion passes moving on to 3.1 uh 2.3 sorry thank you moving on to 2.8 2.3 yes information right to be clear we made no change in the way the president or vice president is chosen no thank you very much well we just changed the language just the time frame but we did not change no no we didn't change the

banner no section 2-3 prohibitions subsection a uh holding other City positions except as otherwise provided by the charter no member of the city council shall hold any other compensated City position no former member of the city council shall hold any compensated appointed City position to a one-year file on the date on which the former member service on the city council is terminated this

section does not prevent a city employee who vacated a position in order to serve as a member of the city council from returning to the same or other position upon the expiration of the term for which that person was elected subsection B interference with the administration except for employees appointed in accordance with section 2 8 the city council or any other member of the city council should not give orders or

directions to any employee of the city the publicly or privately is this is the hetzler clause yes but didn't we just lose in court with this so we really need to change that language I think the um Mr Clerk provided us with um the the last court challenge is could you update us on that the district court judge his name I am forgetting indicated indicated that she found that the child

provision including a fireman from running for City to come school committee or any other office would violate violated his first amendment rights the judge held that moreover no public interest is served by holding an election that is sullied by the Specter of a likely constitutional application of the city job that's his language in the preliminary injunction I'm not aware of any final

judgment it was not a final judgment in a nutshell you can make rules that prevent elected officials from using their position to secure future employment but what the law is pretty clear on this is what that decision was suggesting is you cannot prevent somebody in their position from running from for office and that's the problem that's the language that need to be tied up right it cannot stop somebody from running

from public office right and in that they don't have to be compensated for both though right right think that's correct but it didn't look that specific I mean I think it might have had a true highest value yeah yeah right yeah because you had to pick one or the others they choose the position they want to be compensated for an obviously there is no choice go with the firefighter so what do you

strike the whole thing or put in it that extract the whole sections no I mean I I don't think you strike the whole thing I think you just changed that they can a a city employee can run for office and an elected official can get a job you just have to pick the pay right I mean is that it in the nutshell I think those are two different yeah very different things and I think the only

thing that needs to be changed is language that maybe maybe the best way to address it specifically State this is not intended to prevent a city employed from running for an elective position that is what is permitted but to be compensated for both is that the issue no what do you mean the other issues well there's a few issues in here so for example I believe that it would be

perfectly it would be upheld if say for example a member of an elected official according to become City administrator I think this one-year provision with the uphealth report because the idea is that you're using your position to get the job official to get a paid job so the conflict Dimensions law is very strict and that that direction I think they would support um this chart of original way through so

if so if we took out the very first set part of the first sentence except as otherwise provided by the charter the problem with it is no member of the city council shall hold any other compensated position that's the problem with it according to the court no no no no problem and that's the case was that oh the the second citizen seeking election we'll have to work for the city yeah who

happens so is it this part this section shall not prevent a city employee who vacated a position in order to serve as a member of the city council from returning to the same or other position upon expiration of the term

so what part of it needs to be fixed if they were to do it it provides for that if the person decided to accept the elected position it doesn't prevent that person from returning to the job vacated and that's that's clear and I I that's yeah most people wouldn't do that but it's in there to at least guide a potential conflict wait a minute first question a compensated City position yeah the first

part that seems to be the problem say that they can't hold more than one compensated they may hold it but be compensated for one maybe the they may hold to both musicians particularly or maybe it's very clear that if they have the same position they can hold an elected so I think you just striking who vacated you know Arena I think you should we just do all we have to do is Strike who vacated this

section shall not prevent a city employee strike who vacated just will not prevent a safe flight who is under in order to service blah blah blah blah they don't have to vacate so we're just it's yes I think what the language you could use in the first sentence yeah no except is otherwise provided November the city council shall obtain any other harmonated position while serving as an elected official

I think that's the language that can solve this problem so except as otherwise we're not a no member of the city council shall obtain another any other compensated City position wow while in office while while holding elected right by holding elected office right well it's they can't get compensated but it doesn't say that you're saying you can't I don't think in a team that's what they're saying oh so

yeah so they can't obtains they can't obtain compensation so no member of the city council shall obtain any other compensated City position while holding the elected City Council Office they may not obtain any other compensation they couldn't become one needs to say that well no this is just saying so if you're a city councilor and you apply for a fireman wow that's what he says you can't be a

fireman while you're a city counselor well the conflict of interest law you know the fireman while we were the school committee it's a difference it's a city employee running for office the judge has found has a constitutional right to run for office a city councilor applying for a new fireman's position does not have a constitutional right to become a fighter right okay okay so but

we need to differentiate with language I think no member of the city council shall obtain any other compensated City position while holding that elected office right it would be compensation but right because they can't be compensated does that language mean their grandfather then if they help yeah yes only while they're elected yes I mean fire and police are different because of civil service but yeah

plus there's a there is a one-year provision in the after floor right in the ethics right you can't believe you take a position right now

there's a lot of discussion about whether one year is too long yeah I think that's kind of the standard right now um you know obviously the idea is the conflict of interest law is very strong um you know you don't want elected officials using their powers elected officials to obtain employment um you know remember

to change the language to no member of the city council shall obtain any other compensated City positions while holding elected City Council Office there's a motion on the table thank

um we would like I would like to say shall obtain any other compensation from any other City position while holding elected office because that would constitute that they could still hold any position they just can't get paid for it so I think that's the issue at hand gets compensated versus compensation okay just holding a compensated position would indicate that you can't hold a position that was paid or is paid

directly say that again they just weren't compensated change to compensation shall obtain any other compensation from any other City position while holding elected office so they can't get paid but then right but that means you're probably a firefighter well you could be but you won't get paid as a fight the way that's where it would mean that you're set you're we're designating that the salary they'll receive a city

council and not giving them a choice right so we need to it gives a choice they would pick saying you can't okay so you so you so no member of the city council shall obtain compensation any other compensation from any other City position so we can while holding the elected position of a city councilor yeah but that doesn't that means though that you can't be compensated as or police officer or firefighter we we had

one motion right we just got that and that one was seconded we're just discussing that it was the Laura made a motion that the language is no member of the city council shall obtain any other compensate to the city position while holding city council elected office that was seconded by Kathy by hope by Mr Mitchell this is discussion about that so there's no other motions on the floor

yet this is discussion about addressing compensated or compensation so when I refer to the uh point of information from the attorneys on the uh board would that hold up in court is that make a difference compensated and compensation what were you saying does it mean they can't even get compensation at city council though like that's right no member of the city council should obtain any other compensation

how about just obtain additionally any additional paid in the city employment but if you say that then they can only hold your saying you can only get the city council yeah exactly and so it's no obtain the word so if they've already have it they've already picked it yeah this is just going forward anybody that's in it now is grandfathered in they can collect the tools they're in so they can't become a firefighter

if I bought a city but a firefighter can become a city councilor but they can't get people but they can't get paid from the city council so I think that's what we're trying to say here is that you can't double dip yes

right but then doesn't the conference

so far it is all right so just to tighten this up there is one motion on the table again Laura's motion seconded by Kathy that says the language proposes no member of the city council should obtain any other compensated City position while holding elected City Council Office there has been discussion but no motion made that the language we should consider is no member of the city council shall obtain

any other compensation from the city while holding elected City Council Office is that the discussion is this not emotions just the women is that but I have that language right so would you like me to amend my emotion because I agree with that would you like to amend your I would like to amend my motion Laura would like to amend her motion to the amendment needs the second and we've got to say it first November

of the city council shall obtain any other compensation from the city while holding the elected City Council Office yeah that is the proposed amount of position any other additional elected position let's change the other to additional yeah no well they just can't get the confidence competition they can get the job but they'd be working age well what a thing that Sean could be who is the member of the city council if

he was hired as he was one question to be the city administrator you would have to leave the council anyway you couldn't hold two right what if he what if he has a job at the school doing what if what if he could hire a decision teacher but that's what I mean he wouldn't be able to get the school teacher job or he'd have to resign because he could

still be a school teacher in on the city council I think the difference with this provision is what we're concerned about is while someone holding an office getting a city job there's something smelly about that right whereas if someone and I guess what they could do is get the job step down and then run the next election what the vote is decide exactly right but that's the difference right that's what you're

concerned about that one right is

abused without this in place I mean hypothetically let's say you have a mayor who has a minority I'll vote of the city council and can't get anything passed all he has to do is promise a nice cooking to someone in the city council and then number 10 bumps up and number 10 will be holding to the bear all of a sudden he's got a five-fold majority just by selling the position I

mean no I I hear about this yeah that was one year I I guess what I struggle with this if a member of the city council were to be offered a job that by the mayor they would have to leave the elective offer a year prize for a year for a year the point is you could not I'm gonna use the city administrator because it's Aquarius things happen if I'm on the city council

and in the middle of my term the man comes to me and says if I take the city administrative position I have to leave the office of city council immediately I cannot I cannot do both with or without this language how could I be the city administrator and be a city councilor at the same time particular school teacher I mean honestly we don't need to answer that because the provision is you would

resign that day and you would wait one Year and hope that the mayor who appointed you that keeps his promise that's the way the law is and I believe right the conflict of interest law answers that though Dan you wouldn't be able to take the job right away if if I resign from the city council I could take the job on India no no no no no it happened before yeah

all right so back to the drawing board there's an amended motion on the table the amended motion needs to be seconded can we can I yeah no no go ahead what about we keep it as it sits and then at the end so it would say except as otherwise provided by the charter no member of the city council shall hold any other compensated City position unless that position was held prior to being elected like so now

that gives them they can't get a new job the city while they're elected but they don't lose their previous job that they're paid for that's covered by household right yeah that's how yeah we're all looking in this way too much well let's this sounds like it might be a simple can you do it again yes so I I would recommend or I'm putting to the table except as otherwise provided by

the charter no member of the city council shall hold any other compensated City position unless that position was held prior to being elected yeah clear done package clear yeah perfect all right so um there was an amended motion on the table by Laura not seconded Laura withdraws the amended motion and do you draw the original and she withdraws the original motion is there a new motion on the table

motion on table go ahead Tim all right so I motion that we add unless that position was held prior to being elected after the first at the end of the first sentence in section 2.3 a he's able to read acceptance otherwise provided by the charter no member of the city council shall hold any other compensated City position unless that position was held prior to being elected Bingo let's

go fantastic is there a second on that motion Tracy seconds that motion any further discussion about changing 2-3 prohibit prohibitions to this one change except as otherwise provided by the charter November the city council shall hold any other compensated City position unless that position was held prior to the election motions been made seconded any further discussion all in favor

all in favor Dan robillard opposed moving on to 211.

feeling of 211 filling of vacancies the charter reads as this if a vacancy shall occur on the city council but the vacancy shall be filled in descending order of Voters received by the candidate for the office of City councilor at the preceding city election who received the highest number of votes without being elected provided such candidate remains eligible and willing to serve the city clerk shall certify

this candidate to the office of city council and the candidate shall be sworn to office immediately to serve for the balance of the unexpired term city council is serving under this section shall not be entitled to have the words candidate for re-election printed with that counselor's name on the election ballot discussion no no go ahead I'm kidding I think this one needs to be addressed yes

okay we had a situation where a city councilor stepped down and the 10th both getter was contacted um and wanted time to consider it there was a big debate over what immediately means the people who wanted him to sit wanted him to have as much time as he wanted and the people who didn't want him to sit thought he had to say yes or no on that phone call so the definition of immediate needs to

be addressed would be my suggestion to have to be the next city council meeting and it could be a specially called one but maybe give this person meet you know a minimum of say 72 hours and that's up for this order to debate that I can step on but you know it gets political uh it's if it's not your person they're against you if it is your personal for you I think

person who you know when you run for office which may be in November you lose how many things you know when you're six months later in contact it could be a death in a family you may have had a child sometimes it Reserves at least this short period of time to consider that needs to be addressed the second issue is the way it's written the way I interpreted it it could be written better as

if there's a vacancy city council obviously go to number 10. hypothetical purposes let's say number 10 declines six months pass there's another vacancy the way I have interpreted this is that that number 10 would be contacted the second time even though they passed it up the first time no as I said it could have been family circumstances that prevented them from stepping off that are no longer present so it was my

interpretation to give that person a second chance but other people who as I said it gets political positive one shot only that issue should probably be addressed Madam chair yes sir I'd like to make a motion that we give a candidate vacancy a period of 72 hours to respond as to whether they as well accept the the Council seat or whatever seat it is or the quinine but that's one motion

there's a motion on the floor for it to make it 72 hours is there a second John Mitchell seconded discussion I I think it should be 48 hours I think if you have ran an election came in 10th and somebody resigns how you could not know whether you want that or not within two days I mean chubby two hours is three days and I think three days too long I think Jonathan only 24 hours but

I think you should too I don't think 24 hours would pass here I meant 72 hours is reasonable you know I I like 48. I I certainly wanted that decision why not 48 hours a week everybody's getting more anyway so 48 hours weekends and holidays will come what's the difference though between why not give them 72. what's the difference between two days or three days I like 72. I mean you don't know I mean maybe

there are a lot of times I'd like to put my motion to a vote well where we're still discussing it so let's just make sure everybody had a word Dan hang on one second so there's a motion on the floor to amend immediately or some there's got to be there's no Amendment stand it's just 72 hours they're just discussing it so it would come in um the city clerk here we go it's after this first sentence

or declines because within 72 hours yeah within 72 hours what did Dan say is uh you said candidates being asked to serve 72 hours 72 hours the motion is to add the time frame of within 72 hours okay and it was seconded by John Mitchell is there any more discussion within 72 hours so how would how will we wear this um it'll go um so see where it says candidate remain

willing to serve we could add a sentence that says you know said candidate will will you know notify the clerk within 72 hours yeah will uh you know of whether they're going to accept that position or not you know um and I like how you said that notify the clerk because they can't notify Corporation Council not the mayor not the president so at the end of the court except the decline so we'll

notif so it's it'll be uh provided such candidate remains eligible and willing to serve period new sentence it has to be a new sentence though because that first sentence is way too long already so that candidate must accept or decline within 72 hours to the city clerk we're going to incorporate these changes yes yes yes right so within 72 hours um all in favor motion passes unanimously I had um on an

issue though with this and it's I don't know so the last sign says city council is serving under the section shall not be entitled to have the words candidate for re-election printed with that counselor's name on the election ballot if they're a city councilor and and another election comes up why are they not candidate for re-election I think they should have it I know because the night of the original election the

reason they became they became the city council was only by the means of a vacancy that's the difference if there was no vacancy that they would they would have had to wait two years that's why you cannot say that if you're a candidate for re-election because they did not do we come in the top nine vote Getters as prescribed under the current election War for the city of Fall River hm

M I mean I I don't know I'm gonna this makes common sense they were elected they got the 10th they they were the 10th popular vote on the battles the original night of top nine both Givens of the city council not the top ten

and it becomes vacated they are appointed I imagine somebody probably wrote this so that an appointed vacancy does not get the same words before the name of the next election and sometimes these Provisions make their way into situations that they weren't I mean I'm making a motion that we strike that last sentence yeah I don't care one way the other that's my emotion just because they weren't the original thing

we elected the night of the original election you can say what you want they did not win that night and if there were no vacancies they would have to wait two years till the next election period I'm making a motion I'm making a motion that we strike that last sentence yes I did there's a motion on the table made by uh Brown that we strike the last sentence seconded by Tracy Almeida

it's not they're going to be on it if you take it out it's a non-issue big question nowadays all right there's a motion on the table to strike that last sentence it's been seconded by Tracy any further discussion all in favor of voting again I'm all in favor give me a hand give me a give let's get a roll call Roll Call my second is if I don't have to vote right no it no it's

for a full vote so all in favor okay I'm trying try to go trying to go around we'll go from left to right Dan roll call Dan stand with you no your opposed absolutely look Mr Machado no Mr Mitchell yes Marina Brown yes Laura Washington abstains Kathy namkowitz yes Tracy Tracy did you get that can you you're getting at the end right all right Tres Almeida yes

um oh you're just you don't vote okay motion passes right what's the what's the numbers three no's one abstain and oh yes motion passes moving on well it's not going to make it moving on to three dash one article 3 executive branch section 3-1 mayor titled mayor qualifications term of office compensation prohibitions subsection a mayor qualifications the chief executive office of the city shall

be a mayor elected by the voters of the city at large any voter shall be eligible to hold the office of Mayor the mayor shall devote full-time to the office shall not hold any other elective public office subsection B term of office the term of office of the mayor shall be two years beginning on the first Monday in January succeeding the mayor's election except when that first Monday

falls on a legal holiday in which event the term shall begin on the following day and shall continue until a successor has been qualified subsection C compensation the city council shall by ordinance establish the compensation for the mayor no ordinance increasing or reducing the compensation of the mayor shall be effective unless it has been adopted during the first 18 months of

the term for which the mayor is elected provides that the compensation increase or reduction is to take effect upon the organization of the city government following the next regular city election and has been adopted by a minimum of six votes of the city council subsection D prohibitions the mayor shall hold no other compensated City position no former May there shall hold a compensated appointed city office or

city employment until one year following the date on which the former mayor's service City service has terminated this subsection shall not prevent a city officer or the city employee who has vacated a position in order to serve as mayor from returning to the same office or other position of city employment held at the time such position was vacated provided however that no such person shall be eligible for any other

Municipal position until at least one year following the termination of service as mayor this prohibition shall not apply to persons covered by a leave of absence under Section 37 of chapter 31 of the general laws I appreciate very much you reading that whole thing into the record I would just ask if there's going to be motions that we do each subsection individually so as to women confused her she thank you um

any discussion on subsection a mayor qualifications foreign to the office does that mean does that mean you cannot be in be employed part-time like who interprets the devotion of full-time because someone could say I am part-time job but I'm full-time I mean I don't know let's just assuming they're working with nine to five right yeah what I'm saying like I don't know what full-time

yeah I mean I don't know that seems a little loose and then

you got to be careful because some people might own them Insurance business or something that provides them and they've got to do something for me so okay yeah businesses that was just for information mayor Mitchell on Mitchell's Pharmacy practice Yeah yeah there was another Mitchell before you pick um um did that answer your question thank you um any other discussion there's no requirement that they have

them correct that's right you don't get the practice

there had been some discussion that qualifications include felons and not felons I want to make this record clear uh a felon can run for president of the United States a felon can run for governor of Massachusetts and um and run for almost any elected position because there was some discussion I think it was either public input or even um uh people have asked well you know um should convicted felons be able to be

mayor and I mean all I can say is that they can be present in the United States so I'm assuming that we cannot write in here a Prohibition about convicted felons holding that position I hope that answers anybody's concern over that is there anything in here about criminality yeah but then they can run things they can run later the constitution of the Commonwealth was changed about five years ago the only

thing a felony does is if you're serving a sentence on a felony conviction and lose your right to vote during that period is not a felony if you're under a misdemeanor or a wedding trial you can get up you can still vote yeah so if I can vote if I'm not incarcerated on a felony commission then I should have no problem running for city council school committee mayor State Rep or anything

else so it's only incarceration it's only if you're serving a sentence no probation or anything incarcerated on a felony commission you lose your right to vote between them okay okay but I'll tell you there are other Charters that write into them like if you're convicted of um a felony pertaining to your office yes there are some Charters that will disqualify a candidate if they have been

convicted while in office like an abuse of uh Power charge like I am not taking bribes extortion um stealing from the city treasury right you can't stop them from running but I always have that decision no I know I know but there are some Charters that that wrote them in their disqualifications so no just no they were convicted of a felony concerning that office right but they were convicted so they served time and

now they're out they right and they're running again and then that's up to the then that's up to the voters correct so so mayor mayor qualifications were all okay with it can we move on to term of office the last sentence okay of a

well maybe we could go when we go to prohibitions we'll discuss it again so a is fine no yeah yeah yeah I'll wait till we get there all right so a is fine moving on to B term of office any discussion I know there's been discussion people have asked two years three years four years no change anybody okay um uh compensation anything moving on prohibitions

any discussion on prohibitions under the mayor

employees all inclusive City officer just give somebody the ability to say well we'll do the grammatical we we voted to do the grammatical stuff later thank you appreciate you we appreciate you okay moving on 3-8 we're gonna go back to the other ones but these were like like the busy ones in the last sentence the last sentence full-time to the office shall not hold any other public office

that would probably be better suited somewhere in section d prohibitions rather than in major qualifications no it doesn't matter is there a motion to move it or is it just discussion just discussion for them well you're the charter clerk too like I I also think in you know this this report I mean I don't I you know when the report is made that report's going to come to us if there's like

grammatical and you know like this should go here I think when when the the two clerks get together with this report and there's format changes or punctuation you know what I mean yeah I um that's how we want to do it moving on to 3-8 and the only reason why we're skipping over is that a suggestion was made to get to the hot button stuff first and then we can go back what we'll

do is near the last meetings maybe um an email go out does anybody want to visit something that we didn't discuss or revisit you know 3-8 is titled temporary absence of the mayor small a acting mayor whenever by reason of sickness or other cause the mayor is unable to perform the duties of the office the president of the city council shall be the acting mayor unless the president of the city council is unable

or unwilling to serve in such instance the provisions of section 3-8 shall C shall fly City Council by the affirmative vote of seven members shall determine whether the mayor is unable to perform the duties of the office the vote shall take place in a public session by a roll call vote small section B P powers of the acting mayor the acting mayor shall have only those powers of the mayor as our indispensable

and essential to conduct the to conduct the business of the city in an orderly and efficient manner and on which action may not be delayed the acting mayor shall have no authority to make permanent appointment or removal from City service unless the disability or absence of the mayor shall extend beyond 60 days nor shall an acting mayor approve or disapprove of any measure adopted by the city council unless the

time within which the mayor must act would expire before the return of the mayor the city council president or any other city council or who may be serving as acting mayor pursuant to section 3- small section c shall not act as a member of the city council and small section c Obsession in the event that the city council president is unable or unwilling to serve as acting mayor under

this section the vice president of the city council Shall Serve as active mayor if either the city council president or vice president is unable or unwilling to serve the city council then elect from among its membership a counselor to serve as acting mayor going back to small section A any discussion on acting mayor I have one issue with that paragraph and that's the word unwilling

if you accept the nomination as a city council president you should God should be part of the duties associated with that office therefore you should not be unwilling to assume the responsibilities oh you have to talk a little louder because Dan can't hear you so I have a problem with the with a term unwilling to serve if you are elected as the city council president that should mean that you are willing to

serve in the absence of the mayor it comes with the role so if you do not want to serve in that role you should not accept the nomination to be the president of the city council I hear you discussion it's not emotions just discussion correct you are president

automatically become the act the acting man that the vote for the city council president comes well prior to any that makes I agree in principle with what my colleague is saying but there may be some reason why that individual can't but you're not gonna know that until it occurs because the vote for the presidency occurs way before any subsequent or underlying issue so while I understand what you're saying yeah

in practicality it's tough to inform my opinion unable unable covers the inability of the person to serve unwilling right extensive I guess you're even missing my point or I'm missing yours no I understand my point is it's almost a dereliction of Duty understand that that vote happens well before and you don't even know if it'll be needed to be enacted right because there may never be an option something there

however if you agree to serve in that role that should constitute your willingness and when you accept that nomination that should constitute your willingness to serve in that role it's part of the role I'll take out unwilling and efforts is unable unable strike unwilling I mean I I can tell you this I can't imagine a situation where a city council president having a chance to become acne man would

say no I don't want to do it I I do I just think financially you you maybe you couldn't take you know leave your job to do that job like you know so maybe you shouldn't be acting president or want that but I mean there is reasons why people wouldn't want to do it no I hear you anything in the ultimate you take the oath of office is the pre or the oath of the president

like is there anything that serves talks about like your duties yeah no matter what no I I hear you it's not a nice word unwilling I get it but I think unable would cover it semantic language debate I guess because what do you need to hold the guns of the guy's head you monster or he must serve you must no but my colleague unable is good and but I understand what

she's saying but someone may take the job as president and say well I'm not going to be mayor and I I have an out clause because I'm unwilling to do it do you know so by taking that out it just I understand what both of you are saying but I see this it can happen in both ways is there a motion to take unwilling out I'm making a motion to strike the word unwilling

there is a motion made by Tracy to strike the word unwilling is there a second John Mitchell seconds any further discussion can we vote all in favor of striking unwilling I hi Dan hi okay motion passes unwilling is out any other discussion about uh oh I I did have I just had one little comment if is I didn't see anywhere in here that if the council president becomes acting mayor shouldn't they get acting mayor

money they do yeah I wanted no I didn't know but if it's just like for me is sick for a couple days a temper where does it say though that it gets paid is there is it somewhere well it does don't know right is there one may or leave and get the salary while someone else acted I just think that somewhere acting mayor should be compensated if it exceeds a week I mean because you're talking about

City councilors that probably work full-time and they go to their meetings and they fulfill their position you're going to the president and saying listen does he get the money counselor serving as mayor under this section so receive the compensation then in fact for the office there we go my question is answered man they should receive all right but it's it is it's a contemporary absence but

I just like to see him get like we've had to tighten up the line

well I thought I wrote notes too like I thought sickness defined or other cause do we Define those or do we what's a temporary absence is it three weeks well here's the thing is you know the issue that was before us was whether somebody was facing charges okay I know people feel very strongly about that but I can tell you the law feels very strongly in the opposite direction which is unless the person is mentally

unable I mean physically they can probably still perform the job they're physical but the question is whether or not they have the mental capacity to serve to continue to serve as men and if you allow political differences to decide whether somebody can or cannot serve as mayor you're going to have problems um so shouldn't we Define City Council Members to decide whether they are or not

that I guess is okay but you need to tighten up the definition it has to be mentally incapable I believe or you're gonna oh yeah but then you're going to have a million people Define what shouldn't temporary how do you allow one political body to say whether or not another political or official it is mentally capable or not well it's going to be that's right too so the only time it talks about a time

frame is if see when I went to the powers it says the acting mayor has no authority to make criminal Employments blah blah blah unless of course it exceeds 60 days so are we assuming that temporary absence of the mayor is for only 60 days like there's no time frame on temporary absence so that's my second point which is this is my personal opinion but I think it's a bit ridiculous when we have

somebody doesn't have to be the mayor think of anything your job if you go on vacation one week and somebody sits in your desk and pretends like they have your job I mean I think we should have something at the end of 3.8 a right that gives a time frame includes vacations and a duration of less than two weeks or something all right because having somebody sit up there for a photo op

when they do nothing because the Mayors are on France for three days it's kind of crazy do you know yeah like I always thought temporary absence should be defined yeah right yeah there's no real absences that's not an absence it has been treated as an absence of electronic disease yeah vacation or something along those lines where to make sure it specifically exclude that as an absence

so vacations I think we need to Define absence I do multiple times I just think that well and there should be I think there should be a time frame if if a mayor uh if a man goes outside the city technically uh I mean I understand what everybody's saying it can go in two directions you can have it two moves or two types and right now I think we're getting Vibe down on every sentence

I don't think we are no I don't think so either I think temporary absence needs to be defined like even if you put um it says whenever by reason of sickness or other cause yeah defining those I think would be too Petty the mayor is unable to perform the duties of the office I think for a period of 30 days or more then that's when we got to start looking at the other sections

I think temporary options should have a time limit on it and let me remind everybody by definition the city administrator mayor's assist Ed City administrator so when the mayor disappears for a week or whatever on vacation the city administrator is the one who steps up that's already the mayor's assistant so two points yeah but the city administrator can't sign contact yeah at a loss for two weeks or a week

vacation I don't know if we need somebody oh no in a short period is in that office for a week so what do you want to put like what do you think temporary absence excludes vacations uh you know traveling in the line of Duties and stuff

I don't think because there's really no more temporary access unless he's in the hospital you know recovery or having a heart attack well okay let's just I'm in Florida why can't I get on Zoom and conduct a meeting and conduct City business well what if he wanted to take a leave of access is that different if he said Hey listen I've been that's a vacancy I would say so um

but do you think it needs um a time frame or there's no temporary absence of the name do you think do you exclude vacation

find that plan days away including vacations are excluded from the definition of temporary absence actually Mr Rogers submitted um uh lasting more than three words he gave us some input at the a couple of two public comments he gave us I just want to read Mr August's suggestion on the temporary absence of the mayor and this is Mr August's uh suggestion okay it's not um it's not emotion acting

mayor whenever by reason of sickness incapacity short-term absence from the city are other such cause lasting more than three working days the mayor is temporarily unable to perform the duties of the office the president shall be and it goes on the mayor shall notify the city council president in writing of an absence uh from the city for a period of three or more and in the event the mayor because of

his temporary incapacity or disability is unable to make that decision for himself the city council makes a vote I mean you know what if he is unable to perform his duties that's a temporary absence I'm thinking yeah it's like how long do you it's disability right that's what it should be okay any if the language isn't tight to see a political battle where there's a fight for it and it's going to be

litigation and I'm telling you that it no award is going to side with an elected official the elected mayor being voted out of his office by you know a majority or even a super majority of the city council because of some small issue can I so can I so I'd like to make a motion that maybe we draft and we come back to this but my motion is that we draft a disability clause

uh for Section 3.8 and revisit it when we have a draft of a disability Clause because that's I think really what we're kind of talking about is it's not temporary absence because of vacation or traveling out of States it's really if the capacity to serve as mayor is one that he's absent from so my motion is this that um uh we um revisit 3.8 um with the intention of maybe creating a disability Clause physically and

mental um so there's emotion made to return to 3.8 with some drafts of a disability clause that's been seconded seconded by Mr Mitchell any further discussion on that motion um it'll be either in a b or c because it's titled temporary absence as a whole we revisit 3.8 and come back with a disability Clause draft uh we revisit that then and it's been okay any more discussion Mr Machado I I have a copy of

judging assayan's decision on the city council case and what judge you saying said was that um if the court read 3.8 as broadly as the council suggests he would give the council the authority to remove a mayor whenever he or she is unable to perform his or her mayoral duties to their liking and what and he talked about uh talks about me interpretation my suggestion would be that we also consider tightening up the

process that the city council takes if they ever decide to go forward on 3.8 because I think 3.8 could be you know it's not unconstitutional but it just I think requires the hearing would probably require some evidence it's got to be an Evidence yeah so that make a determination they call witnesses who testify that the mayor is unable to serve and uh so um can I can I amend my motion I don't even

think the city council ought to have the right to vote to remove a man I I believe I believe that there should be one way that that a mayor is removed so there's a motion on the table uh that not by a City Council vote or a vote of anything motion on the table is that we revisit 3.8 a through C with a disability draft and any other concerns it's been seconded on any more discussion

all in favor motion passes unanimously we will return to 3.8 and uh with drafts of a disability clause and revisit any other issues in 3.8 moving on to 310 vacant section 3-10 vacancy in the office of Mayor is the title of it whenever a vacancy occurs in the office of Mayor by death removal resignation or any other reason during the first 18 months of the term for which the mayor was elected the

city council shall call a special election to be held within 90 days following the date the vacancy is created to fill the vacancy for the remainder of the unexpired term between the date of the Declaration of vacancy and the certification of the results of the special election the vacancy in the office of Mayor shall be filled as provided in 3.8 a if the city council president is unable or unwilling

to serve the provisions of 38 C shall apply the candidate elected as mayor in a special election shall be sworn to the office immediately upon certification of the results of the special election paragraph two if a regular city election is to be held within 150 days after the date the vacancy is created a special election need not be held in the position shall be filled by a vote at the regular city election and the

candidate elected as mayor shall be sworn to the office immediately upon certification of the results of the regular city election and Shall Serve for the remainder of the unexpired term in addition to the term to which it elected paragraph three of a vacancy occurs after the 18th month through the end of the term for which the mayor was elected the vacancy in the office of Mayor shall be filled as provided in

section 38a if the vacancy cannot be filled under Section 38a the provisions of section 38c shall apply the acting mayor shall exercise all the rights and powers of the mayor shall be sworn to the faithful discharge of the mayor oral duties any city council is serving as acting mayor under the section shall not be entitled to have the words candidate for re-election printed with that counselor's name on the election

ballot any counselor serving as mayor under this section shall receive the compensation then in effect for the office of Mayor the jokes Mr August section 310 uh any conversation any comments is that primary or final or this stuff comes up and does it even require a primary in a special election because that's not safe oh yeah so 90 days is there a primary or just a regular it's always

been a primary General so is the special election do you take out special election and put final I don't know I don't know what special election means but I know and I don't know what's been changed Once Upon a Time I may have got elected on a special election took six and a half months to get to the special election because people really enjoy um the interim and a lot was done without an electric fan

because the acting may have filled in yeah were you an acting mayor and then oh waiting six and a half months for the election I started campaigning in December and finished in June so it's the language the city council shall call a special election is it the language that should well I just think you got to consider that it's true in Fall River there's a primary and a final for Municipal elections

so first of all I think the issue is are you going to have preliminary and Final Four special election and where it says 90 days which I don't think was there back then but it is now is the 90 days the primary or the special because it does matter I mean right men's are going to step down there's going to be special elections um you'd like to see a primary special

election well I I think you could have one just one and then but then the question is that if fifty percent off you can follow something uh you can follow Southern law and have one election and if there's nobody over 50 percent the top two yeah but then you're back to the issue all right Four Rivers always had if you work with this election you had for black people

I just it came to me and 90 days is important because yeah right and it feels like I don't know it felt like it was a lot we were talking about the there was some discussion about the time limit second paragraph I don't know what it means and does 150 days isn't that different than the 18 months should it be 180 days do you understand what that means Alan I

mean is that a lot of that language well in the last six months you don't have to hold a special election but then at the regular city election oh okay so I see what they say so if you win in November right you get to serve December and then you get sworn in January right I guess is that what it means so meantime the president is the mayor right yeah and that's the only difference there is

that month of December I guess it used to be a week to January yes absolutely regardless nope go ahead

and he offers a map by desk removal or other meat or other reasons that Jimmy Council took the position that removal gave you know that the mayor could be removed from us for under that any other reason Claus off on any other group offer any other reason that's the one that went all right I kind of suggested it to the city council that in other sentiment removal of the men can be removed

and you know they took a little they took the liberal the interpretation of that and uh they used to have removal to try to get the marriage but and you know Mass General law even the constitution of mass has a provision that elected officials can be removed and as a process with the legislature that any elected official can be removed and so does that come under any other reason because I'll tell you I read I just

pulled it up that's why my suggestion was that the process needs to be more tightened up than what took place so I'm I'm I would guess that if that was redone and it was actual evidence one of the suggestions was you know hey he can't uh he can't work with marijuana licenses um he can't you know supervise employees or employees or you know not feeling comfortable that's there's going to be a factual basis for

that almost like an impeachment process yes where there's hearings and testimonies taken and then and then a certain vote like which would certainly make the city council think twice before going into that procedure but when it's warranted we've got to establish yeah

no but there's a Mass General law that applies to removal of elected officials I I know that I pulled it I just don't know where I put it we should look at the language of that I guess you know I'd like to make a motion if I may on 310 is that we review um Mass general laws in the Massachusetts Constitution because I know that there's a Mass General law that also talks to a legislative legislative

procedure for the removal of elected officials and I'm not talking about State officials I'm talking about you know even city or town so I'd like to make a motion that we revisit 310 at the next meeting actually in in order to come back with um with some more information um regarding uh removal wait a second I second that motion um Laura seconds the motion to revisit 310 to um further research the removal process

and it's I made it Laura seconded it any discussion all in favor motion passes does someone find stuff like that today scanning yes um yeah we um yeah make it can I make a motion to adjourn the meeting at seven o'clock what I have to say one thing yes absolutely so with the last meeting you asked me to combine

now that you have been officially elected as the charter clerk yes um may I suggest that um you know probably it's going to be the late May meeting we have to have a report draft written up and that maybe we Revis we do all that at once yeah um and what I wanted to say two other things before we go off the Record before we adjourn the meeting one

um if you don't get the emails and it's not on the website please let me know and I will make sure I remedy it we're working with it for the 2022 special Charter Review Committee to have its own web page but that's a work in progress however if you have cases or statutes that you want to refer us to please email them and I do want I would I'll send this out by email but I do

want to put it on the record one of the things that we should all familiarize ourselves with is the home Rule Charter it's Mass General Law chapter 43b we will send it out we will try to make a link for you to look at it but I'll try to get hard copies the other thing to familiarize yourself with is the Massachusetts Constitution the website for that is m a legislature.gov laws slash Constitution

because the mass the Constitution also is something we need to be mindful of and the other uh portion of the Constitution to kind of look at is article eight of the mass Constitution that also talks about removal of officers I'll send it in the email we'll try to get it on the website again I'll work with it next Monday night is our next meeting I don't know if it's going

to get on there before then but I know that they'll work furiously doing it either that or we'll we'll make links so there's a motion to adjourn by Laura Washington seconded by I'll second Tim and all in favor aye all right motion passes thank you