5.27.2025 Fall River School Committee - Policy Subcommittee

I'd like to call this meeting to order.

The policy subcommittee meeting today, Tuesday, May 27th, 2025. Pursuant to the open meeting law, any person may make an audio or video recording of this public meeting or may transmit the meeting through any medium.

Attendees are therefore advised that such recordings or transmissions are being made, whether perceived or unpersceived, by those present, and are deemed acknowledged and permissible. At this time, I'd like to say the pledge to the flag. Can I do a roll call? Oh, we get a roll call. I'm sorry. Roll call, Mr. Mr. Cory. I'm here. Miss Perledge the flag.

I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands. One nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all.

Thanks for coming, Mary. Appreciate it.

All right. So, uh, we don't need to take things, right? No.

Okay. Very good. Okay.

Um, next item on the agenda is item number two. No citizens input. There's no citizens input. Okay. Then we'll skip to item number.

Then we'll uh we'll go to item number three a discussion. Uh, we have a series of discussions to uh talk about today. And uh we'll start with item 3.1 which is discussion and vote to refer to administer medicines to students the administering of medicines to students policy JCL.

So this is the policy um that we've had regarding med administration and um the only changes that we have um to this policy is that I applied for med delegation um which basically allows unlicensed personnel to administer medications to what personic unlicensed licensed personnel yeah unlicensed unlicensed yeah so what that means is that we would delegate medication to um school personnel who are not

licensed. um after they've been um basically after they have been approved by the school nurse uh to administer the medications, what they have to do is um what's been mandated by the Mass Farm Public Health, which is watch a video and um then they have to um give a demonstration or the nurse would give them the medication that the student would have to take on like a field trip or other um wherever they're

going and then they would um show them how to give the medication to the student. Um so it's it's we've had this before. It's just that in the past um they haven't had to um do the video and they haven't um necessarily had to have like a certification process whereas now there's the certification process in place. Okay, Miss Pereira. So basic is I don't see wordage in here though like I

see this part highlighted. Is that the word change or basically it's the same thing. We're just using a certification process for those who are going to admin administer meds. It looks like it's the two paragraphs down from what's the highlighted what? Okay, perfect. The license. Okay. So that's the part that's changing. That highlighted part's always been in there. It's just this other part

is being added. Okay. Right. And you're the one the nurses or whoever the nurse is at the school, they're the ones that are signing off of the meds as they're handing it to the or they like they're getting specifically what they're taking on a field trip for example. Correct.

But they could also administer Tylenol in the classroom or would that still be something that would go to you? No. So this is just off school ground situation. Okay. That's all. Thank you.

Go ahead, Mrs. Das. Thank you, Mr.

Chair. First um first question is I have two policies that appear the same. Which one should I be looking at here? They both appear. The one that says revised 4524 is the most revised revised policy that we have today. I'm assuming it was revised uh last April. Right. So I think that the medication what you see highlighted medication is defined as both prescription medications and over

the counter. um that to me looks like language that was not in the policy that was approved in 2010.

And then there is another paragraph um from 2010 that begins delegations supervision and that looks like it was rewritten in this um it's these two that changed right all so they basically just putting training in and then putting the the policy thank you so so from what I understand from this so basically to administer medicine there's um already protocols in place But what we're doing here is just

adding extra safeguards such as a video and a certification um that would add to safety. My understanding is Would you be able to just offer some examples? Um can so in certain situations um even a simple procedure like applying um well this one is one that like in school like applying desetin to in like preschools uh to a student um you need to have delegation.

So if car um needs to apply desitin. We would have to have a doctor's order for that and we'd have to delegate that to them so that they could apply it. So it can happen in school.

Yeah. That's okay. That's a weird circumstance, but okay. But if we're going out on a field trip and there's a student that has an inhaler um so that um a nurse wouldn't have to go extra insulin or pen. Well, yeah, an insulin that would have to be a nurse, but something like an inhaler or um an oral medication, then the nurse could delegate that. So then our diabetic students, do they have a nurse

accompanying them on all their field trips? Okay. Yep. Our seizure medications, they all have nurses. So right now, this from what I understand, this can all happen, but you just they're not going through the certifications. They're not they're not receiving a video. No, we didn't have med delegation. Up until now, we didn't have med delegation. a nurse was not able to delegate medication. Um, nurses

were going to all field trips.

So, as of right now, I applied for med delegation. We did have med delegation uh several years ago and that was discontinued.

Why was it discontinued? Um, the there was a fee that was uh put into place to apply for delegation. So the supervisor that was there that was here before me decided that she wasn't going to do it due to the cost. Um so she just stopped doing it and because the number of field trips keep increasing and um the number of students with chronic medical conditions where a nurse doesn't

necessarily I feel need to go on a field trip um can whose stable and a medication can't be delegated um I applied and and there no longer is a fee um I decided to apply for delegation.

Okay. I guess as um and this is my last comment then I'll I'll pass on Mr.

Chair. I guess the issue I see here I have no issue referring to the full committee as a first read. However, I'm not sure at this time if I'll support it. I'd like to see some information on other districts that might have a similar policy and see um if there have been any issues going forward because I could see this as um giving delegating this authority and again understanding going through certification process

which I appreciate. However, there's always um room for some issues go wrong and there's a safety issue there with our students. So um I I'll yield. um pass the floor, but I'll make a motion to refer as a first read so we have time to um digest this. Second. Okay. Um we can we could forward that motion, but I haven't even had a chance to question yet. Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead. So, so um

Miss Christa, so as far as delegating, um are there going to be handpicked people like a a special parah that works with a special student at the school? It won't just be any par. It it would be designated people at work with these kids that have these chronic conditions.

And on a field trip, would it be a designated chaperone? It would be one designate. It wouldn't be any other chaperones on the trip. Right. Right.

and that and that designate would be near that student all day or all throughout the field trip so that if there were any occurrences the occurrence could be covered with the delegated medication.

That's true. And also we have to get before we can even delegate uh to uh any school staff, we have to get parental permission for delegation and the parent has to know who the person is that's going to um administer the medication.

So um we have to parental permission.

The parent has to know who the person is that is going to delegate. So there's really no room for um you know for example you know if you're telling the parent that Johnny is going to give the medication then it has to be you know or John Smith is going to give the medication then he's the person who's going to give the medication. So the parent is aware who's going to give

the medication and um that's you know and then we get permission from the person um you know the staff member and that staff member has had to have gone through the process to be certified um and the person is handpicked and these are all approved policies by the department of public health. They are all approved. They're all approved.

Otherwise we could never take this step forward. we we can do this because this is an approved policy from Department of Public Health and and for us it's going to help to make um keeping our kids safer actually in a more efficient way because they'll be it'll be delegated uh to a person who's trained. Is that correct? That is correct. Yep. And they've been in place for for a very

long time. It's just that we as a district haven't had it for a few years.

Um, yeah, I'm going back to my own experience and I remember, you know, I remember those things happening and then the person having to be administered certain medication at a certain time and all of that. I remember all of that and it was always covered, but I think this helps to make uh the whole process a little bit more efficient for you and and a little bit more uh less labor

intensive so we can keep our nurses in the school buildings. Is that correct?

That is correct. Yeah. Yes. Thank you.

So with with that motion, Mr. Das, I just wonder if we need to table it because it's already we're not tableing it. I know, Mr.

for a first read. I mean, I think that that was and um and I'm I'm personally going to stick with that motion for two reasons. One, I don't believe there's any um rush to implement this policy because by the time it goes on the June agenda, um this is something that would be implemented going next year. Like if if we waited Well, because we'll be going to full committee June 9th and then we

really only have a couple of weeks of Yeah. So So right. So essentially it takes effect in September if we pass it through a first read and it'll go to a final read. It would it would still be passed through September if the committee voted to pass. The the one question that I would have and I don't have the information in front of me is um we do have summer programs and

sometimes those summer programs take um trips and I do know that um finding nurses for summer programming is difficult and it has been a juggle in the past when we have a summer program and a group leaves that summer program for a trip for the day. Um finding nurse coverage in the summer, one to stay in the program, one to go on a trip. So that might be a consideration. Um do you

how long does it take to train them?

Would you have time to do that for delegation? For in other words, for the summer, how long would it take for Yeah, it doesn't take long at all. Um and actually um I've already spoken with uh Mr. Farious about potentially going to their PD and discussing the training.

Yeah. If if it gets passed by the policy subcommittee. Miss Cabraw, is it this is referred as a first read, the committee has the authority to um pass the raw readings that has been done before. Am I correct? Yes, it has. That would just need to be made at the motion when it's at the full committee. Okay. So I think one way or another I think in general going forward with policies and I know

it's been brought up by another member of the committee they should be referred as first reads regardless because the committee does have the ability at the full at the full session to as M cab just said um wave that first reading and pass through all readings. I have one question on the over the counter counter and your argument that you just made with the authorization um makes me want

to to vote for it. So, I'm happy it was mentioned. I guess um one question on parental authorization and I'd like to see this in the policy. Would this be written authorization or or would it be verbal?

It's written authorization. Okay. I think that's something that should be just um with maybe one word and we can do this at the full committee. mention the word uh written that's in there.

Um and I feel more more comfortable doing so. But again um I appreciate the u explanation. Again, I'd love to see um some data from other communities. Maybe if a superintendent through um the superintendent association or we can find out some more information to make sure there hasn't been any issues in other communities that have this policy.

I'd love to see that. But other than that, I do appreciate the So, I I don't think you need we need her to be doing that research. We can do it on our own. Um, and I will tell you this is not anything that's odd. This is common in all schools. It's odd that we don't have it. I'm surprised we don't have it. Parents have to fill out a form, get doctor's permission plus a

doctor's order, which is separate from that. And there's a whole process in which they give meds. residential schools. The nurse barely ever gives I mean not barely ever. She'll do her nines or threes, whatever. But during the day, it's staff who's giving meds.

This isn't brain surgery. This is someone who is already an educator in our school department who's going to watch a video and be cognizant of how to administer a Tylenol or whatever. They maybe it's an antibiotic because the kids on antibiotics and they have to go on a field trip and they need it during the day. Uh something like that.

I don't I don't think it particularly requires a a re a second read, but that's that's at the will of the committee. Um, but to me, this policy makes complete sense. And if you call any school or look at any residential facility and public school, I I would dare you to find one that doesn't have this policy. Does this policy apply to shaper rooms? Like, so no, it'll just be are not allowed to administer

medication. It would have to be someone who's employed here that sat down, watched the video, the nurse watched how they handled the meds, watched that they knew what they were giving. And then if you're going on a field trip, I'm in a par or I'm a teacher. I go to the nurse's station. Hey, I'm taking Bobby.

We're going to the Museum of Science.

She gives me a nice little packet with everything labeled on it, right? Bobby's name, all that jazz. I take it. I keep it somewhere very safe. I'm probably going to be with Bobby the whole time so I can give him that medicine. It's not a big deal. It's something that's very simple and just makes sense. And in order to even be eligible to get that delegation, um, you have to put an

application to the uh, state department of public health. They have to look at your your criminal record, right? Like any kind of background check. No, no.

They have to look at your um overall enrollment. They have to look at your staffing. Oh, to even get it. Make sure that you have adequate nursing staff uh, in order to be able to um, be eligible. delegation that you can um provide adequate education to the staff um when they um can delegate. So there's a whole process in place just to be able to even get delegation. Yeah, I

don't want to belver the point. Again, I most likely will support this policy as well. Just something that I think should just be in the back burner. I think something we should look at. But again, I appreciate all the great points that you made and I'll likely support this as well. So I I don't um think I'm ready to vote if I have another question. As far as EpiPens are concerned, did that fall

into this category as well? Oh, we have approval. We've had ep delegation um for the whole, you know, prior to this.

EpiPen delegation is something we've had um for as long as I can. Yeah, this is this is this follows suit to that. I've been around this before, so I know I know that this works very well, and I'm glad to see this little policy amendment right now for it. Um, I still question the need for a second read. I I I I like it right now. I would just like to make

a motion to refer to full committee right away. That's where I'm at. So, can I put that in the form of a motion?

There's a motion on the table already.

Okay. You want to read it? It's to refer to full committee as a first read. Roll call.

Well, once we get to committee, can we we can get to committee and change it?

Correct. So, we can get So, really we can so we can wait that night. Correct.

that evening if the committee or someone chooses to wave all readings to approve and wave all readings then they can make that motion at that. Okay. I mean I know I will at that time because just makes sense. Mr. D. Yes. Mr. C. Yeah. Miss Pereira. Yes.

Item number three-2. Discussion a vote to refer headlights policy.

Mr. Chair. So, yes, it's part of this one. Okay. I'd like to invite um the citizen in the audience who proposed this policy and there's backup in here to come forward and explain her position if she wishes to. Yes. Any objection?

Not at all. Please welcome yourself comfortable. Yes.

Okay. There.

Um, I just wanted to uh read this. I want to say um good evening u members of the sub community. Uh my name is Taylor Perry and I'm here today to advocate on behalf of the scholars, staff, and families of River Public Schools. I respectfully ask for your support in revising the district current policy on headlace to pro to better protect our students health, dignity, and access education. After conduct conducting uh

research and reviewing headlines policies across the Massachusetts public schools district, I believe it is fair and necessary to consider updating our own practices to reflect best standards and public health guidance. My proposal includes the following key points.

Identifying an initial action. If a student is shown symptoms of lice infestation, they would be referred to the school nurse for evaluation. If there are live lice found, the student should be sent home for treatment. I support the no net policy recommended by the CDC and the American Academy of Pediatrics which allows students to remain in school if there's only knits are present as knits are not

contagious to come back into school upon returning to school. The student should be accomp with a parent or a guardian and should not ride the school bus until cleared. The school n must confirm that there is no live lice present before a child returns to class. Ongoing monitoring periodically followup checkups should be conducted at the school nurse to ensure that students have been haven't been

reinfestated. Um if lives are found again, the students should be sent home for retreatment. Communications with families. It is important that school nurse notify not only the family that are infected but the students who are not infected. Guardians of those students may have been exposed. This enables families to be vigilant. Um perform regular checks at home and respond promptly with treatment. Support the

family in need. For families who may fa uh face financial barriers to purchase uh life treatment, I propose that the school maintain a supply of treatment kits to ensure that all students have equal opportunities to receive care and stay in school. Policy awareness. I also recommending update the criteria for when to stay home to include headlight infestation especially when live lice

are present. Furthermore, any changes to the headlights policy should be communicated to families not only through parent square but also through notices being sent home requiring a signature acknowledgement from the parents or guardian to confirm that they receive and understand. In closing, I respect respectfully request that the subcommittee considers and approves their revision of headlights policy for

Fall River Public Schools. These changes are intended to promote student health, reduce unnecessary absence, and foster stronger communication and partnerships between schools and family. Thank you for your time and your commitment to the well-being of our scholars. Mr. Chair, Mr. Das, thank you. Um, and thank you, Miss Perry, for um for advocating for this policy and um for sharing your

experiences with the committee. It's um something that we should definitely be taking a look at today. I'm glad we are.

I'm superintendent, currently right now, if a student has headlights, do we expect them to come to school?

So we right now we do not send students home for the presence of headless and we do expect that people that when when we inform parents that they will be treated but we don't have a specific policy. So our policy is around communicable diseases we do not have a headless policy. We have practices in place which are more focused on um making parents aware um encouraging the treatment, supporting

the treatment, but we do not require students to stay out of school. There's a piece in our practice that depends on the discretion of the nurse. um and that's consistent with recommendations from Department of Public Health um in in larger bodies but not um you know they don't recommend a headlace policy that says you can't come to school um if if we know of the presence of lice. Miss

Perry, if I may ask and feel free if um if you don't want if you don't want to share I'm asking something that's too personal. Was there um a situation? You brought this because of a specific reason. Am I correct? Yes. I'm It's not just for my daughter's sake. She ended up catching it, by the way. And um I taken care of three stepchildren myself, three daughters, stepdaughters. And she

kept on we kept on cleaning her head. We had to do, you know, the laundry, stuffed animals to not only do one child has to do it, the next child has to do it. The whole house has to do it. And we all know that, yeah, you kill the live bugs, but you also have nymphs that's left. And when that hatches, you get reinfestated. So, it's just an on vicious cycle. I just don't understand.

Um, I understand that it is a CDC recommendation. It's only a recommendation is what I'm it's only a recommendation. It there's nothing that states that there is a law that says they can stay in school, nor is there a law for them to stay out of school.

However, uh Massachusetts Department of Education does not mandate specific headlace policy, but it's the district who's responsible for that policy. So, um I'm not asking for much. I'm just saying in common sense if a child is infested, just like you know, people have coughs, we wear masks, right? Um and it's not so much keeping them home or telling them you can't go to school.

No, it's just as simple of, okay, honey, you know, we got the situation. Let's fix it together. Let's fix it. Get the treatment done and then come back the next day. You know, it's not about singling out children because I don't know, everybody in this room must have some time of weather. I used to get it all the time because kids in school were constantly. It's just we're putting children in there just to sit in the

cycle and cycle. Why? Because of attendance. Yes, attendance is very important. I'm all for that. However, our students should be safe to sit in a classroom and not worry about them coming home and then then their friends have activities. They go to activities, then it goes to this one and that one and it's just nonsense. It's complete nonsense. You get a you get a a fever, you get sent home. You know, you throw

up, you get sent home. All I'm saying if you have something that is active and is you know, commutable that they should just go home for treatment. And superintendent, so if a student who um retracts headlights goes home and they receive a um a note from a doctor, are they going to be held accountable to any attendance policy?

So our okay I many um children do not go to the doctor for I was just going to say so that I never done so I guess I'm a little experience they're not necessarily going to a doctor we would never require a doctor's note for the purposes of of our attendance practices and really what is required um or expected of us from the state in term of chronic absenteeism like the state doesn't acknowledge doctors notes say

and say, "Oh, a student was absent 20 times, but five days of it. That student had a doctor's note. Therefore, they weren't chronically absent." They literally look at the number of absences. They don't It doesn't matter why the student was absent. They could have been hospitalized for 20 days. The student is chronically absent. When we talk about our policies around attendance and when we take doctor's

notes, when we don't take doctor's notes, that really has a lot more to do with um attendance at the high school at the secondary level when we're talking about um credit for courses being attached to attendance and things like that. A D4 policy. Those aside, if a student is in elementary school and they're absent um for x number of days, we're not looking we're looking for doctor's notes because

we want to make sure students have sought medical care or that we're or in that there is, you know, we want parents to be attentive to the attendance piece and and make and make sure they're doing everything they can to get students into school. But I don't know in in these cases like waving attendance uh based on or waving an absence um based on a doctor's note isn't isn't so applicable.

No, I I understand that. Thank you for explaining that. But I guess um the issue, correct me if I'm wrong, the issue that we have here, what you're advocating for and you're not advocating willy-nilly. You're you're quoting um policies from um the town of Nic. You're quoting policies from Bridgewater Rainham. And you're what I believe you what you're looking for is a policy where if a student attract retracts

headlights they are required to go home and get treatment. That's just for treatment. Yep. Yep. It's something I support as one member. I'm going to yield the floor to hear from my other members or if um director of nursing has anything to add. However, I think this is something as a committee that we should pursue for a policy and I'll yield at that for now. Miss P. I'm confused because you had said she had

showed you Bridgewater Ringham's policy.

Yes, it's But in there it indicates that they don't exclude for knits or lace.

That's not what I'm asking for. Oh, what you ask? Yeah, what I'm asking for is yes, a child can come back if they have knits. It's not spread. No, no, no. But I'm saying right here it says their policy says they've discontinued based on studies. They've discontinued whole classroom screenings because they realize it's not effective. Exclusion for NIPS or life lice and notification of others except for parents or

guardians of the person with headlights.

Are you quoting NIC or Bridgewater? I'm quoting Bridgewater. That's what you just said. Bridgewater. How about I don't have Natics. And they use some of the, you know, same Bridgewater seems a little closer to where we are versus NIC, I would think. Right. Population and size and all that. Yeah. Taton is the same as ours, right? I believe also incredible community similar Dartmouth

again I'm trying to find I'm trying to find similarities to policies that are similar to our school in terms of population that we serve in terms of kiddos um that would be um see even native public schools actually says native public school nurses shall not conduct whole classroom screenings for lights shall not exclude students and or staff from school for knits or live or send out broad notification of

headlights and infestations to the school community. Yeah, I'm not really sure what school does that. Um, there's many reasons that I would refer this, you know, back to um our nursing staff. Um, there is there is a quote unquote factory associated with headlights. A lot of kids get it. It's something that that does happen. It's not fun. It's not exciting. It is extremely timeconuming. You do have to

wash the sheets and the stuffed animals and you have to treat sometimes more than once. This is true. I don't want it really though honestly to be compared to things like fevers and vomiting cuz those could be c like serious medical conditions. If you have a kid with a fever that has strep throat that's untreated that's a serious thing. You you know you have a kid who has a fever

and develops a seizure from it. That's a serious thing. Head lace is annoying and it's icky and it's a pain in the butt, but it's not a serious thing. It doesn't cause long-term diseases or healthc care problems. And that's why the CDC has the recommendations. It does. And I believe that maybe there are schools somewhere that I don't know. You could have to look and find it. I don't I don't know

where those schools are, but they could be out there. Um, however, it could be that those schools operate with a different population. If we have a child who is in second grade or third grade and is going to stay back simply because on top of the fact they have transportation issues and and the amount of barriers they have getting to school.

No, on top of that they're getting sent home um you know because they have life.

So I don't know. Do I think we need a policy? Yeah, just cuz it makes sense to have a policy especially for parents to be able to and I just I know we have procedures so but it is different right?

So, I mean, I think making a policy makes sense to me, right? Parents have something they can look at, they can read, something we can refer to, but I would suggest that that policy, you know, comes from our nurse, our head nurse, and then we can review it and and approve it and if we have problems with it or whatever at that time or we or our colleagues think something should be

changed or different, we can address it at that time. Right now, I feel the only question we have in front of us is should we have a policy? Because I don't think we should be writing it necessarily. I think we should be approving it because we don't have the medical degrees. I mean, I do, but we don't, right? So, let the person with the nursing degree write the policy and

then we can read it and kind of go from there. Is that what this is to refer to write a policy? Must you want to weigh in? I think I mean for me it's fine if you want a policy. Um, most places, you know, that have policies basically their policy says what my procedure says.

Yeah. Um, and that's fine. I will gladly write a policy and just mimic what the procedure says, and I think that that's fine. Could you give me any any kind of semblance uh of how many how many headlights? You don't have to give me specifics, just generalization. Was it a chronic issue uh in this past school year? No.

And Miss Perry Henry Lord is one of the top one. My daughter sat there and told me that one of the students had pulled out a lice and threw it in the trash. I had another parent tell me that there was so and so who had ticks in their hair and that's why they were sitting by themselves. I mean, you guys got to I understand you're looking at the CDC. I

understand that. But it So that's okay.

We can just have headlights on these kids. I have all these parents. I don't think headlights is okay. I don't think anybody is. Oh, I'm just saying it's just frustration. I'm sorry. I have all these people, parents. I There was this uh single father. He broke my heart.

It's a single father with three daughters. Yes. To have that money and for what? We spend all that money and then we go to school and they reatch it just because it's life. I don't understand. I understand it's not a deadly disease. I get that and thank God. But you you you got to we got to work as a a community. We we care about these kids. Yeah. There are so many

restrictions on us as a school system.

We also have a petition because of the Department of Education and there's so many regulations that we have we we abide by and operate under. It's crazy, you know. So, we're just trying to navigate this issue right now. It's not a it's not a cut and dry issue. Yeah.

We're just navigating. And I have to and I have to tell you that I don't think there's a nurse in this district that if she saw an infestation of headlights in a child's head would not call that parent and express to that parent that she would like that child picked up and sent home and have that treatment started.

The the policy basically says that if a child has life life, we're not going to send them home. And sure, if we see one or two, we may send that child back to class. But if if a child's an infestation versus seeing one or two, there's a significant difference. Not necessarily. Because if you think about it, if you have one, how many of those headlight eggs like? How many does a head lace

lay? One live bug, how much? How many eggs? I have no So if you go from one egg, one bug is all you need to for it to be an infestation cuz they lay eggs and then it just keeps coming and coming. So, I understand what you're saying, but it's still one is too many.

You know, we're trying to not, you know, keep doing this and doing this, you know. I mean, Henry Lord had fights where parents had to get cops. I have another lady who used to work at at the city of Florida school department and said that if she had disclosed information she would be fired like you know petition. Okay. Can I I have to I have to say we can't disclose personal

information. I also have to say parents who are getting into fist fights over the headlights I have concern for those parents not the headlights. I'm sorry.

Yeah I understand. But they need some therapy. Yeah. But I'm saying okay but here's the thing about headlights. I understand if there's one or two on a kid's head. Do they hop from one head to the other? No they don't. So, if I have one or two headlights in my head, unless I go and hug her and put my head near her, it's not going to hop over. That's the logic of saying it's okay to bring

the kid back to school. The teacher's going to know. What about the six-year-olds that they hug? I got tons of pictures of kids hugging and having a look. Absolutely. There's only so much a teacher can do to navigate that situation, which in general they try to navigate. I don't think we're allowing kids to hug and touch each other all day. I read the I read at preschool.

I'll tell you, I read at a pre couple of preschool classes. They all had to sit down in a nice row and even when I was getting up to leave, they weren't allowed to hug me. We did high fives and dabs. So, I don't think we're encouraging our kids to hug each other and sit on each other. Now, does it happen on a playground or something? Of course. But that's where education comes

in with your children. Hey, do me a favor. When you're at school, you don't put somebody else's hat on. You don't put somebody else's jacket on. You don't put your head near somebody else.

Education can help prevent this. But there is no way that I am going to support sending kids home because they have two bugs in their hair when we might have a parent who then loses their job because they have to get out of work for the millionth time to come pick up a child. We have a child who could be chronically absent, needs to be in a particular class for learning, but we

send them home because they have one license in their hair, which is not going to make a difference in their life, overall life. It's just not. So I can't just take this little group of kids and put them before this group of kids. This is a policy that is vindict.

It's pretty much across the state. This isn't like Fall River doing this. I've been a school nurse for many years.

Always the same policy. And you're right. If you see somebody who's infested, different story. You call mom.

Hey, can you come in here because your kid's scratching? It's also if it's symptomatic because if it's symptomatic now, maybe the child shouldn't be there because are they focusing on what they're learning if they're doing this or that? That is very different than having knits or a couple of life lice.

If that's the case, then I bet you our nursing staff would call the parent and say, "Listen, your son's been down here, he keeps scratching his head, you need to stop this treatment now. You're going to have to pick them up." Is that fair to say? So, that's that's kind of what happens. The reason I think it needs to be in a policy is because when we keep it wishy-washy, you have people who

think maybe you're going to leave a kid there with a bowl of, you know, a headlight. As far as kids with tick infestations, if a teacher finds a tick on a kid, that kid should be sent to the nursing station of the tick remove. And if we're hearing stories from kids that that's not happening, I kind of want to hear it from somebody else. So maybe that should be a conversation with the

with the teacher like, "Did this happen?" or the principal because kids talk a lot. They tell stories. It could have been a tick from last weekend, but all of a sudden it develops into this happened today. Not saying it's not true that the child who said it didn't say it with the intention of being true. What I'm saying is we sit here and we take medical information from playground kid

talk. That's a little scary to me. So, I do think we need a policy for the simple fact that we should have one. Um, but I would support the exact procedures we have in here. And I mean, you write the policy and we have a whole committee.

So, everybody's allowed to disagree and they can make their determination and maybe make some amendments or whatever at that time. But I would say the sooner the better you write something in writing to get it to us so that we can have whatever is in place that's needed for, you know, September. By the time by the time an infestation is found, they've had that light they've had lice in their hair for about a month.

So, what we try to do is to try to educate parents and if you're checking your child's head regularly. Hopefully, the idea is that it's, you know, if you check them, you're not letting that get to that point where there's an infestation. Well, we don't have control of No, we don't.

That's the thing.

Um, I would invite you to show up to the meeting that this is going to be on the agenda. So, we'll forward this to the uh larger committee and and and you can do citizens input and come to the podium and and read your statement in front of the full committee and then we'll take we'll take a vote at that time. you know, instead of us determining this factor. I know I I sense your concern. I

I respect your concern greatly. Um, and I I'm not an expert in this, so I I don't feel like I should be the one to say yes or no in any way. Let's let's weigh it out. But I really appreciate you showing up here today, stating this very clearly, and was courageous on your part. It's not an easy subject. And uh then we'll we'll discuss it. Mr. Guys,

thank you. And I just want to add just a few points. Um, last points, one question for you, um, Miss Perry, with the information that you provided. Um, is there any I I don't see any issue if you could provide that to the clerks of the full committee that hear petitions and complaints for parents? I actually agree. Thank you. Um, that's our clerk right there. I appreciate. So, um, just

going again through the policies, I I respectfully disagree that, um, the rest of the state has the same policies as us. Um, looking at Stoen, Stoton has a policy where if a student children found with live headlights or children with NITs who have had no recent treatment will be dismissed to parents, guardians for treatment. Just point of clarification, I didn't say the whole state. If you're referring to me, sir, I

said areas I said areas like I was the only one who spoke on it. I said areas like Fall River, your Taton, your New Bedford, your Bridgewater. That's what I was referring to.

Just I don't know who said I want to make the reason why I just clarify uh Dartmouth daycare. They don't allow that. Yeah, Dartmouth daycare. But again, that's not comparable to affordable. And and if you look at um the town of I'm sorry. What's the difference between I'm saying I'm talking about gateway communities, the population we serve, the amount of people we have compared to the amount of

staff, a lot of different things. The the parents that we have that our parents sometimes work two, three jobs and are in communities where you have a mom that's able to do this or that.

That's what I'm referring to. We have kids that sometimes just need a little more help than other communities. That's what I And just going back to the town of Hanover um for attendance at schools, how students may be required to stay home as a public health measure if they have and going down to where it was circled active untreated headlights infestation. I think this is something that just promotes

um sa health safety and health of our students. my my colleague did make a good point as to whether we're going to send a kid home if um there's no one to pick them up because I mean if there's no parent there is able to pick them up. So I think it should be optional for the parent and the student I think that's where it comes in. I that's what I support as one member. If

a student has headlights and their parent wants them to come home to get treated, they should be able to do so without any penalty, without looking at the numbers of attendance. That shouldn't matter. The numbers don't matter. The student safety comes first before that. So, wherever this gets referred, just know that I'll be supporting that. Um, again, we're we're a committee of um seven, so we need

board votes for majority. That's my vote. So, we'll um go from there.

However, just so you know, the school committee can change the policies to make it so as to what I just said, if a student has um the the headlights, they they are allowed to go home. We do have that ability under state law to do so.

Just so clear. M Miss Gust, if if there's a a case that happens in the school and they're sent to the nurse's office, um what can the nurse do to remediate that case on the spot? Can they do they get rid of the head lice or is is it a treatment that kills the head lice? What is it? No. Um the nurse will call the parent, let them know that they

found lice and um they will let um explain to the parent what needs to be done, which usually is, you know, that night, give give them a treatment. Oh, so it's not done in school. No, the treatment isn't done in school, right?

So the parent will go to the pharmacy, buy the product, do the treatment. Even more important than the treatment is combing, and they have to continue to comb the hair. I'm getting itchy.

We we we we don't have a a solid policy in place as of now. No, we don't have a policy. So, we're going to have to write a policy before it can get referred to the committee. Is that is that so?

Right. So, I think that um what Miss Gustav was saying is that we can commit our current practice and procedures, write it in the form of a policy. Yes.

Um so that the policy reflects what we do and offer that as a first offer that as a first. Would you be able to do that by the June meeting? Yes. Okay. I can do that. Okay. So, all right. So then we can just refer this because I I do I do have I do have greater concerns even through all all the discussion that some parents do not follow through as they need to because

I've I've even worked on cases like that myself. Um, so those are my that's my biggest concern. And so I just wonder if there's some active wording in the policy, even though the policy has to be very sensitively constructed, uh, as sensitive as we could be about it. if we could maybe apply some pressure to parents to maybe really follow through. That's what I'm concerned about because I know some

parents just do not. That's my largest concern. And with that, I yield. And we do have the parents return with the child to make sure that there is follow through on the parents part so that we send them home. Parents are could that be in the policy as such? I believe it's in the procedure. So that they come in and we make sure that there is um you know that the parents are pursuing um

you know that they're doing the you know what needs to be done and even if it's not 100% better that even if it's 70% better and then they come back the following day and you know that we see progress being made because sometimes it takes a while depending on hair texture depending on whether the parents have you know 20 minutes the night before an hour the night before and that's where you know we we play an

active role and we work with the parents and we try to be partners in the you know the process. So Miss Caball what do I I put into a motion that we write our current procedures into a form of a policy. I think we can just refer this and she's going to bring a policy we do that refer to full committee as a first read as a first read second. Okay. Yes.

Want to take a vote? Sure. Mr. D. Yes.

Mr. Cory. Yep. M Per. Yes.

Thank you, Miss Perry. Thank you. And I appreciate you guys. Really appreciate you coming by and helping us to become more aware of this situation. Thank you very much. Thank you for questions. What does that mean?

We're referring questions for questions.

questions in regard to certification for all staff in regards to CPR, first aid and AED treatment.

There are presentations by the administration. Thank you. Once again, I don't understand what what this what this means discussion and vote to refer questions. Well, there were questions at a special meeting. I believe it was the March 18th meeting. special meeting. Um it's actually vice chair um Laravey um questions. Um I believe it was Mr.

Fitzgerald. Yeah. If they if staff if all staff or if any staff if they were required to have certain certifications for um CPR or first aid or AED or anything like that. Um and then a motion was made for this to be vetted to go to policy and that's why it's here. Okay. So um I mean maybe the word language should have been probably worded differently but I think it would

be more of like should there be a policy. So who knows the answer to this question Mr. Fitzgerald who's not here or would this be something you're aware of? Do you know superintendent? I so I think I was talking um you know after seeing the stuff yeah in in talking with um M cabal because I think there was some confusion I'll say even on my end in terms of where this um where this was

coming from but then realized that it has to do with questions that came up at uh at a meeting during the budget process where I think maybe out of curiosity someone said well you know how many people are are certified like is Everybody does everybody get certified in terms of you know AED CPR? I think everybody should be and then I think it just got referred to subcommittee. So I

think that um you know one of the things I maybe we would want to discuss is really around what does make sense in terms of um who is currently certified CPR first aid AED and then is it maybe the you know the will of the committee to have more people or in specific roles or whatever it is. So right now as part of our you know mandatory training at the beginning of the year these things

you know aren't necessarily they're not part of mandatory training you know across all positions or anything. So it's like are there specific roles that people fill where you say like yeah we think all what would it cost us to train everyone that is employed that I don't know do you have I mean CPR first aid it's all pretty much one class. Yeah.

So, how much would it cost to if we trained everybody? I wonder. Well, it could be done on a professional development day. But when we say everybody, it's a few thousand people because I don't know.

It's like, well, give me a list and I'll tell you who's going to have a heart attack around who. We don't know, right?

So, I would think everybody who's in our building should know how to perform CPR if somebody drops or should know how to use an AED, which is very simple if if something happens, you know what I mean?

Um, I'm curious as to what the cost. I'm not saying we should require it if we can't afford it, but in my perfect world right now CPR is so easy for lay people.

It could be done online too, right? We could they could do it online. They could I don't know what the cost would be, but I think anybody and there's even I mean there's like the lay person one which is not even, right? Which is like two minute. It's it's easy easy. So just to give people a little bit of a of everybody that sense of when an emergency happens if they have a little

training I think you feel a little more confident even if you've forgotten a little bit. Do you know what I mean to at least react at least nobody to yell for an AED and I know after that meeting I asked um John he says all security get in the building. I didn't realize and um the gentleman from Witson said all of the cafeteria most of the cafeteria workers are trained. So more people were

trained than I realized. I would think for sure all cafeterias should be trained CPR because of choking. Oops.

Right. Because of choking. Right. So security nutrition. Security nutrition for sure. Yeah. I'd like to see again everybody, but again it's a cost thing, you know. I don't know what it I don't know if it's a cost. Yeah. I do think there are some things we can do. You know, as I said, when we talk about when we do our mandatory training and we have that mandatory training suite, the training around Epipens is included

there. And I do wonder if we could um we can look into the cost of kind of additional like video segments that we could purchase to be included in that around CPR around are any of our nurses CPR uh teacher certified? Yes. So could they would be the ones teaching the CPR that would be more cost effective? What do they teach it through Red Cross or Red Cross?

So that may be more cost effective if the if they trained. You still have to pay the Red Cross for the and we also we have EMS that does clinics and they said that they I talked to they do it too.

Yeah. She said she would she could look into doing it also. So I could go ahead guys. Quick just quick question. I support this. Um, is this something that would even need a policy or is this something that you think would honestly this discussion would even be more appropriate for facilities and operations subcommittee or um instructional?

It's tricky because it's not I think when we think about getting the maximum number of people trained, it wouldn't belong in any particular I think one thing that we could do is I could do some research and then uh maybe part of my superintendent update on June 9th. I could just offer the lay of the land and where we are in terms of pursuing some of these things. I think that might be

the way to go and then we could, you know, bring forth if it if it's going to be something that costs, you know, in excess of uh you $25,000, then, you know, we could we would come back to the committee and then otherwise it would just be an update on like you guys, you know, had some great suggestions and now we're going to form and I think we want a list

of like who is right certified now.

Okay. Currently, I have I have a list. I I did it for the um medical emergency response. Are they separated based on department? So like if I look at that list, will I know how many people are nutrition and how many are whatever? I have them by schools, but I able to break them up. Okay. Gotcha. Okay. I'm proud to say that one of our own from Fall River really spearheaded the AED

movement in our schools, and that was Michaela Gagna. Michaela Gagney after she became Miss Fall River and then Miss Massachusetts. because Michaela suffered a life-threatening heart issue when she was a senior at Dery High School and um lived with a pacemaker. Now she's pacemaker free, but uh as part of her uh mission uh for being Miss Massachusetts, she toured and spoke all over the

country on behalf of heart health and she instituted the AED movement in all of our schools. and all of our schools are well equipped with AED monitors and I'm I'm really proud that she took that up and if I'm sure that she would be happy to lend her expertise in any way if we ever needed it in any way, you know, shape or form. You can just let me know. I can get in contact with her

immediately. But why don't you just do what you said you were going to do and and we'll move from there. That gives us good direction. this I was going to um superintendent said that she was just going to um bring the item up at the next meeting as an update. I mean I was I was actually going to make a motion to grant relief to withdraw. Second.

Does that make sense madam superintendent? Yeah, I think it does.

Thank you. Okay, there's the motion.

Miss Mr. D. Yes. Mr. Cory. Yep. Mr. Yes.

Thank you. All right.

Mary, I think you're all set. Thank you.

You want to hang out? Thank you.

All right. All right. Thank you for everything and thanks for all the hard work I do.

Item 34 discussion vote to refer development and dissemination of procedures policy.

Um just a point of clarification. This was an item I believe the motion was by Mr. Aguar to refer us back to policy. So okay so I think what you have an um you are two copies one um kind of this clean copy which is current policy a combination of CHA and CHC and then there's a colorcoded one um where the first um three paragraphs that are highlighted in yellow remain the same.

there is um the the fourth paragraph you see the language is um struck out and um and then the last I don't know why it's in a different color blue um remain so it's just striking a paragraph of the policy that says it will be the responsibility of the superintendent to see that procedures developed to implement the committee policies and admitted the school district are appropriately coded and included as

procedures in the school committee's um policy manual. And so this was a recommended update by MASC and I think that's how it was brought to the committee. Yeah. So it's just that that change right there, right? Motion to refer.

Second, Mr. Das. Yes. Um not going to support the motion to refer um for um two reasons. one I've gone on the record prior to state that I don't um personally as one member agree with the um policy recommendations of the MASC.

So for that reason one and two I I just don't see the what what I don't even understand what MASC's reasoning was for removing this portion of the policy and I I don't think would even support removing the language. I I think it's um precedent in um regulations and in just in law that the superintendent is supposed to um see that the procedures are that are developed by the committee

and the policies of the school system are followed and I think that's what the language um is going to here. Yeah. So I think it to me when I read this um it's the part about um that the policies uh that basically procedures get coded and are included as procedures in the school committee's policy manual. If you look at our policy manual, we don't have the procedures in our policy manual. That

that isn't actually how our policy manual is um is put together. We have all of the policies. We don't have a policy and then the procedures that go along with it and then a policy and all the procedures. And I think looking at this, this would require me or any other superintendent to start with our policy manual and develop and code the procedures and include them. So I think that which I

think would be one one I think that would be helpful um to have in there.

And I don't correct me if I'm wrong, we do have procedures within our policy manual. I I don't I don't have any off top of my head, but I believe there are some procedures that are within the policy manual. We've gone through it. I I I don't think there are procedures for every policy. Not everyone, but some.

But I when I read this, I'm like I have to tell you I I I'm assuming that that's where this comes from.

That there would be an expectation that for every policy there were procedures. So if there's a policy that says um the superintendent and the administration will develop procedures associated with with whatever then every procedure that we have would end up in a policy manual and to me that would mean that every procedure that we develop would be voted upon by the committee and I don't think that that's the way we

operate. I think that we develop procedures aligned and the expect you know the expectation is we are doing things aligned with policy but we don't bring every procedure every protocol forward for approval by the school committee. I don't think that's what the language was was saying the way I was reading it. Um I just think it was my my opinion on reading the language it was that the superintendent was responsible

for developing procedures for our policies. So maybe we can just put that.

But I don't disagree with your point.

I'm not I would never expect the school committee to vote on every single procedure that goes with the policy. But I believe it's important that um we keep that language. I mean, we keep some language in there to um to make sure that whoever the superintendent is that they are here that they're developing the procedures. I think that only makes sense because you you you're responsible

for the dayto-day. Mhm. Um so if you weren't responsible for or whoever the superintendent is wasn't responsible for creating procedures for policies, I think that would um be chaotic. So I think there's some room in here. I think this could be amended. I would recommend that you would um go back and um fix this policy yourself without going through MASC as a way as you would see fit. So it it's clear and it makes

sense. Sure. I think um I think Mr.

all of the things that you're talking about live in the other parts. I think that's the key. So in yellow, it speaks to the fact that the superintendent will be responsible for specifying required actions and designing detailed arrangements like every basically saying like we're going to develop all of the things aligned with policy.

The part that's different, the part that is the the recommendation that we strike is to say that when you've done all of this, it's going to be included in the policy manual. And I think that's the piece that's in question that for every protocol, every procedure we develop that it's going to live in the policy manual. Is that a bad thing? Would you say I I see that as something that's if

you have a question on procedure for a policy, it's easier for either the greater public or parents or students or other members of faculty to be able to go into one document and be able to um point out where a procedure is for a specific policy. I think it just um creates um it makes it easier to it's better for organization.

Um that that that might be true. I I mean I I'm not I think that behind the scenes that is that's the best way to do it, right? Like you have a policy, we're developing procedures that we know that we have a procedure, we have protocols, expectations aligned with that policy.

I'm not even sure what that looks like if every protocol in our district is is out there for because and I again I'm going to come back to if it is in our policy manual I believe then it is subject to voting by school committee because that's how policy manuals work. we don't put something policy manual without a vote committee and I think that that would make all of those procedures, protocols, practices subject to

approach. Right. Right. And I and and I agree with you there and that's not what I'm suggesting. But what what I am saying is I think this could be revised in a way so where you where you're coming from makes sense is put into here, but also that we keep we should have our protocols and our procedures within the policy manual, but they don't need to be voted on. But I think we can

put that in language within a policy and it just makes sense for everyone. I think that would make things easier for our staff and make things easier for you, make things better, easier for the committee. So um last point, my last question is do we as a district, this is something that's recommended um through MASC. I understand I know the HR director has brought um I don't know maybe it was this one because this was

something that was months ago. Do we always I I know look at all the MS when they update their policies. Do we use every policy? Do we um recommend every policy that comes down before them? I would I would say no. I'm not sure because this is my first round um being involved with the policy elements. Generally um my um my participation as part of the district team would be I would be at a

meeting director of human resources would come I with recommended policy changes I was I don't know if that person was bringing all of them or if they were bringing a subset that had already been vetted by that person and the um and the superintendent at the time. So I'm not really sure. Um, but I would I would say no. I mean, I'm looking at this. We this um there was an update in 2022. It looks

like this update was recommended in 2023. It's 2025 and it's just coming before us now. So, I don't believe we certainly don't because this would have come up in 2024. I was just trying to figure out there was like a vested interest or was there I was just trying to figure out what was the reason behind spec specifically this one that maybe I'm missing I or or there isn't honestly

I don't recall as I read through it when I think about where we are as a district and what our practice is this one makes sense because we don't currently have a policy manual that includes all of the procedures practices protocols And but if we have a policy that says we're going to include everything and we don't and it has never been the practice, then I think that this policy

wasn't appropriate for us in the first place. All right. I'd like to make an amendment to um the motion. I'll make an amendment to the motion that's on the table. if it gets a second that the um superintendent is authorized to um edit this policy as as she wishes if you wish to include some of the language from the conversation that we just had because I believe um we should have all of our

policies I mean all of our procedures within a policy manual so that I'm not going to repeat what I just spoke for for transparency purposes but at the same time I'm not re I'm not suggesting that we have to vote on those and I think that could be put in this policy And I think everyone I think that would be helpful. I don't understand why we would have to make a motion for her to

amend a policy she already put before us unless she feels it needs to be amended.

This is the policy that she gave to us.

This is what we're voting on. I thought I made a persuasive argument. Yeah.

Okay. I just Yeah. Okay. Roll call. I need a second. We didn't get a second.

Okay. Mr. B made the amendment. I need a second. I'd like to make another amendment. I withdraw that. I'd like to make another amendment that where it's crossed out that um we add the following line. Procedures that are not voted on by the committee will be included within the policy manual.

Superintendent, do you have any um opposition? Is there any to that? I I honestly I I would not know how to go I've said this before. I think we have to revisit all of our policies. I think we have to do it very systematically, kind of one section at a time. I don't think it's practical for me or as you you know you always say like whoever the superintendent is it is

not going to be practical to do that work simultaneous with developing all of the protocols in a way that they are fit for distribution. I think it is it's not a short-term goal by any means. Um so I no I I don't I don't really support I don't have a second on that. There's no second motion to refer.

That's still the original. We got a second. I'd like to make an amendment that this um be referred as a first read as we've been doing with our other policies.

As one member, I don't believe we should um refer certain policies as a first read and then others we don't. So I state that for was this I I have a question. Was this this was a first read and it got referred to subcommittee? So I This is an existing policy. This is an existing policy. This is not a policy we're creating. I just want Let's just go. Let's let's You're not going to get

a second. So, let's vote, please. Mr. D.

No, Mr. Cory. Yes. M. Yes.

Item 3-5, discussion of vote to refer to create policy regarding requests for information from school committee members.

Um, since I was the person who referred us, if I can take the floor, Mr. Chair, go ahead. Thank you. So, and I think, um, I'm going to be re rehashing some of the comments I made just at our last school committee meeting. Um, I think it's important and I think it's imperative. I think there's an appetite there to um develop some sort of policy when it comes to um individual school committee members

making requests and I think there's room there for again for there to be a specific um portal or platform where there they can be made.

um the rights of subcommittees to retain information relative to what they're discussing and also if there's a question or concern on the request that it go before the full committee for a vote. That's what I'm looking for as one member. Um so I guess I'd be looking to have request the administration to create some sort of draft policy and present it before the committee. I make that I I'll yield for

now and hear from other colleagues or if the administration has something to say.

But that's my um position. I'd like the administration to weigh in. Give us a sense of Yeah. I mean, I think that I've been pretty vocal about um about the need for something like this. I think I want to be really careful um in terms of what I'm kind of asking for, what I support so that we we're not in a position that um we're holding up any of the work. I

don't want to not I don't want to be in a position where I'm answering some questions, not who is who decides what's too much. Is it is it me in my administration? Um will all requests have to go through you know that kind of uh rigorous examination. Um I so I I just worry about stuff like that because I think there will be times when it gets interpreted um by an individual or a

group of individuals who feel like oh every time I ask for something it needs approval but this person asks for stuff or this or if it's a question if it's questions about this then it gets answered. So I just want to be really careful about that piece. Um, I've made requests in the past to use uh a portal for um for asking questions so that we had a way of recordkeeping so we could kind of

check on ourselves. Um, that hasn't worked out very well because uh sometimes people are using I will in the same day I might get a person who uses the portal for one question but sends an email for another. So that piece of it is difficult. So I support this. I just really want to think through all of the scenarios so that we're not adopting some kind of policy that hamstrings me or you know my team

or any of you really.

That's what I was saying. And sometimes the lines can be blurred as far as like what could be requested or not. How would you even go about Yeah. I'm not sure. I mean, I think sometimes I I think we've I've certainly responded to people when people are making requests like that sounds like a records request. It's not it's going to take someone to stop what they're doing. Yeah. Um to, you know,

run a report that and and we'll look to follow some of those guidelines around um what is what we're required to offer.

It's just difficult. I think the parameters of it I mean overall it's like you just want to be in a situation where people are really respectful um and that you don't need language to dictate that. But I'll admit there are days where I feel like we need language to dictate that because it the volume of questions or like does feel disrespectful and does feel like you know it it hurts progress. So I just I

just go ahead. So maybe it has this could be a policy that maybe has to be a little vague because of all the gray issues. Um where unfortunately, yeah, that's what you have to do. Sometimes you have to deny requests and if they go, "It's cuz it's me." Well, whatever.

That game's always going to be played. I think if you give a rationalization when you're denying a request or when a request takes longer, then you're putting that rationalization out there.

So if it's a records request that is not going to put any immediate benefit to the school department that's going to require a lot of time something that would be interesting to look at but could we then you should be able to just say I'm not going to do that right now that's not a priority because you know and this is the rationale behind it. I think you almost have to keep it vague

because otherwise I don't know how you wouldn't keep it vague because there's so many different situations that something could be asked you know asked of you. But I think as long as it's documented, whether you want it in a portal or whatever, how whatever form you choose to use, I think it needs to be stuck to, right? So it's like this is the way I'm taking them. If we want a

policy, then we're going to follow it.

So there's no more email and do this, then I don't want to hear your email.

This is the way we're doing it. Um, and then I think really you're probably going to have to keep it a little gray, but make sure that you're providing a rationale if the information isn't provided, you know, um, right away or or what have you, you know, and I think that would eliminate a lot of emails with little questions that, you know, aren't necessarily um, always your maybe responsibility in my

opinion, right? Um, brief, you know, will you be brief? I'm good. I actually have to have Oh, she's leaving. I'm good. Now, can I weigh in before she leaves? What I'm concerned about is I want to follow your lead. I don't want to bog you down with an inordinate amount of requests for information that are going to detract from your normal workload because the I read your mind before. I was going to say volume. When

you said volume, I was on the very same wavelength. The volume, I don't think people understand just how hard it is to be a superintendent. And the amount of work that hits you every single day, it's nonstop. It's non-stop. And you have to be able to be energized enough to face that entire voluminous tirade that's coming at you every single day. I don't want to bog you down with requests. So when we say

gray areas need to be prevalent in this look, I'm not going to make you write a policy because frankly anything I've ever wanted to know from you or any other superintendent I've found out anyway without any kind of like major rigma role or policy issues. So I I don't see the necessity of this unless it just kind of formalizes the idea of of a policy request for information. But it's never really been an issue in at

least in my term in office, it's never been an issue. And I certainly don't want to bog you down more than you're already working hard. You're working really hard. I don't think people really understand that. I see it and I appreciate it and I I'm I'm only saying that because that's a fact. Thank you, Mr. D. Yes. Um, now I'm going to make one comment and I think I'll make a

motion to table the remaining items and adjourn because I know there's other commitments. So, um, just my quick comments on this. I believe it's important for individual school committee members to make a determination for a vote or subcommittees to be able to request information relative to what they are discussing so they can make an informative vote. That's something I support. Um, my colleague mentioned um,

forgot what you said. It was um, a criteria I believe you said. It said it's going to has to be kind of gray cuz you know it's hard to for when when when there's a denial there needs to be some sort of rational rationale. I I would go a step further and I believe there needs to be due process and an explanation and that's why I proposed earlier if there's ever um a dispute on

on or the information is too volumous and then it goes before the committee. I think that's something and have a majority vote that's democratic and that's adhering to due process. So that's something I'd like to see in a in a in a policy. Um in regards and my last comment in regards to email one thing or um portal another, it's sometimes when you receive um for example um the the the batches. So we

have the batches. So, just so you're aware, if I have if speaking for myself, if I have a question on a batch, I usually put it on the batch email and I think that's the best place to put it there. Um, speaking for myself, I do try to utilize the portal more. Um, however, I think when instances such as the batches, um, I mean, I could just submit the if I have a question on a

batch, submit it through the portal. I guess um I think something that would go a long way is just um having receipt that it's been because I don't know and for example if we can provide in future um the weekly updates like just knowing that it's been received like the the request has been received and it's being looked at I think um would be I think would alleviate a lot of concern. Okay.

So that's my two. So I make a motion to table the remaining items and adjourn.

What are we going to do about this right here? Do we have what was this our policy? We didn't do anything on that.

No. I was I was looking at table. Oh, you want to table it? Okay. Not because I know other me other people have. No, no. I don't mean everything else. I mean just now the discussion of vote to refer the school committee the um super superintendent. Would you pro um provide with this motion? Would you provide for the next being a draft policy for us to discuss for June 9th? Um, no, not for

June 9th. For the next policy policy subcommittee. Sure. Absolutely. All right. Second, Mr. D. Yes, Mr. Carter. Okay, Miss Per.

Yes.

Boston to motion to adjurnn.

I I thought my my motion she kind of added it in there but I don't think she wrote it down to that way. I thought I made the table second. Sorry, Mr. Dice. Yes, Mr.

Cory. Yep. Mr. Yes.