3.24.2025 Community Preservation Committee

Um, all righty. Welcome to the community preservation committee meeting uh out of one uh government center hearing room uh at 6 o'clock uh March 24th. Uh pursuant to the open meeting law, any person may make an audio or video recording of this public uh transmit the meeting though any medium attendees are therefore advised that such recording or transmissions are being made whether perceived or

unpersceived by those present and deemed acknowledged and permissible. We'll start with roll call to my left. Michael Frier's here.

Alexander Silva here. John Brandt here.

James Hornsby here. Rick Manceni here.

And then on Zoom, uh Kristen, just state that you're on Zoom too when you Yep. Kristen Canar Oliver attending remotely by Zoom.

Joanne Joan Bentley Joan Bentley attending remotely by Zoom.

Chris Benitini is attending remotely by Zoom. Okay, thank you. We also have Sandy Dennis here for our administrative assistant.

Um, let's see. Citizen input. Michael, did you want to go now or did you want to go go after the uh presentation? The board would like to It should be on the first is on the agenda. Okay, you should come up now since you're on the agenda.

Good evening. Thank you for letting me speak. My name is Michael Pinacho. I own Mike's Auto Body on 535 Bay Street. I've been a resident of Forer since 1959. I was born here. I've seen a lot of things as a kid over the years. I've seen the city grow. Um I'm here to say please uh approve this for Christ the Rock Church.

Um it's a church, but it's a great place. I am a Christian. I've been saved since I was 27, 1986. I attend CFC in Dartmouth, but I do go to Christ the Rock on Thursday nights for Bible studies. They're awesome Bible studies.

Uh it's fun. We laugh. We joke. We feed people at Bible studies. And uh Pastor Rob's doing a great job with the church.

He took over from his father-in-law, Pastor Jack, who was a great man and he also was a sergeant in the police department. So, there's integrity there.

Um, I've seen before Pastor Rob or Pastor Jack and Pastor Kathy go out, feed people, help people, uh, go to the park, have haircuts for people who needed to be cleaned up a little bit.

It's not just feeding them food, it's feeding them the love, compassion. Um, it's amazing to see uh, beautiful people doing beautiful things.

And when I heard that there was going to be a meeting here about the church tower, I said, I got to say something because this is a good thing. You know, I can't say where my tax dollars go. It goes the things I like or don't like, but that's life is. But helping support the ministry there, the love. Um, they got a pantry there. You go there in the middle in in the sanctuary, there's

bread there for people. Uh, a lot of people are giving. Um, there's a gentleman that donated, I think, $10,000 in matching grants. And if this goes through, which I hope it does, he's going to step up some more. So, it's not just the city, which is a great partner.

It's the people. It's it's everybody in the church, everybody giving, caring, and um if there's any questions that you have, I'm I'm inside looking out and I'm also outside looking in because it's not my home church, but I love what they do.

They're really great people.

Thanks for your comments. Do does anyone have any ju just a quick question. Do you reside in Fall River or you just have your business in Fall River? I have my business in forward. Okay. All my mail goes to my work address. That that that's okay. I just wanted people to understand that you're part of the community. I've went to Brighton Avenue School. I went to Diamond and I'm a Fall River person. Thank you.

Thanks.

Nothing to say except thank you for speaking. Thank you, Mr.

Hornsby. Thank you. If you ever need me for anything else, please call. We'll do. Thank you. All right. Next on the agenda is Christ to Rock Church emergency funding. Uh before you get started, could you let some of our new members here uh just go back to the basics when Okay. you first applied and then even tell us about uh I see you got a nice uh grant. Yes. Explain that a little and

then get into the funding and who they are. Yeah. Who they are. Yes. So uh my name is Robert Canavan. I'm the pastor of Christ the Rock Church on Rock Street. I've been in Fall River since 2018. I took over um as the lead pastor uh about two years ago. Uh the church is a beautiful church. If you've ever driven down Rock Street, Rock Street is stacked with amazing buildings and churches. Um the building's about 100

years old and uh you know, we've owned it since 1978ish. Um, but honestly, the church has taken care of the building the way it should. We own that. It's it's our fault, the the material that it's in, uh the the condition that it's in. So, I understand that uh our lack of planning isn't an emergency on your part. So, I appreciate uh what you guys have done. A couple years ago, when I took over as

lead pastor, I sent out some emails to a few people. Jim Soul was one of them. Um I think um Mr. Buchard as well. Uh, and they were able to tell me that the church was on the national historic register, the local historic register. So, that was great. And then we applied for a grant.

I I met Mike through uh Jim Soul as well and Sandy and all of you guys. And so, we started the the funding thing a couple years ago and you guys approved I think it was just over 100,000. So, we hired Paul who's behind us who could speak to the he's been up up and close with it. He knows what's going on with it. So, he was able to do

about $100,000 worth of work. I know he cut corners on his end to save the church money. We didn't pay for a lift.

I think that lift was like I don't know, the rental fee was astronomical, but we didn't have to pay for that and a bunch of other things. As far as I know, whether I can say it or not, he hasn't taken a penny from us yet. Um, I don't want to make that public knowledge, so don't put this on the internet. Um, but I mean, people's hearts are in it,

right? And so we're doing the best we can. We're a small church. I'm a pastor.

I'm not a grant writer. I've written tons of grants and haven't heard back from them. So I couldn't provide rejections cuz I'm not even good enough to get rejected. So we just hired a a grant writer. Her name's um Jamie Dylan, and she works for Noble Nonprofits. So my hope is because this project's going to cost a few million dollars to finish to make it perfect. Right now, we just

want to make it safe. And from what Paul uh behind us has told us is if we can get this next round of funding, it'll at least make that exterior part that's in danger of falling safe for the community and then the next round will apply again. We'll do it the right way. Um but we're looking for other ways to pay for this, not just rely on you guys. So I

appreciate you taking the time to at least hear us out on this matter. Okay.

Did I answer the question you asked?

Okay. Now, how are you doing on your outside funding? I see one guy. Yeah.

So, we had a business in the city that wanted to remain anonymous and they said that they would match any donation that came into the church up to 10,000. We didn't have that $10,000 check that we were hoping for, but we've had $100, $100, $500. Um a a supermarket in the city, a small one. Um they donated almost $1,000. So, the money's coming in. It's just really slow. So, with um the

urgency from Paul and Mike, we really thought we would try to we didn't know that this would even be possible. So, the fact that you guys are letting us do an emergency application, we appreciate that. Um so, yes. So, we're we're chipping away at it. We're just we can't we're a small congregation, less than 100 people. So, and some of them are just recently, you know, homeless. So,

it's not like they're giving. People think churches have tons of money, and the fact is we don't. So, I get paid about minimum wage if you want to figure that out. So, it's not like the church has uh buckets of money, but I love my job. I love loving people in our city.

So, as long as that church can be there as a lighthouse to help people, uh we'll be here to to do that. So, but we're not going to stop. Even if you give us the grant, we need over a million. So, we're going to keep applying everywhere we can. That's good.

Um, so if you want to tell us about what you're looking for as far as repairs this coming. So Mike Keen Civiteex architect. So um, we can certainly invite Paul Chatha Mason up as well, but what I can say is that what's been completed to date so far, uh, as of last fall, um, is, uh, restoration of the tower, uh, up to not quite half the height of the tower. Okay. So once we started

to once we started to get into it a little bit more uh noticed that there's considerable damage uh to not so much the uh masonry units the stone units themselves but the mortar it's it's really where it's it's deteriorated and um uh there's been a lot of um shifting of those large masonry units uh as well and you see that more so on the north side which is really concealed from the

public you. Um, so it wasn't until Paul really got into it and we were able to get up on the scaffolding and really climb up and get out on the bell tower uh and look at that north side that it was um pretty significant significant.

So, a lot of the tracery, the stone tracery that's there, it's in really uh a very bad shape. Okay. Um, and we've uh kept Mike and Alex certainly apprised of the work. We've had them out there a few times as well to see that firsthand. Um, we taken a bunch of photos and documented it. So, and just to go back to what Pastor Robin said earlier that we understood that we were uh getting

awarded $100,000 initially and we said we would take it as far as we could and work with the Mason to see, you know, get as much as we could. Um, I will note that uh the mortar joints that are there, they're not original as far as the lower level. They were repointed maybe what you say 50 years ago 50 years ago. that did some repointing work and it wasn't done properly. Okay. They used

a different type of mortar, not the lime based mortar that really was there originally. So, um I think there a couple of samples that Alex might have showed you previously. Uh so you could really feel the the density of the uh repointing that was done versus the original mortar which is almost like a pummus. It's very light. Um so so fortunately you've you've taken out most of that in that lower level and from

what I can see and I think you can see as well that the upper section including the north side has the original mortar so they shouldn't be encountering some of that you know the difficulty and they were going through so many blades as they were trying to grind out the the mortar joints um and burning through a lot of those. So, I'm not anticipating that you'll have too much more of that

hopefully as you get further further up.

The mon that they used 50 years ago um it was real strong and it caused the stones to shatter. It was too much pressure around the prison. Could you talk to Could you move the mic over for him? Sure. Thank you. When they pointed this up, say 50 years ago, they used a mortar and they years ago they figured that the stronger the m the stronger the building which is

not correct. Um by using the density of the mortar that they use was like something like 5,000 or 8,000 PSI and when it did it literally exploded around the perimeter of the stone. Also it caused structural cracks in the stone itself.

And the biggest issue that I've seen is that on the top section on the east side, there's no mortar between the void of the brick and the stone re the back side of it. And those stones are just candle levering up there. In a very short time, those stones on the east side and the north side are going to collapse and it's going to go through the roof of the church and it's also

going to go there's a doorway on the east side on the lower level and it could cause damage there. That's why I left the station up just so keep people away from there.

Yeah. But it's it's a it's a bad issue. I mean, I've worked on many churches and museums and things throughout my career, and I this is a the most intriguing one I've seen.

It's really bad. And you got wash out between the walls because the M on the tops like a type O, which is a very light, soft M. And eventually if you don't do any maintenance, it causes the monet to wash out. So because you got a brick wall and you got the stone and there's a void in there and there's fasteners. Well, some of the fasteners has snapped off from the pressure of the

stones from below level. We've got literally like we're doing is rebuilding the foundation up, you know, the stone and the brick together. And we're up about 30 ft, 40 ft. Not quite halfway.

Yeah, not quite halfway. And um so if you have any questions, I'd glad to answer you. But basically, you're trying to use the same mortar they used originally. Yes.

And uh also some of the ties that you're doing, they're putting in the stainless steel tie so that you don't have future deterioration, not like you're seeing in some areas, right? What we're doing is in the backside and inside the tower itself, this brick veneer, we're taking bricks out and making pockets to find out where the ties first. But we found out where the ties were originally and

we used that as a schematic so that we could figure out where they were going up the wall. And a lot of them were snapped off. So what we've done is we've taken the brick out and we've screwed the stone back into the um brick veneer. And then we've infilled it with grout, so it's a solid mass now. Yeah.

But um it's a lot of work.

Questions from the board? Yeah, I just have a few questions. Uh thank you again. This is a prime example of um hire the right individual and do the work correctly the first time around.

And uh we've observed, Alex and I, what you've done, what you've come across.

Um, I had one just general question. I know. Thank you for uh keeping the um staging up. Uh, it's been kind of a rough winter, kind of a rough um last couple of weeks, especially with the high winds and the rains and the snow.

Is there any other deterioration since the last time we inspected it? Or do you think the numbers that you're looking at right now will get you to the um the finish line for this part? did was we swept off the sidewalk and the stairs in that on the low upper level and we were over there a couple of weeks ago. I go there and check it about every two weeks. Mhm. And there's a lot of

aggregate on the on the stairs and the sidewalk. So, it's dropping off the from the top. Okay. Anything structurally though with the inside of the building?

Uh do you think it's still the inside?

The brick work is fine because it hasn't been weathered. Okay. You know, it's you got that inside and there's an air shaft or there's a metal container. I guess years ago it was a vent shaft that goes inside the church.

Mhm. For a ventilation system. And it's in the northeast corner. Mhm.

And I think that there's because of what's going on and that's there that's holding it up. Okay.

Because it's tied into the um the brick work which is tied into the uh some of the stone work. And could you just do a quick u brief overview of what this phase of work would be? Uh that way the public can understand. We we've both identified and seen and confirm the situation and hence why we asked for this emergency meeting, but maybe just so that the public knows what you're

trying to accomplish and maybe even like a time frame. I don't even know if you're up and running yet or a couple more weeks or a couple more months.

Um, we go back inside the tower and cut out more pockets and go up and continue on putting ties in the wall and then grouting it and then infilling the brick back. And then that way we know that the the stone is somewhat stable. Mhm. And then when we got on the outside, we uh packed the between the stones and uh refinished it basically. And that's the north side and the east side that you're trying well

all three sides but the west side on the tower on the top northwest corner at the top there's about 20 ft 25 ft that is just hanging there and the whole north side has to come down. We have to take those stones down literally and place them either um inside or something and rebuild that section up cuz that you can't repoint.

Mhm. I mean that's it's just I'm shocked that it hasn't fallen yet. Okay. I mean it's it's bad. And then across the north, the backside where the roof is and then on the east northeast corner, if you look up at the tower from the sidewalk, for example, you can see it's got a big belly in it. Um eventually that belly is going to separate and that's what I'm, you know, and there are sections in the that

northeast corner where there's really there's no mortar. There's no mortar there. No. So you can see it more so on the when you're on that section of the roof on the north side looking at that northeast corner, you know, and it's causing water to penetrate through the walls and probably going inside the roof rafters on that side of the church.

Yeah. And cause issues with rafters and rafter tails and plaster and lather just continuous.

Very good. Thank you.

A couple if anyone wants to go first.

No. Um, hi. Uh, so I'm a little bit more familiar with the conditions, but just some questions for the public's knowledge. Um, could you just maybe uh describe the impact the first grant had on the church and if it like you know how it affected operations and such?

Well, from and just with the mic just slide that over.

Uh, from the pastoral point of view, I mean, it was a relief that we had the funds coming in knowing that you guys were going to hold on to the money because I thought we'd have to figure out put it in the bank and, you know, make sure we have every receipt. So, uh, Paul and they were great with that Sandy communication. So, uh, that allowed us just to have the freedom to say, "All

right, Paul, go to work." And, uh, I mean, his crew was out there every day working hard. I mean, you guys saw all the progress they made. So, that 100,000 um I think you really stretched it to I can't give you a number, but we went over the hundred and uh he was great and he zeroed it out as far as I know. So, um it's been a blessing to us. I mean,

as far as what the 100,000 actually accomplished, I'd have to hand it off to to Mike or Paul as far as the detail, but it sounds like we got not quite halfway up the building. And it's not picture perfect, but it's safe. to the bottom part. So what I understand is they built a firm foundation which we should have done years ago and now they're going to build up further. So

what it sounds like this if we get this grant it'll make that side that he's talking about safe and then next round we'll have to work on the rest of it but I don't know the details. I'm more so meant uh impact on the operation of church activities like I understand there was flooding in the basement. So, like how how that kind of affected uh you know, so I had brought James, he's

in the back there. He's our church volunteer maintenance guy and uh he's picked up more floods in the basement.

Um I don't know if when you guys have gone and if you went down those steps to the left, but it used to be our youth room where we had youth room, youth ministry, but I mean the other day, even the other day, we had quite a bit of water down there. So the water is still coming down inside, but the water that was coming in where we did the 100,000 that stopped like there's no more

moisture there. We had to when you guys went up those metal steps um that used to have water all down it too. So that water has stopped coming in which is great. So we're seeing progress of it.

But Paul's right that water finds its way in then gets behind the the horsehair plaster whatever it is. then it bubbles out, the stuckco falls, and then it just looks horrible. So, we're working on that. Um, but yes, so we've seen um that the money has resulted in um a little less flooding, a little less damage being done. So, it won't be complete until, you know, it's all done.

So, Okay. So, it's still flooding and it's still affecting like usable space.

Correct. Yes. Okay. Um, and could you just kind of I know it's in the application and we heard it uh the last grand round, but could you uh just kind of detail some of your services to the community? Absolutely. So, we have a food pantry uh which means um anybody in this city, if anyone on city council or listening online needs food, you come get it. We don't check your ID, any of

that. We don't say you don't are you worthy of food. Everybody gets food. Um, so we we probably do I don't know if it's I I can't I wish I could put a number. I thought it was about a thousand families a month between that plus we do uh something with RPA where they come up and they um the students come up and go in our food pantry, put

bags together and then two of our stu uh teachers bring those bags of food to people in the community that need food through the school system. We partnered with Mike Dion um Spindle City Church uh as the overflow shelter to do warming centers throughout this winter when it was really cold. We had a stretch where we did four or five days. We had 40 45 people in there. Um the nurses would

come and check on them. We did haircuts one day. We fed them two two meals. So, uh we try to do as much as we can. We try to think outside the box, work with other people in the city, uh that are doing stuff. So, we do that. We also go out uh onto the rail trails and different places to give bags of food and um nonp perishables and toiletries.

So all of that is stored in the building. We we um we just started a partnership with the autism center. So their clients come and they build bags for us for the homeless, which is kind of cool. So we're we're trying to develop different things and eventually it'd be great to seven days a week the church is being used and stuff. Um so we're developing that too. So, I think we're in the infancy stages, but

obviously we need the tower to be there for it to be safe to have all this stuff. So, thank you. Uh, and I think I asked this last go around um with the previous grant, but and I realized that you're you still haven't been able to re reclaim any usable space, but do you have any plans of uh using that future usable space? Um, in what way? I was

going to ask like what do any plans for that? Yeah. So, one of the things we've thought of, uh, from a church perspective, we thought it'd be cool to have like a prayer tower where people can go up and pray and get away, meditate, and stuff. But from a practical spot, we were talking about making a a clothing closet where we could have, you know, new jeans, sweatshirts, t-shirts, and those that

come to church that might not have clothing take them there to go shopping, so to speak, for free. Uh, but then when we have the unhoused there, we could bring them over there as well. It is a little challenge to climb up those steps. So, um maybe we can throw an elevator in or something, but no, we can't do that. But, so we're thinking of doing something like that because it is

a unique spot to try to use, but I think um the potential is there to do stuff like that. Okay. Um and uh so if the I think I know the answer, but if the tower falls um in your opinion, would the church be able to stay open and perform these services? No, definitely not. And then I don't know if it would be a complete tear down. Who knows what?

I have no idea. But no. And uh the $1 million kind of plan for improvements that you mentioned, what does that includes? I'm guessing that's the entirety of the building. Uh could you just kind of detail what your future plans uh would be if that went forward?

So, am I allowed to hand that one off?

Like I think one of you guys could probably answer that a little bit better. I don't know what. So that was based on an original quote that Paul had provided us early on, but that would be primarily for the masonry work for the whole building. For the rest of the building, I think for just the tower just the tower for the sorry for the rest of the tower because how the stage

the tower is put in place. It's very hard to when you're dealing with stones, you have to have a when we get up on the roof line, for example, that has to be done by um like triple grease scaffolding that does that because you have to put um bars in there and lock it in for the weight because of the weight. You know what we're doing?

We're just doing the vertical walls up to the guttle line or so and then they'll take over and do the rest. They wanted to do the scaffolding was around $300,000. So, I'm trying to cut that price, you know, down considerable but um when we get to that point, then I'll get another quote from, you know, it shouldn't even be. So there are um some cast stone masonry units also that I know we looked at when

we were out there, but essentially the microphone uh there are cast stone masonry units uh throughout. Okay. And some of those are exhibiting signs of splintering. So there's no sort of um consolidation that's included in what he's currently doing. It's just strictly the mortar joints that are being re repointed. So some of that, you know, that that will continue to deteriorate, you know, over

time, but it's not some cases it's not immediate. Uh it's more so, but we're also in where there's severe cracks in the stone itself, we're putting an epoxy um it's like a epoxy glue into that.

It's a waterproofer and it bonds the stone together again. So everything to keep the water out.

So the emergency grant funding amount is um it doesn't include the it's it wouldn't finish the tower basically. It would just make it safe. It would make it safe. Okay. And so that millions for the tower, not the whole church. Okay.

Um and lastly, I think you had kind of hit on some points that sort of led to this moment, you know, for the the building leading up to now. So, I was wondering if your organization would be agreeable to perhaps uh we recently kind of did this with one of our uh past grant awards. Um but would your organization be open to kind of developing um a sort of loose capital

improvement plan for the building and a maintenance plan going forward where it's just maybe even just like this is what you would do 50 years from now when you're going to have to fix this tower again just so that knowledge isn't lost for you know future generations so no one's in this situation in the future.

It doesn't have to be hyperdetailed as I realize um you know the extent that it could really get to but it's basically basically just some bullet point guidelines for the organization going forward and the plan that you're planning on proceeding with you know as you fund raise for the future beyond you know this immediate need. Um, I think if that was presented uh to the committee and the community going forward, it

would kind of at least give us something to look on as we as your organization goes forward and you kind of, you know, assess the needs and and everything.

Yeah. So, I mean, taking over an organization after the building's been there for 100 at that point 97 years, you know, there's a lot of excuses. Uh the pastor prior to me wanted to sell the building for the last 20 years, 10 years. And then people wanted to make it condos, this that and the other. And when I took over, my heart was really to keep it a church. Uh try to fix it. And

from our faith perspective, when we started to put money into it, the money kept coming in. You guys got us the grant. So we thank God for that. We thank you first. We thank God first, but then we thank you. Um, but we realize that this is a horrible uh pattern to get in because like you said, in 50 years when I'm gone, if we don't take care of it, they're going to be calling

Paul's grandson to come and do it again.

So, I'm going to ask these two gentlemen to help me put that together from their expertise of uh now that we fixed it, what do we need to do every year? Do I need to hire someone like them to come back and inspect it? I have no idea. I got to be honest with you, right? So, we are going to come up with a plan. so that every year we have a checklist so

that we know we're getting those things done because I don't want my predecessors in 10, 15, 20 years to have to come before you and you guys are like, "Hey, you guys, it's your fault."

So, I I see what you're saying and yes, we will get something like that together for you. That's great.

That's it for me. And I think also it's looking at, you know, just like you said, the long term. We haven't gotten to that point yet with the the church but things like windows, roofing and and even if it's just like you know benchmarks and you know goals um say you know 20 years you come to this committee this committee can you can even present to this committee you know that we did

this amount and now this is where we are you know it's just kind of a blueprint for everyone.

Yeah that's Jim anything?

Well I have some expertise in maintaining old churches. St. Luke's Church on Warren Street. Okay. Beautiful building. Where I've been there since 1967 and we have a but that's what our problems are. uh if I can what I think there what I'm looking for along in terms of the long-term planning is is is a long-term plan and I wouldn't close off other uses besides a worship center and a

church but regardless whether you have uh you know some of the ideas we've floated around too uh we're still a church. But um you simply need to get the exterior, as you put it, safe, finished, reliable, and then look for other uses.

And put in options.

It's perfectly okay to put in options of stuff you might do. And I don't think the committee is looking is looking for um a sense that you have a have long-term plans with some flexibility. That's all I wanted to say.

I think that's close.

Um and it's hard with churches.

Um, you know, I just I picked somebody up for church on Sunday morning and she's right next to a former Methodist church, uh, which is housing.

U, one of our churches was knocked down for a parking lot.

Well, you know, hey, it's an Episcopal church. Let's knock it down. That's but u the u uh flexibility but also some sign that you that you've got to plan ahead to besides fix the tower before it falls on someone and I I appreciate the need for that. I may in fact be in touch with the Shuket uh family before this is over.

Thank you. Thank you. Rick, anything?

No, just fully understand your issue and and basically what what they're talking about is a master plan, right, Mike?

You've done enough of those. So, that's the next uh Yeah. Yeah. No, I have I have no no questions. Chris, anything?

Yeah, just one question and apologies if this was sort of discussed in the in the um dialogue so far. is the $1,600 and5 uh $5,100 being requested. Would and I I understand it's obviously made for the safety of the remaining structure. Will that definitely cover the safety of the remaining structure moving forward. Does that make sense in terms of no additional needs from a safety standpoint will be will be needed

from there on out?

So it's enough to stabilize. Yeah.

So is the question so essentially with the money that's being requested now it's to get us to a point where we stabilize the tower is that and that it's safe. Yeah. But that it's you know let's say it's 100.

That's a tricky question. you know, will there be a time where you might need more for the safety purpose?

What's that? What's the funding?

What is the That's a hard question to answer because Okay, that's fair. That That's a perfectly fine answer. Yeah. Would you like to elaborate on that though? Why why is it difficult in your estimation?

I can I I can't hear you, sir. He he asked why is it difficult in your estimation to answer that?

The question. Oh, Chris, can you just repeat the question?

Sorry. Yeah, there might be some some issues on the audio. Um, so so the original question is the total funding amount. You're stating that it it's to allow for full safety protection on the remaining structure. I I'm asking will that definitely secure the building from a safety standpoint moving forward. In other words, 100% of the building that you're requesting for for safety purposes will be secured and not let's

say 80% or 90% being safe. Does that make sense?

Just be that northwest side, right?

Um, when we priced out the the promote, excuse me, the proposal for the work that was to do the whole tower.

Now, what we've done, we've done over $100,000 in work.

So, the hard part is coming up is when the walls because as you go up the top bulging out, you got to take things apart.

Um, I can't say to you that if you give them 100,000 that's going to get to the top. That's not going to happen. I know it won't because there's so much going on that I wish it would happen, but it's not. I got that. I know. I mean it's I can't guarantee to you that we get to this point and you know that's like ask me what the power ball number is for next

Friday. I can't do that. So the the quote that uh Chocet Masonry has is 145,000 for this next this next phase.

Um I had suggested to pastor Rob to put in a contingency. Usually I do 10%. Um but in a case like this with there could be some additional unknowns, we might want to consider increasing that from what was originally requested. So um just a brief conversation with Pastor Rob before the meeting that maybe request that we increase to 200,000 but that would be inclusive of the 15,000

that I understand the church has. So I think then the total request would be 185,000 for the C from the CPC and we could set aside that amount above the 145,000 as a contingency would only tap into it unless it's absolutely needed because it's a difficult question to ask. It's a good question but it's a difficult question to answer until you start to get into it. And I think that, you know, we could or would closely

monitor it like we did before. We involve uh Alex and Mike as the leazison for the CPC. But um I'm of the mind that um the total request be 200,000.

Um okay. Subtract from that 15,000 which is what the church would put in. So the request from the CPC would be 185.

Okay. uh and and and in in some kind of weird backdoor way, I I was wondering, you know, if you had a perfect world, what would the number be that you felt comfortable with, if that makes sense.

So, that was very helpful. I appreciate you elaborating on that.

Yeah. Okay. No other questions on my end. All right. Uh Christine, any questions? I No, I have nothing. I think everybody pretty much covered everything I was wondering.

Joanne.

Um I just uh I do like the idea that um maybe the request is increased to the 200,000 and back out the 15,000. That way the a little bit more work can be done. Renovation work is always hard.

You don't know what you're going to encounter until you're there. Um, so I I'm glad that Chris you brought that up and asked that question about is that, you know, money going to cover it where if if we're if this committee is able to do it and we can give more than what's asked knowing that this will help, um, then I think we should do that. But yeah, I don't know if I'm speaking out

of turn here, but I'd rather I'd rather like consider more and back off of it to understand that the job will get done fully than have a problem down the down the road that, you know, can't be reviewed until the next review cycle, so to speak. So, I don't know, just again, don't want to think for everybody here, but that was just my thought process.

Okay. Well, in reserve for FY26, we have $49,000 in reserve.

Uh, so if the board wishes, they could make a motion to do the 185.

So in this emergency fund, you're going to go up 25 ft or what what's your distance you're going up to do the repair? What's the rest? Probably to the gutter line. The gutter line is about another 50 60 ft. 50 60 feet. Some ways in there. Okay. 50 ft.

And then you're going to take the stone down. That's in the back. That's another story al together. Okay. So this one you're not taking the stone down. You're just repointing. So you can't take the back off unless you stabilize the sides.

Okay. Because there's nothing for the staging to hold in place. Okay. Because it's so fragile. All right. So you're going to go up 50 50 feet and uh repoint. We're going to take it areas that are where the bulge is. We're going to try to fix that on the stage. Okay.

You know, I don't know how bad it is from the on the east side. Yeah. Like it's just um it's tricky. You know, it's a stone sitting up in the air, you know. I'm just trying to get like what we can put in a motion as far as work done this way. It's outlined and we're covered. You're covered. So, so can I can I just reiterate what I think we're doing here? It's my

understanding is it's on the east side of the tower that needs to be stabilized. It is the north side of the tower and then it's the corner the northwest corner that needs to be fixed immediately. This is because of a safety issue to this. And so from what you're stating, based on your method of construction or reconstruction, you're thinking $185,000 plus the $15,000 from the church would at least get you to that.

You feel comfortable enough with that aspect of it where you have to put staging on the roof. Yeah. Okay. But cuz you got to lock it into the sides. You just can't put stage it on a roof and put stones that weigh two or 300 lb on it because it won't take the weight and cause issue with roof. You know, especially being rained on all these years, you don't know how much rots

under there. You can't put any weight on the roof itself. Has to be on the staging. Correct. So to recap, the whole project to do the tower originally is about a million dollars, you said. And so we don't really have the funding to do million-doll projects like this. So what you've done is you originally got the $100,000, did as much word to it.

You saw that the pointing that was previously done was done incorrectly, which caused more work, but you got that done up to about 30 ft. And so this portion of it, because of what is currently happening right now, we need this emergency funding to keep the tower from pretty much falling down on the east side, the north side, and the northwest corner. Um, and you thinking, you're thinking, you know, the

condition, you know, enough a little bit about the conditions out there. you've been working out there for a while that your approach would be roughly $185,000 and not the $165,000. That's a kind of synopsis of it and that's okay. All right. Thank you. What I'm just trying to figure out is we're going to go up 50 ft on the northeast side and repoint. That's the bulk of the work. So, but you have to do

the front too. Well, this emergency funding is only going to do this right now, right? But I think he's going to put those ties on the inside, too, to connect the brick and the stone. That's still part of that, too. Yeah, that's got to do that. That's first before you do the outside. Okay. Well, you don't see from the outside of brick brickmasonry units. You see the stone on the outside, but inside of brickmasonry

units. So, he's taking sections of those out, which is done as part of phase one.

He's putting additional or new stainless steel ties in to sort of tie back the stone to the backup wall. So that's all was all part of phase one. You'd be doing more of that. Yeah. Keep doing that up the up as you keep keep going up and then grouting it. Yeah. Then grout it and you know it's a lot of work.

Yeah. Well, I just want to make sure we get everything when somebody makes the motion. Uh well, you know, my feeling is that uh we should the committee was going to do its very best to to fund things and to write down Right.

But I am well aware that I am let me tell you I am well aware of that. You don't know. And my favorite story is that we had a mason work on this 20 odd years ago and he did something that looked terrible. Said it needed to be done. I watched him. He got sick. I went out and bought an edger and it was all low. And you can't tell mine from the stuff that was in

there a 100 years ago, but you can't tell his either. But we just That was easy. But there's other stuff that you don't know.

We were told we had no other problems and and here we are.

So, I just mentioned that to the committee that they really can't unless they have the ability to fly up there, know the future, and come up with an estimate. We we understand that. Okay.

J, did you have a question?

Does somebody want to make a motion?

Okay, go ahead. I I'll make a motion based on what I know. And again, I might not get this completely correct, and you can tell me to stop, but I would I would actually make a motion uh to go to the $185,000. And as part of that, um knowing that you've already worked on this project, you know what you're to expect. um that the the east side, the north side, and the northwest corner of

this um receive the funding as an emergency request. Um and so again, the same process of putting in uh the repointing, the masonry and the ties be part of this and that be completed up to the gutter on those uh in those areas. And we do understand that you might come across something that is a little bit uh unknown but because of your work your previous work you have a pretty good

understanding of what you're dealing with going forward. So that would be my motion. But I again that's above the 165 requested and I don't even know if I can even say that.

How much is that? I would just amend the motion to not include the language of up until the gutter line because perhaps in a perfect world they can do higher than the gutter line. Okay. Okay. Could you I didn't couldn't get it all but what did you say? Could you say it again? The motion. All right. I'll say the motion again and I'll Okay, we have two motions. That's what I I am I

amended a motion. It pass the gutter line. Oh, you're making an amendment.

Yeah, I I just wanted I just wanted to remove the language that limited it to the gutter line and height. There should be a second to your amendment. Then we can discuss your amendment. Yes, I I'll reiterate what the revised motion is if that's okay. But before I do that, I want to make sure that I have this correct with these uh gentlemen because I don't want to overextend something

that's not realistic. The gutter line is the minimum you think you could get to.

Do you think that's what you're trying to accomplish?

Yes. Okay. So what I'll do is when I say this um we'll use that as a minimum um level of height so that when people see this and we we go and inspect it we know that you're going up to that level and if you get higher than that then then so be it based on the conditions uh when you're working on this. But I can't touch the north side. The north side is out of the

question.

Not until these sides go up. Yeah. So, because we're actually what we're basically doing is building the foundation again for the for the stone.

So, so from the level that we walked out on, right? That's So, so that that section that we walked out on on the north side is where Paul saying take it up to up to that point up in that area.

Yeah. Yeah. like not the not to the gutter the gutter line on on the east side and and then the west corner the northwest corner. So you line across you you feel you feel comfortable enough getting to the the the gutter line on the east side of that and the gutter line to the north west side of that. I'm I'm I'm trying to make a motion that's fair to you and what again

we're not in this profession. So we don't want to tell you to be somewhere and there's no way you're going to be there and then you come back to us and say well we need another 20 ft or 15 ft.

And so that's and I understand what you're saying because your north facing side of this building there's no mason there's no mortar at all. So it's just rock on rock. It's stone on stone. And the reality of it is you would have to take those stones down and put up a different type of scaffolding which is about $300,000. And you you're not prepared to do that on this phase. You're going to

mason as much as far as you can go up.

You're going to put the ties in and that type of scenario and as far as you can go um the north side, that's what you'll you'll do with this $185,000. But you will you you feel comfortable the east side in the northwest corner you'll get up to the corner portion of that. I'll get up to the gut line. Yes. Okay. Fine. Does that sound fair? Just keep Okay. That's where I was going.

I don't do this for a living. Um Oh, and perhaps add in the maintenance of capital plan language. You got it. Okay.

I make a motion to approve the 185,000 and $1 $100. Is that correct?

I think it's revised to 185.

Okay. My motion is to approve the $185,000 which will contain the mortar, the ties, and the uh rebuild of the east side of the tower, the northwest corner. and as high as possible on the north side of the phase due because of the overabundant mortar that's not there. I also put in this as a state that the uh capital improvement project or report states what you're going to what your process is for f

future generations and also possible maintenance associated with f future generations so that the work that is being done will be um uh passed on to the next generation whoever inherits this project. Does that sound fair? It's much too long. Where did you stop? We have we have to put in all the work he's doing, right? After you the references you talked about the future generations and

so forth. Is that also part of your motion? That's the maintenance uh plan that we're asking them to have. Okay. So they have I just want to know just like Amen. It's not so just to be well just to be clear it's not like a fully developed master plan. This is perhaps like a bullet point list of what they should expect to do. I do have a fee this time around because I spent

quite a bit of time working with pass and and so um so I don't know where that stands with a 185 or that comes out of the 15. I don't doesn't matter to me but uh we could certainly put together bullet points for yeah it doesn't have to go into detail because in theory they'd be hiring for future work and they should go into the detail whoever it might be. Sounds good. We can work on

that. Sounds good. Thank you. Can I just repeat it?

Can you come to a microphone? Yes.

Because we should Can I use your microphone?

Okay. I just I just need to be clear on this that you're making a motion to approve emergency funding in the amount of 185,000 for work to be done on the east side, the northwest corner for repointing mortar and to place the ties in at a minimum to the gutter line as high as the north side to provide a maintenance and capital plan.

Yes. Can we have a second? Yes. Second to that. Yeah. Any discussion?

Okay. Roll call.

Michael Ferris. I vote yes. Alexander Silva, yes. John Bright, yes. James Hby, yes. Rick Mancini, yes. Mr. Oliver.

Kristen Canara. Oliver. Yes. Chris.

Chris Benedites. Yes. Joanne. Joanne Bentley. Yes. Okay. Motion passes. Thank you. We got to take this and vote in front of the city council. So, okay.

We'll let you know when that takes place. All right. Could you could you do you mind just walking uh pastor Rob through that process in terms of the lead time that's involved in that. So, in other words, we're not waiting till the fall. No, this will be okay.

Relatively quick. Uh Sandy, you'll put the appropriation in.

So, this will be what's going to happen tomorrow morning. I will draft a letter to be sent to the auditor's office to draft the appropriation order to send to the mayor so that he can send it down to the city council to be placed on their agenda. Um, it'll probably go to finance from finance. It'll go to the next city council meeting for them to vote on. So, the next city council meeting is

tomorrow night. it won't make it to that agenda. So, you're talking two weeks to get to finance and then from finance another two weeks until the city council approves it. As soon as the city council approves it, they'll send me a copy of the appropriation order. I will do a requisition that will produce a purchase order. Once I get that purchase order, you can start the job, but we will have

to um have you sign uh an award agreement again. Okay. Could Sorry.

Could could we potentially include a little note about that? Uh what we were trying to do last time about maybe having it on the agenda for both finance and the full council meeting so that way we don't wait two weeks just for that.

Um I'll make the request to the city weeks out of the Yes.

All right. Thank you.

That is it. Can I have a motion to uh adjourn? So move a second. Roll call.

Michael Michael Faras adjourned. Yes. Alexander Silva. Yes. John Grant. Yes. James Twinsby. Yes. Rick Mancini. Yes. Kristen Canara Oliver.

Yes. Chris Bites. Yes. Joey Bentley.

Yes. All right. Meeting adjourned. Thank you.