The Fall River City Council Committee on Health & Environmental Affairs convened on March 31, 2022. After addressing open meeting law and citizen input, the committee accepted the minutes from its September 27th meeting. The main discussions revolved around two previously tabled resolutions: tree stump removals and the quarterly review of the city's water supply and filtration plant. Regarding tree stump removals, representatives from the Cemeteries and Trees department reported an inventory of 919 trees and 673 stumps slated for removal, not including city parks. They detailed contractor costs of $4,200 per day for tree removal and $2,000 per day for stump removal, noting a $20,000 DCR grant secured for stump removal. Council Pereira raised concerns about the slow pace of removals and the understaffing of the tree department, which currently operates with one full-time employee supplemented by cemetery staff. The department plans to request an assistant forester position in the upcoming budget. The discussion also covered coordinating stump removal with sidewalk repairs and the city's new protocol for planting appropriate tree species to prevent future infrastructure damage. This item was ultimately tabled. The second major discussion focused on the water supply and filtration plant. Mr. Ferlin from the Water Department updated the committee on staffing shortages at the filtration plant, which has only two shift operators and an interim director. He reported a lead action level exceedance last year, with 8 out of 69 sampled sites showing elevated lead levels, leading to a Notice of Non-Compliance from the EPA. The city is preparing to respond to the EPA and will conduct bi-annual lead sampling at 60 Tier 1 sites. Mr. Ferlin detailed the city's ongoing efforts to replace lead service lines under an EPA Administrative Consent Order since 1997, having replaced approximately 4,000 sections. He also highlighted challenges with employee retention due to uncompetitive salaries and rising chemical costs, exacerbated by supply chain issues. Council Pereira emphasized the critical importance of water quality and the need for competitive salaries to attract and retain qualified staff. This resolution was also tabled, with the expectation that these topics would be revisited during the upcoming budget season.
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here we'll start the agenda but first um open meeting law chapter 38 section 2-0 e pursuant to the open meeting law any person may make an audio or video recording of this public meeting or may transmit the meeting through any medium attendees are therefore advised that such recordings or transmissions are being made whether perceived or unperceived by those present and are deemed acknowledged and permissible um
0:34citizens input for item one was there any written communication at all and no one signed in so we'll go to two um the minutes motion to accept the minutes of the meeting september 27th motion made and all in favor oh yeah i second that and all in favor hi um we'll go to item three which is the uh resolution to discuss tree stump removals in the city which was tabled on january 28 2021
1:10motion to remove off the table correct correct motion to remove off the table second all in favor all right all right i said second okay all right we have um i have our representatives here from the cemeteries and trees department um so i i want to give the floor actually to um council pereira who whose resolution this was and i'll start that off and then we'll go from there sure
1:41um the only question that i would have is where are we at on this number one uh because i realize there's 500 stumps all over the place in the city but one where were we at and number two what is the cost of having a company come in to cut down trees and not remove stumps so if they came in and they cut down the stumps what is that total budget
2:05because i'm just curious as to know if it would be better for us to hire somebody else you know so that we have two people you could take it from there sure so just some numbers we've inventoried the city from wilson road south we're still working on the tree inventory so we have 919 trees slated for removal and 673 stumps slated for removal it does not include city parks yet so we'll be going through
2:36the parks as we complete the inventory as far as costs are concerned when we contract out we typically do it on a daily rate so our contractors thousand two hundred dollars for the day to do tree removal and two thousand dollars a day to do stump removal um so it is uh pretty costly but they do come in with um significantly more equipment and manpower than we have in-house
3:05and can do uh work a little more rapidly another point is executed a contract for a grant of twenty thousand dollars for stump removal um so we'll start that project actually next week we have three days slated with our contractor next week um to start doing stump removal i'll give them a list um typically what i do is i send them a day i'm in the north end the day on the
3:33south end and kind of jump around to where there's bigger clusters of stumps so that way they're working more stumps than traveling through the city and some of the stumps that we have in the city on sidewalks that have really ruined sidewalks i know mr perry's group is doing sidewalk repair can we look at getting rid of those stumps that are on sidewalks like that so that when your guys uh like i
4:01know that you coordinate that you both yeah so either i speak with john or mr perry or his uh foreman at the garage that's doing sidewalk repair and when we're doing in-house stuff we target the stuff that's around the sidewalk repairs how often are the contracts going out how many days it's four thousand two hundred dollars a day but how many days do we have them come in in the course of a month let's say i
4:27try to do at least a day a month it varies we try to save money through most of the fiscal year for storm issues so this year we've had a significant number of windstorms snowstorms that have really eaten at our budget one storm in particular was over thirty thousand dollars worth of contracted tree work um so it really varies year to year depending on how much uh storm damage we have to clean up
4:54okay i mean if there's a plan on how to do it if it's more feasible to hire the help i know we have two stump grinders people know how to run them are they in good condition whatever uh because you're gonna have to have you know at least two people one person cannot go and cut a tree it's not safe um but i'd like to know those figures because if that's the case maybe hiring
5:16some you know hiring someone is going to be less expensive and then you've got that person there all year to to do other things as well just just my thoughts if you would have those yeah so i mean and that's a good point so chris and i in our discussions obviously budget season's upon us that's that's been part of the conversation um looking at trying to beef up that tree department which you know a common
5:39misconception is we have a tree department with multiple individuals in it um chris does yeoman's work with what he does have but you know we we often have to pull from the cemetery's labor force to to back up the tree department um which is basically um two people at this point it's tough to find everybody with the licenses so it's it's one man and we supplement the other labor of peace with cemetery
6:06manpower so we're looking at trying to do something like that where we can beef that up obviously that'll be part of the budget discussion something else to keep in mind too i mean there's 673 stumps now 900 trees slated for removal so now you're pushing the 1500 mark if you know none of those trees we do coordinate uh sidewalk repair with tree removal whenever possible uh if our manpower and
6:29our crews are available at the same time the trees coming down we'll try to coordinate that so that we can take the tree and then um repair the sidewalk stump removal is a little bit more intel than taking a tree down you'd be surprised you come up to a decent sized tree it can come down pretty quick but that stump's a little bit more um entailed you've got to be really careful because you're working
6:48around the roots around the sidewalks people are around um does make a mess so the stump removal is a little bit more time consuming than actually taking down the tree which i think some people would be surprised at but that's the case and then obviously you see the cost so um and you know and even with the added man um you know how much of that can we actually get to
7:08uh and and you know we're working at it we put a plan together we're now actually working hand in hand um dpw tree department cemeteries to try to you know make it more fluid as far as from start to finish your product at the end is much better so our tree department mr perry is one man right now it's it's slated for two individuals but that second position requires some specific licenses a cdl
7:34poisoning and engineering license and and right now the current salary for that position it's tough to find somebody to take on those responses it's the salary here we got people leaving all the time to go to smaller communities making you know more money and doing less work i and i can't blame them for doing that i think any one of us would do the same well chris has actually taken some of
7:55the courses that we required of that second position so that's that's going to help us in in some of that um you know again you know he's he's been he's taking the average license too correct and you did that on your own or did the city pay for that the city paid for the class yes so we um we recently sent one of our members of the cemetery staff to get licensed for
8:21a 182c which is the backhoe and operating the bucket truck um so we're working on staffing um from the cemetery to move over and help in the trees but as a state are you asking for any more people in your budget this year we did put in the assistant forester position in the budget um that'll be part of the bigger discussion with the administration um but we're making we're making it work with the resources
8:48we have well thank you so much i'd like to keep updated on this and see how we're doing because if it doesn't seem like we're going fast enough what else can we do and come up with more ideas but i'll yield for now well thank you for all the information um and i just had a few more just to ask um are there any any areas of the city are you prior to prioritizing over others regarding
9:11this are there any more immediate needs for any removals whether it be tree or stumps so as chris said i mean we try to spread it out um you don't kind of want to centralize everything to one area we we could work you know just one end south end north end flint you know what what have you um but there are stumps everywhere so i think we kind of want to spread that out
9:32similar to what we try to do with the streets right you want to spread out what you have for funds across the city so all of the residents in all of the areas are getting a piece of it um but to chris's point that's a delicate balance because you want to keep that crew moving considering the money that you're spending so you want to kind of give them a a plotted out map to say
9:51this is where we want you to get to today so that you know it's as efficient as possible yeah so you do have some areas you want to try to hit but you try to keep it as far as spread out around the city so that way one area isn't getting government more attention than the other um any complaints as far as routes into the pipes or anything like that anywhere
10:09that we need to worry about yeah we get those a lot so we do get those uh complaints typically if there are roots in people's sewer system we can work with them to remove the tree if necessary for repairs typically the roots are not the cause of the damage if there's already cracks in those pipes that's when the roots get in but we work with residents when they call for for so are residents
10:34responsible when a route gets into a pipe or is it something that the city tries to take care of if it's their their pipe it's their response okay and i think you know i've had some conversations with people about that and just wanted to make sure because i i i say that but you know sometimes information gets amazing and something along that vein as well is and and this started years ago um
10:58when when these some of these trees were planted you'll see giant elms in sidewalks the tree wasn't intended for that kind of sidewalk when you put it in it was beautiful it was small now 30 years later it's causing havoc sidewalks are lifting pipes are being penetrated um so we work now where wherever we're going to plant the tree we make sure it's the correct species it's going to
11:18grow to a specific size so if there are power lines of overhead we'll make sure it's a tree that will only grow to a specific height so it's not getting into those power lines so we put um protocol in place to make sure that some of the problems we've had in the past don't continue to recur but we're still playing catch up with the trees that were planted some 30
11:36years ago and if there's a healthy tree you know we really don't want to take it down so we try to work around and repair the sidewalk around it if we can sometimes that's not possible but that's that's another thing that's on the table and my last question is the twenty thousand dollar grant what's the name of the grant and um is that in already or is that something that's coming in so we
11:54just executed it so we we can start the project it's a reimbursement grant so we have to have the money available we spend it um we submit to the state for uh reimbursement it's a it's a tree planting grant is it epa related it's more dcr dcr okay level um so the proposal for the grant was stump removal to prepare um tree planting locations so i meant to say dep by the way instead of
12:23saying all right cool so c c c e r right you said dc dc thank you so much on that that's great all right thank you guys i appreciate that and uh thank you for coming down can i make a motion to table absolutely and i second that motion absolutely thank you okay thank you thank you very much all right so item four is the last item on the agenda we have um
12:47the resolution from the for the committee on health environmental affairs to convene quarterly to review and discuss the water supply and water filtration plant adopted as amended on january 18 2022 can mr ferlin come down to the table prompt and ready to go good so um the purpose of this resolution the conversation it was actually i believe the last time we had this meeting mr terrio mentioned how the this
13:24committee used to meet regularly with representatives of the water board or whoever it was that could inform the public on the quality of water and during that discussion um council pereira added in because of the water you know because of the topic of the water filtration plant um being you know always discussed in here and there we wanted to make sure we had something steady that could be informative to the public
13:48regarding water quality and the conditions of the plant and its operation system so um with that i'd like to give you the floor at least for a little bit of a summary of what's going on and this was for me this resolution was based off of concerns around um i want to say it was september last year or so when we were informed of older buildings in the city uh with lead pipes um
14:15provide you know being you know being sort of being involved in this uh letting the water you know a little bit of a hysteria for a little while there but you you explained yourself and i just want to keep keep the city updated on that part as well to make sure we're just on top of this as much as we can yeah no thank you very much and uh mr terry i apologize that
14:34he's not here tonight he wasn't able to make it uh the last minute and uh so um just a little bit uh you know the water filtration plant um down the bottom of the hill on the edge of bedford street uh currently um are still having difficulties with filling staff within the water filtration plant we had two shift operators currently as well as the director we currently are having a interim director fill in
15:12for a on a part-time basis to assist with uh submission of all the required paperworks to dep and epa so that's that's kind of where we are with the filtration plant the distribution system uh is uh is moving forward we did have last year we had an action level exceedance of the lead within our within our water to homes with lead services so that was uh in exceedance we sampled
15:5269 sites throughout the city uh eight of those sites were above the action level exceedance eight i'm sorry eight eight okay of the 69 which put our 90th percentile one one thousandths of a pound per million above the action level uh so we've been working with the ep and epa in regards to that and trying to get back down within the reasonable levels um you know dep and epa has met with us multiple times
16:36we currently uh just received a n-o-n from epa in regards to the action-level exceedance a notice of non-compliance um so we're going to be moving forward uh you know i feel that the notice of non-compliance does not have uh does not uh have uh correct information in it uh i don't think that they were basing basing their assumptions correctly there was some question on some sampling
17:09that was supposed to be done which we've done that sampling and i have submitted it to dp so we'll be responding to that as as required by uh april 27th um so we'll be moving forward with that uh we are going to be doing another round of sampling coming up as uh now we will be on bi-annual sampling uh from the uh uh in regards to the lead um within uh
17:38the system so uh we'll be doing another 60 sites tier one sites which is a site that confirmed alleged service all the way from the main all the way into the house uh we'll be doing uh we we always have 60 sites available and then we have 10 reserve sites in case we don't get response from all those 60 sites so that's why last time we went into our reserve sites because
18:01we had some non-respondents on the initial 60 sites so we do that year-round we'll be doing it twice this coming year moving forward so i have um just a question regarding lead pipes just before we go into more of it um the replacements of lead piping in the city in general um are there other concerns around the city besides those 69 places um and those are those 69 places all privately owned or are there any public
18:36public properties that we're concerned about as well so you said eight of the 69 but i'm just curious if there's more lead piping yep outside of those 69. so over the past couple of months my staff has been uh we already had a lunch service inventory uh and i had my staff go through all of our records all 22 000 of our connection cards and pretty much scrub our database i wanted to make sure
19:01that we have the correct information moving forward my staff was just able to give me that information yesterday full-length services from the main all the way into a property uh we have about 770 and change of those partial ledge services which is from the prop near the property line into the house there's an additional about three thousand of those did you mention something and again i'm
19:31remembering off the off of last year's information but did you say that the city's been slowly progressing and replacing lead piping uh as the years have gone by yep so we've been under an aco a um administrative consent order from epa uh the initial one was issued in 1997 i believe it was um and then there was a revised one that was submitted in 2005.
19:59so we've been under the guidance of that aco and have been following the process of removing those the lead services our aco requires us to move the lead service from the main to near the property line and that has always counted as a removed led service um the uh so that's what we've been doing uh all of the phases of water main replacement and lead service removal that uh you know this council and um
20:29administ administrations have been supportive of have removed um you know probably the side from the main to the curb stop uh you know we've been able to remove over 2 300 of those uh and more than that so probably about 3 000 in total whether it be total or whether it be just the uh from the main to next to the curve stuff so we've been doing that process for the past 22 years
20:58and we'll be uh continuing that moving forward we're currently applying for a couple of grants there's a grant out from the epa wynn wiin is the acronym for web service removal so that would that would be a great plus if we were able to get that grant we're applying for another grant as well from epa to continue to update our lead inventory the next thing that we're going to have to do so one thing that
21:33that is also out there there is a revised lead in copper rule that was issued in december by epa so this is a more restrictive mandate of uh of lead within the drinking water system uh so there's a lot of changes most of the rule goes in effect in 2024 um but you have to start gearing up for those changes now to be able to uh to be able to meet that deadline and what type
22:04of pond it's and i'm sorry just i just want to ask a couple more questions what's up upon itself not we're not worried about contamination and what's upon itself this is strictly regarding homes that have the lead piping yeah homes have the lead piping uh so they have the lead service that comes into the house you know the other spot where you can get lead in your water it's not just from
22:25the lead surface it's from the piping within the house that has lead soda on the joints it's from the old brass fixtures so the the beautiful antique brass fixture lead is used when brass is made so that fixture has lead in it so it's not just the lead service that feeds into the house so that's always the tough thing you know we're being mandated by the federal government to remove lead services but there still
22:56is other points of contact within the house that is well beyond the public drinking water supply that water can't come in contact with with lead but yes uh drink our supply water does not have any any of those contaminants in it um i i'm going to give the floor to uh to uh council prayer here yeah but i just have a couple of questions uh you just talked about you know
23:21there's other supplies and it could be the soldering that was used on pipes that has leads explode etc but if you let the water run for a little while that you don't get any trace of any lead yeah it would run correct you know and what's amazing looking at and talking to different people about water quality they have all these chemicals that they want us to put in our water that the government mandates the state
23:46mandates you do it and some of it we don't even need because we have really good water so we're wasting money because they're telling us to put these additional chemicals in that if you test our water i don't believe that we need them but we don't have a choice um if you said we've started to do this at the administrative consent order since 2005 in 17 years how many of these services have we changed or
24:13done something with do you know uh so we've done roughly about 4 000 we've done the lead service from the main to near the curb stop about 4 000 in 17 years it's going to take forever to get stuff done i mean i think we need to look at where the priorities are and water is everything and i don't think that we really look at the water department as a priority when you can't even get
24:40enough individuals to work at that filtration plant there's now two shift operators and an interim director was that somebody from within uh the interim director yeah uh mr sullivan oh terry yes the interim director and he can only work so much for the water department because he's retired correct and unless you raise people's salaries they're gonna leave if they can get eight thousand dollars ten thousand
25:06dollars more somewhere else they're gonna leave and how many i mean you have had people leave and that's the very reason without it yeah without a doubt you know just to touch on a couple of those things um you know the chemicals that we do at some of them are required and some of them are required by um you know like carbon dioxide is an alkalinity buffer that we use uh and that's to maintain
25:31our ph um for corrosion control within the system so some stuff yes it's mandated that we have to use other states or other areas of the country may not have those same requirements guidelines underneath dep because they have privacy in the state of massachusetts requires those the uh these salaries just to touch on those you know again that is something that's uh water and sewer is uh is something
26:00that's very very troubling you know right now everything throughout the whole entire uh job market housing market everything everything's pretty volatile and it's moving continuously moving and it's moving in an upward pattern you know we have lost some employees because of uh because of our rates without a doubt we've lost we've lost some past employees we've done some corrections
26:26we've been able to bring some back um but we do have uh with our non-union employees we have the ceiling of our ordinances back we were in front of the i was in front of the ordinance committee i believe it was about three or four months ago might have been more than that i forget but uh you know i had proposed ordinances within there to adjust those salaries um to try to bring in qualified people
26:51to fill those positions um and you know the council didn't take up the ordinances they said to come back one at a time i think it's time that you know i've actually been talking about putting together a package to come back for water and sewage so that we can get to a comparable rate and i don't think it was just water and sewer the ordinances that needed to change because when people get their cola their
27:15cost of living increases and the directors get that as well they're not in compliance with the ordinances so they have to be in compliance and that that sat here all year last year which should never have happened in my opinion i thought that they should have moved forward but then they took one the last ordinance committee meeting that i was a member of they took one for a position that was coming in and
27:41moved that one but didn't move for anybody else and that that's a problem because now again come june you have you know these cola increases and you're going to have a number of people that the ordinance doesn't speak to that um i i really feel for you with knowing how difficult it is you had the same problems years back or not you but we have the same problems years back with the sewer department and
28:06then we ended up going private with them now it's not the same company that we had they were brought over by suez or something have you ever thought about that for the water department side is it too costly water department side is something that you know contract ops has always been in our mind and we've we've uh talked about it multiple multiple times over the years you know most recently uh
28:29you know to be a hundred percent honest i did look at contract ops when we when we just had our most recent issues uh the uh the cost difference from what it cost us to run our plants to um what what i believe contract ops would be was a substantial increase is it a substantial increase based on the salaries of the existing employees and the number of employees but if those people were paid
28:54what the market calls for and you had enough people you know working there um would the cost be that different it's not only that uh any company that's doing a contract up situation is coming in they're looking at a profit as well you know it's so that that's a cost increase um you know you do get it get advantages with the contract up you know uh down at our wastewater plant we've
29:20had contract ups for probably 40 years now as as you mentioned um you know we bid it out every 10 years uh that contract but they take the person that we one of the stipulations was that they hire the people that worked at the sewer department that they continued with their employment and they paid for the retirement and they paid for the medical insurance and they paid for the salary
29:44so if you add that all up together it was feasible to do that at that point in time um i would just i would just wonder how feasible it would be if you looked at look i only have x amount of people but i should be up to here with people and they should be making this amount of money you know and then factor in what their holiday pays are or benefits package
30:10insurance and that and see if it would be feasible because if it's if it's way out of range now usually when somebody applies for a contract you know for so many years the first years are lower and then they go up so if it's higher already then then it would just you might be right yeah it's not something that's feasible but at least i think we need to look at
30:33paying people the amount of money to be there water is something that you know every single homeowner every business in the city uses and that needs to be a priority in my opinion it needs to be a priority to the city to make sure that that is maintained yeah it's a lifeblood utility you know for the city of fall river without without water without electricity without gas where would the city of fall river be
31:02you know and if we're getting administrative consent orders we're getting notices of non-compliance or whatever you know and we're getting brought down um to adequate or conditional to dropped inaudible to conditional and they specifically say you're conditional because of your staffing because of your finances because the state says that every or dep or whomever says that every few years every five years you should
31:32raise water rates by five dollars and or they say that you can give people smaller increases as we go along but every time we try to get an increase nobody wants to pay the increase but god forbid our water turns bad then everybody will be complaining that we didn't do what we should have done i feel you're in a hot situation either way yeah with without a doubt you know um as
32:01as you all know you know coming down here asking for a rate increase or any type of uh change within our budget is isn't something that anybody wants to do all of us would love to be able to provide the same services for the same rate but you look from year to year the increases you know the fixed cost increases that occur uh i can tell you this year within this
32:22year's budget chemicals are going to be of talk um to say the least you know they were increased within the budgeted amount and um they the increase didn't come close to what i think the increase was going to be so i hate to say coven but a lot of these factories that produce the chemicals if they had people that were out with covet and they had to quarantine for x amount of days and
32:52somebody else caught it then they produced less so they produce less now they charge you more for it the fluoride was crazy we couldn't even get that yeah yeah fluoride was trading sodium sodium hypochlorite um which is essentially bleach um you know everybody knows about uh anybody who had a pool last year knew about the shortage with trying to get the uh you know the chlorine for their pool um you know and that was
33:19that's a direct impact into our chemical supply this year um you know it's uh that market has gone has gone crazy um you know some of the other chemicals out there uh and again yeah you know people keep on saying well everybody's blaming this coving but it's it's this weird bubble that keeps on moving with the covert you know the the shutdown in people closing down their plants or
33:44you know not producing as much two years ago is now starting to affect the market in a look in a big way you know i was just talking with some of my contractors for uh water projects that we're looking to do this year and pipe i've heard is four months out three to four months out so if somebody orders pipe today they're not going to see it till halfway through the summer you know so
34:12you know you're talking of all the contractors for that are doing water main replacement all put the pipe you know when they get awarded contracts and they put their pipe orders in in june they're not going to see their pipes till december you know which so they're not going to it and so now how does how does a contractor plan to bid on a project like that knowing that they're not going to be able to get
34:35stuck construction for six months so they're gonna have to inflate their costs to be able to accommodate that that carrying cost and everything so um you know and i as i said i think right now markets are uh so volatile um you know in in this country and everything that's uh happening overseas is affecting that as well so we we did have rate increases we did have water and sewer rate increases
35:03but we increased the rate halfway through the year so it was first six months it was that he didn't he got off the money to fill that void but it was that gap where we were going back and forth for a little while yeah we transferred from free free cash to fill that point they had to transfer so we took free cash out instead of passing and that affected the salary situation
35:26or effect the personnel situation at the plant as well you know and i mentioned this last year through the budget process a bunch of times i think the whole entire long drawn-out process that that did occur uh affects morale overall um you know which plays into if somebody's here and they're they're happy working in fall river and we have a lot of excellent employees that are devoted to the city that like
35:52working for the city that's why they're here and they could be making maybe a couple dollars more somewhere else but they stay with fall river because they like the city but if they know that their future is in such flux and then there's such a pay difference to another community that's that's what might put them over to the over the edge to looking somewhere else so i think it was great that the chairman
36:20scheduled this together so that you i feel bad mr terrio's not here but to kind of give the public an eye on what's going on with it i think that's great and to have it quarterly like we're talking about before we do need that we do need this information to the public um just just one last piece on that so if if you if you present to the to you know to the city council
36:43the water rates and they vote no let's say they vote no do you continue your operation or do you have the plans to bring it back to the city council for because it feels like we shouldn't have to go through that six-month process if we know what we have going forward then this is what we have going forward so the enterprise funds how they work uh underneath the massachusetts general law so enterprise funds uh
37:11the council approves the uh the budget um for you know for the uh for the department if the rates are not there to support the department enterprise funds need to be fully funded for mass general law so if they're not fully funded by their rates the unfunded amount gets turned over to the cherry sheet so put on to the general fund so the general fund so let's just say um you know so the budget is 100
37:45the of the revenue equals 95 then the general fund would have to pay the additional five dollars um to make up the difference but then again if you don't that happened in the trash department as well years back you know right that was all going on yeah exactly so for years the general fund subsidized the uh enterprise fund for sanitation um and so you can the general fund can subsidize an enterprise fund but you
38:16cannot use an enterprise fund to subsidize the general fund the only way you can take money from the general fund from an enterprise fund to the general fund is by indirect cost so supportive services that are provided by the general fund to those enterprise funds understood so um i'm sorry you still have the floor by the way no i you i'm sorry um so i think we got most of our
38:42questions um answered here so i'm gonna make the motion to table this discussion and sure motion to table yep second and all in favor aye aye so uh thank you for coming down thank you very much it's very likely we won't need to do this we were talking about yoka very likely going to have this conversation in june when we have the budget so we may or may not have to do this specific meeting because we'll
39:08be having this discussion again during the budget season so um motion to motion to adjourn adjourn thank you second all favorites
39:35you