9.18.2024 Traffic Board

right soon open uh meeting law any person may make an audio or video recording of this public meeting or may transmit the meeting through any medium attendees are therefore advised that such recordings or Transmissions are being made whether perceived or unperceived by those present and are deemed acknowledged and permissible we'll start off this meeting with a roll call Sergeant Dart Stephanie

MacArthur director of traffic and parking oh Natalie mow Helen Helen Rego Charlie Den joh one point Sorry all right um take a motion to approve last month's minutes uh August 21st 2024 second second and any opposed seeing none minutes approved before we get started with the agenda is anybody here that is not on tonight's agenda that wants to address the board everyone so everyone received the letter

A get into the curb Cuts we got uh 2436 South Main Street engineer Department review the application found no issues motion to approve motion to approve second second by Charlie any opposed seeing none passes second would be 657 Quarry Street again found no issues motion to approve second you have a motion motion to approve I think we're a little slow today you have a second please second second second thank you all

right tabled request from last month we have Bradford AV and South Main we have Representatives hello would you like to come down thank you thank you

um so my name is Jasmine per I'm the grant writer for the city of Fall River um and this is Ashley Kino she's the executive director of The Fall River arts and culture Coalition um and last year we put in a grant occupation to Bloomberg philanthropy's asphalt art initiative um this is an international Grant competition that supports the use of paint to improve Road Safety um and these pictures on the

first page of the packet are some examples of intersections that have been transformed with these brand funds we identified originally the intersection of Bradford a and Broadway um because it was listed as one of the top 100 most dangerous intersections in Southeastern Massachusetts um so the the next page is a aerial view of that intersection um and while we originally proposed a mural um Bloomberg

came back and asked us if we would be interested in doing curb extensions um because it would have a greater impact on pedestrian safety at that site um so our city engineer actually said that the intersection would be too narrow and it's a little bit too complex to do curb extensions at that site um so then we had moved on to um the intersection of South Main Street in Bradford Avenue um

because he had already had some hypothetical design of an actual extension of the curb there um so if you flip through these are some examples of what curb extensions look like um they are basically painted bump outs um from the sidewalk that reduce the length of the crosswalk and they narrow the the lane width so cars are supposed to be slowing down so let me let me ask you this one I

understand the concept behind this but what prevents the motor vehicles from driving on the painted roadway and what infraction would that technically be so there are ballards that surround the the painted portion um so if you look through that previous examples you can see them so it's like little rais edges yes there it's like little flexible spikes um the white flexible post that

you see running the perimeter of each of the curve extensions so that is designed to keep the cars from going within that space um but they also can be removed so the city need to remove them how high are they I would say they're probably about 33t 36 in so like when you go down the cape they have the root six they have the yellow markers in the middle

yes a lot of um bike Lanes in cities like Providence and Boston use them to separate it um if you've seen those before um so this design here with the block markings is Dan's original um hypothetical design of actual curve so his intention with this was to see what it might look like with an um a larger side walked to get that done um so we based our preliminary design on that of

what it would look like painted um but it's my understanding that at the last traffic board meet that um the placement of the stop sign was an issue um so I just wanted to present um the precedent that Bloomberg has to place the stop sign there um it is based off of the manual on uniform traffic control devices um which is published by the Federal Department of Transportation um where they do Define that painted

space as sidewalk um so it's not considered roadway and it it's separated by those um little flexible posts um and they actually also recommend that the traffic control devices be placed there and not on the sidewalk should there exist a curb curb extension and so you can see some examples of this in action um in other towns how far in between would these posts be set up that that would be up to the traffic

department and um the city engineer on how many and how far they would be but my assumption is that they would be close enough together where our car would not be able to enter so they wouldn't be able to squeeze through then it would be that within within six feet of each other I'm assuming are those things flexible yeah a little bit some people have you gone to the engineer with this drive

right over oh yeah this is essentially what they yeah is there one with signage are you suggesting any traffic um not a light but a a stop sign um because currently even though it is a a t stop there's no posted stop signage at the intersection y a lot of middle there in the middle yeah so this if you go to the very last that was the second one they prop page um and then remember

the congestion it would cause this is just a very basic rendering what it what it may look like um it removes all of that excess space and makes that an extension of the curb is this the current proposal the new one right here no that's the young it would be this last one here looking at the same just yeah the stop intersection y okay so that's all there is is just a uh painted yield

no that's not this

one the very right here that's the one that they want to do so they want to do Stop Bar there stop there and stop there on Bradford South Main heading north and south

is that picture here from the last page on the very back if you just flip the whole the whole booklet over oh okay what is the um thought process behind putting the stop signs on South Main instead of just I mean that's a main thorough way you know what I mean and there's a light literally block and a half um to the south of that intersection already um why are we wanting to stop there I

understand the need for possible signage on Brit s me um why do we want to so that was carried over from the engineering Department's original design um of what actual like concrete curb would would look like so that is here where there there were stops um so that that was just carried over into the design but that's something that I mean we can go back and look at I I just I I'm only bringing it up

because typically I don't like to see too many um things that are going to uh stop the flow of traffic in or around the hospitals for one um and two that's that area is not necessarily congested um I will agree with you it tends to get uh pretty uh muddy as far as accidents because of how wide that is designed but um never just from the South Main traffic alone you

know what I mean I don't know if just putting a random stop sign there is going to help anything I do think the need to address the Bradford a issue into South Main exists but why um have we never just looked at dragging that median all the way up and then that itself sorts out this whole problem in in Le of the curb extension yeah I mean if because if we dragged

that median all the way up to South Main now you can put all signage you want there it's not in the roadway I understand other states have done some of these things where they've put a sign freestanding in a roadway and surrounded it by some some flexible plastic um you guys live in in the city I've seen telephone poles not really interfere with the flow of traffic so flexible plastic where it's

been established since this this road pattern has been there I'm just concerned that um the metal sign on painted or unpainted sidewalk while it's on the roadway and not even being raised by that curbing uh we're going to be replacing that sign a few times I think we can agree to that um again I personally don't see the the importance of the stop signs on South Main itself and the only other thing I'd

be concerned about is the uh if you did have those stop signs splitting South M into those two lanes that turning lane and then the uh southbound traveling Lane uh could potentially interfere with those vertical traffic um vertical parking that we have there along all those business fronts uh those are established as vertical parking spots for God knows how long so would you suggest then no stop signs along South

Main Street um the southbound traffic being one lane and then keeping Bradford AB as it is in this picture my suggestion I mean again the board is going to have their chance to speak on this and uh you guys make your recommendation but I don't see the need personally for stop signs along South Main I think that flows well as is um splitting the southbound lane into two lanes it would be needed if there was a

traffic control device there the fact that there won't be it alleviates that you know what I mean because now no one's going to be stacking up and trying to squeeze around so those would be my two suggestions but I mean by all means what do you uh what do you guys have well like Stephanie said you got the hospital you got um lights right up ahead and we always keep saying that

stop signs is a big issue in the city the more people just go right through it doesn't matter they're going to go right through it happens all the time and this goes way back than when I've been on the board about the stop signs it's it's it's an issue if anything it's more of a problem that's what I've learned over the years and especially South Main Street that's a busy busy area with the

ambulances that's a lot you you got the funeral power over there I don't I can't see stop signs there either I'll be honest with you and that's on South Main Street or that's with the Bradford Avenue stop as well um well I'm just looking at this right here I don't know how he's he's he's a police a sergeant he's runs that department he would know that better than me if that really is an

issue or not but I feel really strongly about the one here on South Main Street I think I think you did a good job addressing the Bradford Avenue section I think you that you've narrowed that into a lane and you've clarified that lane but you also have the school on uh is at Park Street yeah and that's that's a busy school I worry about when that traffic gets out and an ambulance

has to get through and that's a that's going to be a gridlock right there with everybody stopping it and it does narrow as you get further north on South Main Street so I just worry about the stop signs prohibiting the flow of the ambulance but I think the Bradford Avenue sign uh that the signage and the the way you've narrowed it down I agree with does anybody else on the board have

any comments questions concerns no I I concur with so we have uh a couple of different options you guys have um take the proposal as is um give a suggestion to modify the proposal um or you know what whatever you guys are are seeking here so uh you ladies have anything else you want to bring up I would just like to clarify um South Main going northbound yep there's

a stop sign there in this and that just y or n on that stop sign my my suggestion for this proposal right here would be uh I personally would get rid of any stop signs on South Main I would leave that flowing as is I personally wouldn't go with um a split Lane South bomb and I mean we have you guys have data and and other things saying that these these painted murals and

plastic posts suffice um I mean try that stop sign there and paint those that division along uh Bradford a that would clean that intersection up and then we'd have to see how uh the traffic patterns and accidents and everything go from there obviously we placed the stop sign three times in the first 60 days probably going to have to NX that stop sign there and re-evaluate but that would be my my

suggestion it's up to the board I you get those signs that you put in the middle of like President um Pleasant Street right and you got people coming out of primary care how many times those signs have been slammed into pieces are those like flexers like like these well yeah I mean those things that slammed into pieces and that's just pleasantry I can only imagine here the only other thing I would talk about with

the uh the posting signage because I I mean we just did some some paintings right we're up at uh Pleasant Street couple intersections over there if you're going to have the plastic dividers wrapping around the um murals would it be too much to just paint it throw those up and see how the traffic pattern flows itself because again my my only concern from a safety point is that sign

standing essentially on the roadway okay I mean I get you're saying the divider of the plastic posts um but we just don't have signs on on the roadway and that's for a reason and we they all get been hit before you know I me people jump up on the curb the mural being painted those reflective plastic posts a new divided line um revamped crosswalk and the um lane splitting that you have there traffic doesn't

Blow from Bradford a arbitrarily onto South Main I mean we do have some accidents there but that is not the major concern um so that's an inherent choke point in and of itself I would be curious to see how the traffic pattern would be without the sign on the roadway that was something we had brought up to the The Grand Tour organization um so that that um black and white photo that you were looking at

that had the yield yeah um after the last traffic board meeting that's what we had brought to them as a compromise because the stop sign was a point of contention at the meeting um and they they would not be comfortable approving us to go ahead and use the funds without the the stop control so which which is why we're we're looking at this so they're basically saying they're not going to free up the monies for it

without a stop sign there yes the alternative would be to find a a different simpler location within the city to try curve extensions um in which case it would we would try to find a site where there's already a four-way stop so that the the stop signs are already on the sidewalk sure yeah no I get that um and I have a question and who's going to maintain these after it's down the

for River arts and culture Coalition well so we committed as part of the grant to um to maintain the murals within this so it's meant to be a 2-year test to begin with going back to your point of of data and and what happens within the intersection and so at that time the city reevaluate if they would like us to continue touching it up or if they would like to paint it solid color

or how they would like to address it moving forward so the purpose of all this is to try to slow traffic down to slow traffic and just make it saf for pedestrians to be able to cross that's a that's a that's to me I'll be honest with everybody that's a tough section I did that's a tough tough that's my opinion because I drive that a lot when I go to

S man's church that's a tough even at night is a tough section the liins poor there at night so that's that's my opinion all right how do you guys feel um any other questions you guys want to make a recommendation on this I uh put my two cents on it as far as what I think potential concerns would be um the ladies are here for you guys to ask any questions but I think it looks

great in the Flint if that's part of your project didn't that's not no that was Yore and they did a fantastic job that looks nice it's not affecting anything just like we have these bumps that was put a few years ago like downtown where it took parking from people and I'm sure that the plow in the winter when they snow I'm sure they hit that if you go next to um the banks uh

the bank down what's the name of that bank uh with the gas company next to the eagle how those bumps come out yeah those bumps that come out that's to me that's been danger Dangerous right from day one just like out here in front of City Hall where they have little plants growing and all that over there so I don't know I don't know I'm just thinking out loud I just do we have any sort of

motion without those stop signs that's not approved not at this site we would have to start from so it's all or nothing with this site we would have to we to a different site and make a new proposal like I reiterated I'm comfortable with the Bradford Avenue side side but I'm not comfortable with the stop signs on South Main so you know if you want to make a motion or to either come back another proposal or

another area do they have another site potentially air marked no um we would we would have to look into that so the board's aware it would be my opinion um we look at an alternate site um just based on some of those concerns but it is up to you guys you you POS how you POS you motion to deny this proposal yeah is there a second second any opposed

okay see what they can come up with for a second it's the stop sign so we would modify this with the stop sign or we would look at an alternate site I think if there was no signage on the roadway that would be ideal if that's a deal breaker for them let's see what other intersections they're potentially looking at okay so so we can either bring a this design back with no stop signs on South Main

and keep the way that Broadford a is or we can come with an alternative site if there was no signage in the middle of the roadway I I get it it's on the mural but it's the middle of the roadway if there's no signage there and it's paint surrounded by some plastic barriers I think that would be imitable and obviously keeping South M free flowing okay all right thank you thank you very much thank you

count you're that excited all right

Glamour Hair two no am I skip one oh I skipped one EDD Street hello all right so this was tabled from last month um regarding moving Eddie street from two-way to a oneway in either direction either North or Southbound um I've gone by I've looked at it I know John was just saying he was there as well uh it is pretty tight Street I don't think um that would ruin anything obviously if we do go

ahead and vote to uh change this to a one way Steph would have to reach out to everybody um and allow for a certain amount of notice um but I would agree um making this one way is uh actually going to be a little bit safer and after looking at it I I think southbound would be the preferred direction of travel s and do it just to let the board

know this was a call that I received you have to say my name and stuff yeah Linda Pereira 99 North Ogen street I'm sorry um it was a call I got from a constituent and I said well if you get 10 people on your street you can get a petition submit it and he was like you know I don't want to go to the neighbors um I don't know if they'll be angry

whatever I said I'll write a letter to the traffic commission which I did and then they said it was tabled for me to come today so here I am but I did happen just a couple of days ago um see two vehicles on Eddie Street one coming one going and they were both young drivers and neither one of them wanted to back up I thought maybe they were afraid to

back up so because they couldn't back up I guess they thought swearing at one another would help alleviate the traffic which didn't work I offered to back one of the cars up for them um not that I'm real good at backing up but I try but you know what my concern was after seeing that what if there was an ambulance or a fire truck wanting to get up that street and I think that there

are many streets that are narrow that are two ways and years ago maybe there was parking on one side people didn't have the amount of vehicles they have to today I mean my daughter has a car the son-in-laws have a car the grandchildren have a car there's 10 cars I mean we have off street parking but if that was if everybody lived in a three Decker or a six family how many cars would that be

and it just concerned me to say that um I don't know if a study needs to be done on some of those streets by the board um along in conjunction with the fire or ambulance but that's my two cents and I thank you I'm hoping that it's a approved and I thank you for your time thank you for coming down like I said um it is it is pretty tight Street

obviously um it would be beneficial to be one way it would alleviate all that and after looking at it I think south bound would be the ideal flow of traffic so motion to approve by Helen seconded by Natalie any opposed none passes all right 204 210 Robison robon street robon street Glamour Hair all right motion to table table John seconded by charie tables uh exotic tan all right two to three 1 hour parking spaces

in front of the business this location does have meters out in front correct all right is there anything you want to address the board with um it's just that uh we've had several uh clients we scheduling or not coming in because impossible park down that street it's impossible there's NOK it's very hard to to find parking on that area to get a couple parking spots in front but there are parking spots in

front now correct yes but at certain of the the day impossible to find park it everything is full the but having all right so having two to three 1H hour parking spots how is that different than having the 1 hour meter parking spot there I don't know if there was a way to make as reserved for the business or something like that oh yeah we can't do parking that is just for a business on

on a roadway um parking spaces are always they first come first serve the only thing that's res erve um in any capacity would be handicapped um and even that is first come first serve um business hours again that's not even just for the business if you had a 1 hour parking only and I pulled up and I had no intention of going into your business and I was there for 50 minutes straight

and then pull out I'm still good you know what I mean we there's no such thing as um parking dedicated to a business other than your own private lot so uh it's kind of the same thing you're asking for now having one hour business parking spots is essentially the 1 hour meter parking you know what I'm saying yeah it's just that with attending It's just sometimes 15 20 minutes and people can't

even find I I completely understand I get it but even if though that was changed from meter to 1 hour business parking people are still going to park there right you know you know what I mean I can't dedicate I've seen around the city a couple um that's like signs for that business unless the business the ones that put that that signage there nothing signs on a a curbing that says this parking is for Joe's potatoes

I no way leave us leave us an anonymous phone call and uh I'll go out there with my screw gun and take them right down I said it could have been just sure sure sure yeah no I can tell you right now there's there's not we can't dedicate um public um public roadway oh could have dedicated parking to business and of itself could have okay I didn't think that yeah all right any anything else

all right so uh this is going to be a on I would just motion to deny this to deny seconded by Charlie anyos none all right uh 125 Heartwell Street hello uh Community Connections three spaces with signs for drop off and pickup well have to listen to what you just said okay uh this is a little bit different um Community go ahead why you we're a day program in an employment space for people with disability

and we have transportation vehicles that drop off clients in the morning and pick up clients in the afternoon sort of vehicles as well private PE private family members dropping people off because those parking spaces are right in front of the building it makes it very difficult for the vehicles to pull up curbside so now they're double parking in the street which isn't really safe for our people getting off the

vehicles some of them have walkers some of them need help so we were looking hopefully if you're looking at the building there's like two or three parking spaces right there we were looking to get those eliminated so people won't park there and we'll be able to just pull our vehicles up GBS side yeah all right so this is a little bit different of a request um obviously as much as I would love to help

businesses with ease of running their business it's not really our function anytime we start talking about safety that's when we have to be concerned and I would completely agree um based on what the business is and uh the intention here it's not just for your employees to have front door parking it's literally for for pick up and drop off of um handicapped or you know uh slightly disabled individuals um for ease of

of and then mostly big vehicles Vans and not little right they're 15 passenger and wheelchair vehicles um so basically we're looking to remove move what would it be one or two meters yeah we could so we could do one meter double head or are you requesting so that's what we can do so there's one meter is a double head meter so I can just remove that one yep so that would

give free up two spots for a Pick upop Off yeah that would be perfect yeah that would be yeah I think that's reasonable I would to back her up on this I pass by there every morning on my job it's a nightmare yeah it's it's a night them coming out they're trying to get into the to the vehicles and you got them just coming this way this guy trying to

go that way then you got a bus coming in and you got an ambulance coming I know exactly what you're talking about I swear every want what do you got now this location I can speak firsthand uh a lot of my vehicles are Transit are Wall Street and um they are very busy loading and unloading the uh Personnel from and to in from this building but I one of the questions I have can we designate that

curbside uh loading zone or pick particularly loading zone between 700 a.m. 4: p.m.

specifically because that is what they need is access to that curb to unload uh uh these uh patients buses yeah definitely I think just removing the um meter thing isn't going to give them exactly what they want this is going to have to be a by some sort of signage I was going to prer to uh y to step for that so we can yeah we can definitely do

it as a loading zone do you want there to be certain times on there is there certain times that it's busier what are the business hours busier we can do your business hours you can do you know 9 to 5 what is probably for that location 8 to 4 yeah okay Monday through Friday y okay motion on this one motion to approve second second and any approv seeing none all set thank you very much much

appreciated all right tabled from last month handicap 150 Bey Street be Bey that's you does driveid pler d for not being in attended all

right I don't

know take a lot of there's a driveway available there's a driveway you have access to that driveway so and I can't

see you can park in the driveway please you're allowed to park in the driveway are you allowed to park in the driveway yeah she said it's narrow you said it's narrow too narrow to get out is that you I'm sorry it's narrow and it's a long good distance for her to bring her groceries up the stairs very I'm and I you know that's why on the street and besid that's closer to the to the

myart all right narrow as in like so this property the driveway goes down into like a parking lot or you just stack the cars in the driveway this parking space is B nobody's assigned excuse me nobody just sign P up and whoever gets in there can pop in yeah okay is it a housing who who is this who's the property owner is this a for of a housing thing or is this a private owner

is it for of a housing or is it a private owner who owns that L LLC LLC okay well um so unfortunately um Miss s um this happens uh almost every month there's a couple of things that we have that are automatic um non-starters when it comes to handicap space is okay um obviously the person applying has to have a license you have to be you have to drive a car you have

to have a vehicle registered to you and the other one being you can't have off street parking available to you um as you heard me talk about before obviously everyone knows in the city of Fall River um parking on the roadway is a hot commodity and it's a limited you know all we ever do is take away from it uh most everybody on the street has the poet off right yeah those spots are

usually always open in front of my then I mean so you don't ever really have an issue finding a spot you don't ever really have an issue finding a spot then you said it's it's always open it's always available on the street that's where you're looking to park though right on the street I've been I don't park in the back the driveway is so narrow Okay so so you're saying you want to you want to

have a handicap spot on the street but it's always open anyhow and you always parked there now because I want to pop down the street because it's closer to to my apartment they made a carry groceries and things well unfortunately right now like I said because you do have the availability of off street parking that kind of negates there are some exceptions that we've made you know

what I mean like if it's just a driveway and you can't even open the door the full width we have made exceptions and approved those this driveway I albe it tight to drive down it leads to a parking lot in the back so uh this would be one of those instances where it would be a non-starter but I'm going to let the board take their vote on it yeah that's but she does have so is

there a motion motion to deny is there a second second seconded by Ellen uh any oppos seeing them so at this point dear um based on this packet we're not going to be able to give you a hand spot on the stream okay any questions said no I said right now your your request for a handicap spot is going to be denied because you do have access to off street parking okay any questions no

Not Sorry Charlie let her know you're closer thank you she she H uh 365 Montgomery there

hello hello Wonder whip I'm here to represent my mom Amy whip

so she doesn't drive no she's completely blind 93 years old legally yes 17 car accident can't see like Shadows it's completely black nothing okay I'll and she has she has a certificate of that cuz we will need that on file for it because of some of the okay perect can you just make sure that a copy of that certificate gets um St all right this one uh going to be uh all set so approve second joh

opposed I'll okay thank you take about 12 weeks you're going to see our maintenance guys out there they're going to be doing some measurements be about 12 weeks prior to the signs going up 12 weeks okay thank you very much for hearing my case and thank you for proving it so am I good to go now or no you'll get a letter in the mail okay thank you very

much 451 Pine that would be me hello you guys mind first absolutely yeah I'll let you know if we have any questions

it is a lovely note I see no issues with this one is there a motion motion to approve is there second second seconded any opposed see n all set sir about 12 weeks okay thank you very much you got it than you very 462 County hello you can stay

there oh I don't need that nope as long as we have your I will we'll take that though

okay noes with this packet is there a motion motion approved is there a second second any opposed all set D about 12 weeks you got it next 241 Washington hello yeah you guys can stay all right so you have a vehicle H she does all right um can you make sure that a copy of the registration gets given to step okay I can go get it now I don't need it right now just make sure that

that does come in all right cuz like I said before you have to drive you have to have a vehicle and no off you parcking right you just didn't in your packet provide the registration all right that something we just bring one any time you can just bring it yep anytime just drop it off at the office yeah of course absolutely I see no issues with this any anybody having uh motion to accept second second any

opposed seeing none all second guys about 12 weeks right apprciate 285 4th 285 4th Street motion to table there a second second second any oppos table uh we have man Street this one I have here it's not on the original agenda uh 46 man street I'll just read it out to you guys I don't think you guys all have they all do I already gave them one y excellent you are all right

sometimes don't foret yeah I know M can't use a Dragway you don't have access to the driveway no sir I don't motional approv second by John any opposed all set there I only have one request in Fr of my house there's actually like two parking spaces in front of the house um I was just wonder if I could get the like the first parking space cuz then that's where the driveway is and it' be

easier for me to car up so when they go out there within the next 12 weeks to look at it they go the one closest to the entrance of that property the one closest closest to the entrance yep all right thank you very much you got it have a good day you as well uh Argy 240 over so about 12 weeks I'm sorry yeah about 12 weeks they'll you'll see them

out there a little bit sooner because they're going to get the measurements that need to go to ordinance but 12 weeks they'll be up completely okay you're welcome you too so this one oh yeah there it is um you want handicap spot on the corner yeah listening to you maybe you've got some suggestions we have one student who is handicapped gets dropped off in the morning uh picked up in the afternoon by

a bus sorry little minivan um probably need access to the dropped curb which is corner of uh Snell and over and can't really be on uh SN because one there's other buses at that time mhm and then we're also in the process of applying for for markings to do with like a bus lane yeah um so it would be ideal if he could get dropped off outside of like on DOA as close to

the school entrance as possible I passed by there every morning cuz I lived right around the corner and I was exactly what I talking about I think it should be right around his entrance to the school as Clos as to but isn't that farther from where the C break is no no there's Snell there's the his entrance is right here right there right on a cornet should be isn't there a large

can't park with 20 ft of a corner though I know problem is it a private like yeah it's full to be honest in the morning with the teacher cars yeah is there any handicap spots in there none no none no absolutely none how many spots are there yeah there's I don't want to quote um without knowing for sure but I do know that any size lot over so many to have X amount of handicap spots so

that's something we're going to have to look at this is I have those numbers in my office I can always just email you that yeah so like I'm randomly throwing it out there but like if you have 10 spots one for every 10 spots one has to be allocated handicapped um this is a drop off pickup right so it's not like this this mini us or van whatever it is is

going to be staged there for x amount of time correct not unless like they're 15 minutes early to pick him up wait in the afternoon and then at that point it's not like the teachers leaving because they're still there because the kids are getting dismissed and it's not like and I'm just spip oning here um that minivan or whatever wouldn't be blocking the entrance or exert to the parking lot

correct it's it's a decent enough size from what I remember unless it got changed I haven't been it back there you mean the talk in law yeah yeah I'm just thinking about the kid that get out in wheel swing what are we going to do wheel around sure no I I get it is there not an entrance in the parking lot to the school parking lot is on um is over the

other side of the road on S it's right behind the building no yeah what what's what's behind the building so the front of the building faces do correct Y and then the parking lot is on is on the other side of snow it's across the street side street a little side stre to get into the first floor of that school I think there stairs I'm thinking of the it it used to be the catechism

the church and uh there's a lot behind the building anymore not the way it used to be there's no lot behind the building there's a lot like over the road on SN like on the other side of the road oh all right so that that totally negates what I was thinking about then I apologize um sh yeah when you go in that door on the parking lot they stairs to

get into the first floor am I right what would it what would it we can't put it on the corner what would it require to get a curve cut in front of the he would have to apply for that through engineering what we get through that that would be my recommendation which we had recommend my recommendation regarding this okay um I hear what you're saying uh at first glance it would would seem appropriate to put it

at that corner cuz there's already a curb cut drop them off you can wield right up um issue is can't allow parking within 20 ft of a corner so I don't want to allocate a spot for him that he can't legally use uh my suggestion would be this we would have to go ahead and apply for a curb cut in front of the school in front of your school and then we can

allocate that spot directly in front for his like we just had a drop off pickup for him we right now previously there used to be a curve right in the middle right in front of the school but the other side of the road is a driveway and so we applied the summer to have the crosswalk painted and to have the curve relooked at we were told that we can't do that because of the driveway directly

opposite so our crossing guard now has to be at the corner we don't have a Crossing front even though the curve drops there like so directly across from your entrance where there would have been an old crosswalk you're saying it leads right across to an open driveway correct yeah M there is but unfortunately cuz it's not Ada complied there's not a curb cut on the school side they couldn't put

a crosswalk there correct cuz it's not an ADA complied crosswalk has to have a curb cut but if we cut it then it would be correct I'm not an engineer but I think DCM did go out and check it out too correct we went we went and looked at it it it can it can't go the where it is right now the cut the cut would have went just to the left of the uh of the

um the driveway opening Y and what would have happened it would have just extended the driveway opening it would have been walking almost into the driveway so could it be moved what five feet in either direction so that it doesn't to connect to the opening move the it it they just going to have to adjust where this uh where this ramp's going to be right but either way it would want be closer than the

corner right yeah to the door and two I mean he'll have we'll be able to box out that spot without it being on the corner yeah it's a situation we can overcome definitely it's a conversation we could have later yeah yeah so that would be my recommendation to sort this out as of right now based on this proposal at first glance like I said seems reasonable but you can't box

off a corner when there not supposed to be parking within 20 ft can I can I ask a follow so we we put in for a bus lane um on Snell and then I'm wondering if there some way of like combining this so that there's a parking like a disabled access spot as part of the bus on Snell and it's the whole side of our the whole side of SN our side of Snell would

be a bu have disabl access on there the same side of the street likeing yeah um well so first thing first we're going to have to Steph's going to have to sorry j we're going to have to get back to you about making the parking lot or making sure that it is in compliance cuz I'm pretty sure you're going to you're required to have couple in there and then we can look at it from that okay

let's say it says two are dedicated to that maybe that might alleviate that need especially if it's for business-wise if it's just for the drop off and pick up um they can't use that bu that bus area that was approved for the loading still in the conversation of what that's going to look like okay and how long it will take from when I was reading you were in conversation with Chris

Oliver cor students and that seemed like it was like a longer proposal yeah cuz with with yeah with that type of request it's not like a handicap parking request those go through emergency Preamble has to go to ordinance and Council first reading second reading so it does it is extended out so that was approved in the August meeting I'm pretty sure so it usually takes about I always say about

16 weeks from that cuz it it there so many channels it has to go

through and then no loading zone but oh sorry our loading zone and then they could get in and out and just but my only concern with that on do is they would it's wheelchair access so they would have to access that curb cut which is on the corner of do and snow correct so that would be quite the distance for a wheelchair to be traveling in the road that would be my concern if we put it

right in front of the school cuz there is no curb cut there so it's not like if there was a curb cut right in front of the school we could do loading zone right there they could access the curb cut go right into the school but essentially if we do yeah they would be getting dropped off in front of the school traveling 40 ft not even in One Direction the whole

thing right but to be traveling in the road in the weather conditions especially in the win call it 10 ft you know what I mean that's still yeah 10 ft getting dropped off into the roadway traveling if we if we go the route of applying for that curb cut as close to the front of the school without interfering and being in compliance of putting that crosswalk not even I mean

yeah it's still going to have to be a crosswalk but curb cut in front of the school and then the loading zone there I think we're going to be able to bypass all this so you think we can have a load in zone up plus the C got out the front and then completely separate to that was the August thing to correct the bus yeah that that's all said that was already approved through this commission that's

I think it already went for first reading I'm waiting for the second reading on that once second reading approved by Council and then signed off by the mayor and then we can get those signs up of course so uh based on this request right here motion to approve no would cut well we have to fill out a engineer packet for that one so based on the request today as far as putting a handicap spot at the

corner right yeah and then I'll be in touch I'll have a conversation with the director DCM as well um can I email Chris in regards to that okay I'm just okay yeah so I'll email Chris and just let him know once I have a conversation with the director DCM as far as that curb cut okay okay and then that's also no load in is that conversation the loading zone yeah so

that would have to be another request that would have to come here yeah no it's two separate things unfortunately cuz this was just a handicap parking request it's not the loading request get when I go back today what I'm telling them is we're in touch about the bus lane correct the um the curve cup seems like it's it can be done yeah the handicap spot is a no correct and we

need to put in a proposal for that is correct in front of the school once the curb cut is essentially in place right apprciate your time no problem thank you I know who was the second who denied that Helen Helen denied the point uh seconded no one opposed that's going to be denied um all right finally we're going to go into the rescinded handicap spots just burun through those Pitman Street rainy Street

and Cherry stream uh motion to approve those motion to approve second seconded by Charlie anyone imposed none and with that we are dismissed there good that was a long one yeah thanks happy birthday